Me again, water testing and I checked prior threads.

[DebraLV]

I took a water sample to my LFS today. My 8.5 gallon tank is new and cycling so the numbers were all fluctuating. The only think safe was my PH and salinity. My ammonia was as green as the Emerald City and my nitrates and nitrites were almost lethal. Needless to say, he would not sell me fish.

I purchased a 2 oz bottle of Dr. Tims One And Only. I only used two capfuls and my water goes back next week for a recheck.

Just 2 questions:

1) Do I need to keep the remainder of Dr. Tims refrigerated in case I need it for future? I noticed he pulled it out of a refrigerator.
2) I have ordered an API Master saltwater kit from Amazon. Once my tank is fully cycled with just 2 fish and skeleton coral and 20lb of pink fiji sand, how often should I test the water? I'm assuming every week after a 20% water change?

I just wanted to give props to all you members. I would like to say my LFS guy Josh was astonished at what I knew as a beginning reefer. I learned it all from you guys

 

[MarshallB]

Once you are cycled, you are cycled. You should not need to retest for ammonia. You will have to check nitrate periodically. If your nitrates are sky high then it is cycling. I would definitely do a large water change to get the nitrate down. Test ammonia every few days till it is 0. Do a big water change again, put in some more ammonia or food. Test again in a few more days then make sure you have 0 ammonia then you will be good to add a small fish or two.

You will not need Dr. Tims in the future, its best to keep dosing the rest of it daily. It wont hurt anything doing that.

Once the nitrogen cycle is in place you will not need to worry about ammonia again unless you add a bunch of fish at once.

 

[DebraLV]

Once you are cycled, you are cycled. You should not need to retest for ammonia. You will have to check nitrate periodically. If your nitrates are sky high then it is cycling. I would definitely do a large water change to get the nitrate down. Test ammonia every few days till it is 0. Do a big water change again, put in some more ammonia or food. Test again in a few more days then make sure you have 0 ammonia then you will be good to add a small fish or two.

You will not need Dr. Tims in the future, its best to keep dosing the rest of it daily. It wont hurt anything doing that.

Once the nitrogen cycle is in place you will not need to worry about ammonia again unless you add a bunch of fish at once.

Thanks so much! That just might save me 40.00 on the master test kit and I can stick with just strips testing weekly once ammonia is gone and cycling complete. I will finish up the bottle of Dr. Tims daily until gone.

I thought I had read on here that to NOT do water changes until cycling is complete and nitrates/nitrites are still high? I might be wrong.

Thanks again! I only plan on two fish, it's a pequito tank!

 

[MarshallB]

Thanks so much! That just might save me 40.00 on the master test kit and I can stick with just strips testing weekly once ammonia is gone and cycling complete. I will finish up the bottle of Dr. Tims daily until gone.

I thought I had read on here that to NOT do water changes until cycling is complete and nitrates/nitrites are still high? I might be wrong.

Thanks again! I only plan on two fish, it's a pequito tank!

Save your money on that test kit. I used it when I first started and it just isn't worth the money. For nitrate testing i suggest the Nyos test kit. It's easy and reliable. Test strips will do just fine for now until you decide to start putting in corals and need to get more accurate numbers.

If your nitrates are really that high ( say over 50ppm ) then definitely do a water change. Since you have left over doctor tims just add some after a big water change. If you have ammonia in the water before the water change, you will still have some in it after. The vast majority of your good bateria is going to reside on your rock, sand, and glass. Anything removed from the water column wont really be enough to have any impact.

 

[Gedxin]

Cancel the API saltwater test order. They're notoriously inaccurate.

Get yourself a red sea kit, or salifert, or Hanna (for alkalinity) if you can afford it.

 

[Gtinnel]

First off good for the lfs for not selling you a fish if your tank wasn't ready, too many stores only care about making the sale.

Are you adding a source of ammonia? If you have really high nitrates that means that the bacteria in your tank has processed ammonia into nitrite and then nitrate. Usually during a cycle you won't see all 3 high at the same time. Ammonia will peak and then go down while nitrite rises, then nitrite will drop off as nitrate rises. Unless, you keep adding larger amounts of ammonia, then just ignore everything I just said.

I agree you shouldn't get the API test kit. There are much better options for not too much more, plus like mentioned once cycled you won't need ammonia or nitrite anymore. Of those 4 tests the only one you will need regularly is nitrate and there are much better options. I personally use salifert, but I also just ordered the Hanna HR after hearing great reviews of it.

 

[LuizW13]

I agree with the above recommendations- don't buy that test kit. I only used ammonia and nitrite tests ONCE when I cycled, and it didn't even show any readings- waste of money.

 

[Cell]

Nitrites are not lethal to marine fish and nitrates cannot be measured in the presence on nitrite. If your LFS does not know this, take their advice with a grain of salt because they are not cycling experts.

 

[DebraLV]

Nitrites are not lethal to marine fish and nitrates cannot be measured in the presence on nitrite. If your LFS does not know this, take their advice with a grain of salt because they are not cycling experts.

I should correct myself Cell, he said the ammonia was lethal. It turned the most deadliest shade of green in about 2 seconds. I watched.

 

[brandon429]

Here is how to make this reef work by an exact date given current arrangement

on august 26th change out all your water for new sw


its cycled and can’t not be cycled given the current details. What your tests read on that date doesn’t matter, they’re not seneye tuned digital so throwing darts is about as accurate. We know the completion date by two means: the known work time for dr tims and the ammonia reference line from a cycling chart.

for your tank not to be ready by then would mean we can find a cycling chart where ammonia hasn’t dropped down by day ten, and we can’t. We can only find non seneye testing saying that and or folks adding so much initial ammonia we wouldn't expect it to clear for sixty days, though they're paying for a speedy start.


you are doing the full water change to export wastewater and what’s left are working bioslick filters afforded by bottle bac and being wet ten days. New saltwater couldn’t possibly be too high in ammonia or nitrite or nitrate, we do that to save you wrestling cheap test kits into allowing a start. If your reef had been invited to setup at Macna fully stocked, on the 26th, this is how folks meet those deadlines in a timely manner. They prepare cycled rocks ahead of time and move the rocks over to the convention on the known completion date, for thirty years now.


you don’t need to buy any cycling test kits, your completion date is more reliable don’t waste money on them now. Send any purchases for ammonia and nitrite right back, don’t keep.

 

[brandon429]

100% Water Change

So in my previous thread, I had an ammonia issue that was out of hand. As suggested, I did a 100% WC and now i’m wondering when I should start adding fish back. If anyone has suggestions, let me know!

www.reef2reef.com

that is an exact copy to your tank's seeming cycle issue. its ready after the full water change

neat trick right/the timely testless cycle start trick.

here's how that thread above summarizes: my cycle is stuck at 8 ppm can't process ammonia

-changes all the water

-refills, adds reef life, we track it out a year to find fish disease was the real challenge not ammonia control.

 

[DebraLV]

Here is how to make this reef work by an exact date given current arrangement

on august 26th change out all your water for new sw


its cycled and can’t not be cycled given the current details. What your tests read on that date doesn’t matter, they’re not seneye tuned digital so throwing darts is about as accurate. We know the completion date by two means: the known work time for dr tims and the ammonia reference line from a cycling chart.

for your tank not to be ready by then would mean we can find a cycling chart where ammonia hasn’t dropped down by day ten, and we can’t. We can only find non seneye testing saying that and or folks adding so much initial ammonia we wouldn't expect it to clear for sixty days, though they're paying for a speedy start.


you are doing the full water change to export wastewater and what’s left are working bioslick filters afforded by bottle bac and being wet ten days. New saltwater couldn’t possibly be too high in ammonia or nitrite or nitrate, we do that to save you wrestling cheap test kits into allowing a start. If your reef had been invited to setup at Macna fully stocked, on the 26th, this is how folks meet those deadlines in a timely manner. They prepare cycled rocks ahead of time and move the rocks over to the convention on the known completion date, for thirty years now.


you don’t need to buy any cycling test kits, your completion date is more reliable don’t waste money on them now. Send any purchases for ammonia and nitrite right back, don’t keep.

Here is how to make this reef work by an exact date given current arrangement

on august 26th change out all your water for new sw


its cycled and can’t not be cycled given the current details. What your tests read on that date doesn’t matter, they’re not seneye tuned digital so throwing darts is about as accurate. We know the completion date by two means: the known work time for dr tims and the ammonia reference line from a cycling chart.

for your tank not to be ready by then would mean we can find a cycling chart where ammonia hasn’t dropped down by day ten, and we can’t. We can only find non seneye testing saying that and or folks adding so much initial ammonia we wouldn't expect it to clear for sixty days, though they're paying for a speedy start.


you are doing the full water change to export wastewater and what’s left are working bioslick filters afforded by bottle bac and being wet ten days. New saltwater couldn’t possibly be too high in ammonia or nitrite or nitrate, we do that to save you wrestling cheap test kits into allowing a start. If your reef had been invited to setup at Macna fully stocked, on the 26th, this is how folks meet those deadlines in a timely manner. They prepare cycled rocks ahead of time and move the rocks over to the convention on the known completion date, for thirty years now.


you don’t need to buy any cycling test kits, your completion date is more reliable don’t waste money on them now. Send any purchases for ammonia and nitrite right back, don’t keep.

Here is how to make this reef work by an exact date given current arrangement

on august 26th change out all your water for new sw


its cycled and can’t not be cycled given the current details. What your tests read on that date doesn’t matter, they’re not seneye tuned digital so throwing darts is about as accurate. We know the completion date by two means: the known work time for dr tims and the ammonia reference line from a cycling chart.

for your tank not to be ready by then would mean we can find a cycling chart where ammonia hasn’t dropped down by day ten, and we can’t. We can only find non seneye testing saying that and or folks adding so much initial ammonia we wouldn't expect it to clear for sixty days, though they're paying for a speedy start.


you are doing the full water change to export wastewater and what’s left are working bioslick filters afforded by bottle bac and being wet ten days. New saltwater couldn’t possibly be too high in ammonia or nitrite or nitrate, we do that to save you wrestling cheap test kits into allowing a start. If your reef had been invited to setup at Macna fully stocked, on the 26th, this is how folks meet those deadlines in a timely manner. They prepare cycled rocks ahead of time and move the rocks over to the convention on the known completion date, for thirty years now.


you don’t need to buy any cycling test kits, your completion date is more reliable don’t waste money on them now. Send any purchases for ammonia and nitrite right back, don’t keep.

Thanks Brandon. I'm trying to understand your reply in my mediocre reefing experience.

So basically what I am to do is....do a full WC on August 26th with fresh salt and then start the process all over, no matter what my ammonia levels are? I'm not quite understanding what bioslick filters afforded by bottle bac means.

 

[lapin]

So here the prob what brandon speak means.
He says do a complete water change on AUG 26
The bacteria you added with Dr Tims is now populating the rock where it lives.
By doing a water change you are removing any ammonia left in the water along with nitrates and nitrites.
You are getting a cycled tank with new water.
Just add critters

 

[DebraLV]

Thanks Brandon. I'm trying to understand your reply in my mediocre reefing experience.

So basically what I am to do is....do a full WC on August 26th with fresh salt and then start the process all over, no matter what my ammonia levels are? I'm not quite understanding what bioslick filters afforded by bottle bac are.

So here the prob what brandon speak means.
He says do a complete water change on AUG 26
The bacteria you added with Dr Tims is now populating the rock where it lives.
By doing a water change you are removing any ammonia left in the water along with nitrates and nitrites.
You are getting a cycled tank with new water.
Just add critters

Got it and marking my calender for the 26th.

 

[brandon429]

'So here the prob what brandon speak means'

I resemble that dialect


also the fish disease portion, can't skim only the good parts heh

that comes by month eight.

 

[DebraLV]

I agree with the above recommendations- don't buy that test kit. I only used ammonia and nitrite tests ONCE when I cycled, and it didn't even show any readings- waste of money.

I just have one more question and I won't bug anymore. You guys have been super helpful.

My 8.5 gallon has LED lights built into the lid. 9 LED lights. I have no idea of the wattage. I've noticed in the photos on here that overhead lighting on a stand is mostly used. Will the lights I have be sufficient enough for fish, I'm not doing coral. Also how long do I leave the light on during the day? I leave my 29 tropical gallon tank on 12 hours as it is heavily planted.

 

[SteveEreef]

Since you don’t have coral the lights are really just for your viewing pleasure. If you want them on 12 hours thats fine.

 

[DebraLV]

I did test my tank today. I used my sisters API test kit. It's a dual kit with a high Ph solution tester for marine tanks.
My ammonia is slowly coming down. I'm on day 3 of Dr. Tim's One and Only. Ammonia is at a shade of mint green compared to 3 days ago where it was the greenest ammonia could get. My nitrites are at amost -0- but my nitrates are at about 5 ppm. I have nothing in the tank but 2 lbs of skeleton coral and Caribsea sand (20 lbs). I have a lb of live rock on the way.

My question is if my ammonia comes down to -0- on Aug 26th and all perimeters are within range, do I still have to dump the tank and if so, do I leave the live rock and sand in?

Sorry to be so needy but I'm dying to put a couple of yellow tail damsels in

 

[brandon429]

the start date given to you had nothing to do with how api might read on that day, forego the option its better to wait for api to clear.


stay with testing instead of specific start date science since it’s the most common way, wait till your test vial is this yellow:

you would wait as long as it takes for api ammonia to turn that yellow, then can begin. Forget the idea of blending your tests with the prior date, these are exclusionary methods they don’t mix. Revert back to open ended api wait. When your test vial is that yellow, you have no ammonia and can begin.

 

[DebraLV]

the start date given to you had nothing to do with how api might read on that day, forego the option it’s too confusing.


stay with testing instead of specific start date science since it’s the most common way, you aren’t allowed to add any fish until your test vial is this yellow:

you would wait as long as it takes for api ammonia to turn that yellow, then can begin. Forget the idea of blending your tests with the prior date, these are exclusionary methods they don’t mix. Revert back to open ended api wait. When your test vial is that yellow, you have no ammonia and can begin.

Thanks very much. Today my ammonia was a bit lighter then .50 ppm. I guess Dr. TIm's One and Only is doing it's work. I really appreciate all of your help. The tank was set up a little over a week ago.