Magnificent Foxface Lethargic in QT

[tundraguy1106]

Hey so I have a magnificent Foxface in my QT with a mimic tang and two Royal grammas. It’s currently day 28 of 30 days of copper power at 2.0. I’ve had zero issues with any fish up until last night. I noticed the Foxface wasn’t out at dinner time and was hiding behind the filter. I didn’t think anything of it just thought maybe it went to sleep a little early. So now today around 3 pm I go to feed the QT and he’s still in hiding. I bumped him out of his hiding spot and noticed rapid breathing and his clear dark camouflaged look. Maybe this was from me bumping him out of his spot or maybe it’s something else.

The only I’ve done over the passed few days was a water change and I made sure copper and salinity were matched. Maybe the water change it self spooked him. I dunno. I just checked ammonia which read 0 and nitrates which in My QT always run at 20-40. Any ideas on if I should be concerned. It seems the rapid breathing comes and goes, again maybe from me spooking him but he didn’t eat last night or this afternoon. Any ideas or suggestion would be great. I’ve added a picture and will upload a video shortly.

 

[tundraguy1106]

Foxface breathing in QT

youtube.com

 

[vetteguy53081]

Hey so I have a magnificent Foxface in my QT with a mimic tang and two Royal grammas. It’s currently day 28 of 30 days of copper power at 2.0. I’ve had zero issues with any fish up until last night. I noticed the Foxface wasn’t out at dinner time and was hiding behind the filter. I didn’t think anything of it just thought maybe it went to sleep a little early. So now today around 3 pm I go to feed the QT and he’s still in hiding. I bumped him out of his hiding spot and noticed rapid breathing and his clear dark camouflaged look. Maybe this was from me bumping him out of his spot or maybe it’s something else.

The only I’ve done over the passed few days was a water change and I made sure copper and salinity were matched. Maybe the water change it self spooked him. I dunno. I just checked ammonia which read 0 and nitrates which in My QT always run at 20-40. Any ideas on if I should be concerned. It seems the rapid breathing comes and goes, again maybe from me spooking him but he didn’t eat last night or this afternoon. Any ideas or suggestion would be great. I’ve added a picture and will upload a video shortly.

These are stress spots you see, but question is what test kit are you using and main concern is the copper. CopperPower recommendation is therapuetc level 2.5 for full 30 days and you may be short on treating any parasites if present. Increase oxygen with air stone and it may not be a bad isea to verify ammonia and nitrate readings by taking a good size water sample to a trusted LFS that does not use Api kits and see what readings they come up with and to compare with yours.

 

[AydenLincoln]

He’s most likely stressed in QT. As there’s no live rock etc.

 

[tundraguy1106]

These are stress spots you see, but question is what test kit are you using and main concern is the copper. CopperPower recommendation is therapuetc level 2.5 for full 30 days and you may be short on treating any parasites if present. Increase oxygen with air stone and it may not be a bad isea to verify ammonia and nitrate readings by taking a good size water sample to a trusted LFS that does not use Api kits and see what readings they come up with and to compare with yours.

I have an ammonia badge and yes I did use an API kit as that’s the only im minus kit I have. My display I use advanced kits but I don’t test ammonia. I added an air stone and I thought originally they said 1.75 for 30 days and then found some copper tolerant strains of disease and upped it to 2.0 CP. that’s what I’ve always done but for the full 30 not 14 and then tank transfer. He’s been fine up until the water change the other day.

 

[MnFish1]

Your copper dose is/has been a little low. The fish is obviously stressed by something - is there any fighting in the tank? Is there any other symptom present>. (spots, etc). Do you have adequate oxygenation?

 

[tundraguy1106]

He’s most likely stressed in QT. As there’s no live rock I have one piece of live rock and I run three bags of bio media. 1 in the hang on filter. 1. In the foam bubbling filter and 1 just thrown on the bottoms of the tank.

 

[MnFish1]

I have an ammonia badge and yes I did use an API kit as that’s the only im minus kit I have. My display I use advanced kits but I don’t test ammonia. I added an air stone and I thought originally they said 1.75 for 30 days and then found some copper tolerant strains of disease and upped it to 2.0 CP. that’s what I’ve always done but for the full 30 not 14 and then tank transfer. He’s been fine up until the water change the other day.

The API kits tend to be read high - not low (IME) - and per reported here - i.e. if the ammonia was 0.5 - I might suspect it. They do not tend to read 0. Additionally if you have an ammonia alert badge that confirms it - the likelihood that test kits are causing the issue (especially if other fish are fine) - is close to zero. I.e. I would not jump down the test kit rabbit hole. Instead look at what might be affecting one fish - but not the others in the same tank (i.e. a disease - or injury)

 

[tundraguy1106]

Your copper dose is/has been a little low. The fish is obviously stressed by something - is there any fighting in the tank? Is there any other symptom present>. (spots, etc). Do you have adequate oxygenation?

I have a hang on the back filter, a foam bubble filter and a power head pointed at the surface for surface agitation. I just added an additional battery operated bubbler.

 

[MnFish1]

I have a hang on the back filter, a foam bubble filter and a power head pointed at the surface for surface agitation. I just added an additional battery operated bubbler.

No carbon - correct? Also - curious where was the fish from - an LFS, internet, etc?

 

[tundraguy1106]

The API kits tend to be read high - not low (IME) - and per reported here - i.e. if the ammonia was 0.5 - I might suspect it. They do not tend to read 0. Additionally if you have an ammonia alert badge that confirms it - the likelihood that test kits are causing the issue (especially if other fish are fine) - is close to zero

It was the first color on the chart that yellow/green which said 0…. I’ve never had an ammonia issue in my QT. Always test if I lose something.

 

[tundraguy1106]

No carbon - correct? Also - curious where was the fish from - an LFS, internet, etc?

No carbon. The hang on filter has a sponge and biomedia in a bag. First two weeks I fed food dosed with focus and general cure.

 

[tundraguy1106]

No carbon - correct? Also - curious where was the fish from - an LFS, internet, etc?

LFS…. It’s been in the QT for over 40 days now…. It was the first added had to wait a week for the additional ones. Then started dosing CP up to 2.0 and has currently been at 2.0 for 28 days. This is the first issue I’ve had with this batch.

 

[vetteguy53081]

I have an ammonia badge and yes I did use an API kit as that’s the only im minus kit I have. My display I use advanced kits but I don’t test ammonia. I added an air stone and I thought originally they said 1.75 for 30 days and then found some copper tolerant strains of disease and upped it to 2.0 CP. that’s what I’ve always done but for the full 30 not 14 and then tank transfer. He’s been fine up until the water change the other day.

Water change may have reduced amount of coper but 2.0 is not enough and I still suggest to verify water readings with the fish showing labored breathing. In a quarantine, there is gnerally basic filtration and lack of bacteria and you want to monitor ammonia during treatment

 

[tundraguy1106]

Water change may have reduced amount of coper but 2.0 is not enough and I still suggest to verify water readings with the fish showing labored breathing. In a quarantine, there is gnerally basic filtration and lack of bacteria and you want to monitor ammonia during treatment

So bump the copper to 2.5 and then do an addition 30 days in copper? I could have sworn 2.0 was the target at 30 days.

 

[tundraguy1106]

I also use a hanna checker for my copper. I checked an hour after my water change and it was at 2.06 ppm.

 

[MnFish1]

So bump the copper to 2.5 and then do an addition 30 days in copper? I could have sworn 2.0 was the target at 30 days.

As @vetteguy53081 suggested - the range is supposed to be closer to 2.5. THOUGH 2.0 (if it never got below) - should be enough. The 2.5 gives the luxury that in case it drops for whatever reason, there is no issue. Additionally - there is some information that 2.5 approx. is more effective.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

So bump the copper to 2.5 and then do an addition 30 days in copper? I could have sworn 2.0 was the target at 30 days.

People have found that copper power needs to run at 2.5 to control velvet. That’s the same as coppersafe.
I looked at the video - the fish was breathing so shallowly I could barely see any gill movement.
If water quality has been ruled out, gill flukes can also cause rapid breathing. Are you planning to treat with prazipro?
Jay

 

[tundraguy1106]

People have found that copper power needs to run at 2.5 to control velvet. That’s the same as coppersafe.
I looked at the video - the fish was breathing so shallowly I could barely see any gill movement.
If water quality has been ruled out, gill flukes can also cause rapid breathing. Are you planning to treat with prazipro?
Jay

I can… I only have general cure on hand but usually waited till copper was done but now that copper is questionable I don’t really know what to do. Fresh water dip?

 

[tundraguy1106]

As @vetteguy53081 suggested - the range is supposed to be closer to 2.5. THOUGH 2.0 (if it never got below) - should be enough. The 2.5 gives the luxury that in case it drops for whatever reason, there is no issue. Additionally - there is some information that 2.5 approx. is more effective.

I can dose it up but then for how long should I keep it there?