Meet Our Expanding Family of Plankton

Discussion in 'Reef Nutrition' started by Reef Nutrition, Jul 12, 2017.

  1. Reef Nutrition

    Reef Nutrition Well-Known Member R2R Supporter Gold Sponsor

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    Your plan sounds good. One thing that I would recommend is that the Oyster-Feast have it's own feed line. That product is more acidic and can cause problems with stability in the other more basic products. I would be worried about combining it with the others. Small amounts, multiple times daily is absolutely the best thing you can do! I would cut all of our lowest feed recommendations by 75% and go from there. See how your tank responds and increase the dosage from there. Sound like a plan?

    Chad
     
    Last edited: Oct 31, 2017
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  2. clsanchez77

    clsanchez77 Active Member Louisiana Reef Club

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    Sounds good, thanks! I was actually going to start at 40ml daily, which I think is a little more than the minimums, but Im basing that off what I feed now in frozen. Your products have a higher water content so its a little less food. I will still feed the fish some kind of larger frozen food. If I had to pick a favorite, it would be the San Fransisco Bay Brand Plankton Krill. Not to endorse a competitor, but I think my carnivorous fish would like a meaty treat. The nice thing is now me feeding the tank is supplemental/optional and not a twice daily chore.

    As far as dedicated feeders go, that will be a tough setup but I will add it to my list. I plan to do one for all right now, but what I will do based on your feed back is keep the mixing to just daily portions and then dilute with RO/DI water. I did plan for a dedicated phyto line eventually. I guess a mother dedicated line for Oyster Feast can be in order too. The food will be fed off BRS 1.1 ml losers but I also planned to feed a 1/4" carrier line with a 50 ml doser (unless I can manifold it off the pump). This will allow me to keep the feed lines shorter and reduce the time the food spends outside the fridge. The dosers won't fit inside this fridge and its the biggest I can accommodate.
     
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  3. Reef Nutrition

    Reef Nutrition Well-Known Member R2R Supporter Gold Sponsor

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    Keep me posted. I'll bring the popcorn! LOL

    Chad
     
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  4. bh750

    bh750 Active Member

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    Hi Chad,
    I'm back with more questions :) We discussed back in July and I think I'm ready for the next step. I have a 220g display tank with lots of fish and just now starting to stock corals. Right now have 2 GBTA, 1 ricordea, couple Palys and Zooas (I think came on some rock from a fellow reefers). I just purchased my first real coral, a nice Frogspawn with lots of heads. I plan to stock my tank mostly with soft corals, LPS, Zoos. Looks awesome. Also just as importantly I built out a dedicated refugium to provide zooplankton to the display. It consists of 4 x 10 gallon tanks plumbed together in sequence. Two of them are now full of macro algae and teeming with tons of life - copepods, amphipods, mysis, worms. Its turning out to be one of my favorite parts of my system!!

    So, I'd like to 1) feed corals 2) keep growing out my refugium and keep it full of zoo plankton to feed my display and 3) just keep overall balance of micro life in my entire system.

    What would you recommend? I saw the great chart on the previous page and the calculator. Seems like the oyster feed might be the one that would cover most things? or a combo of that and phyto?

    Also how much would I need? I had been thinking of culturing my own phyto but hoping I can afford just buying it from the pros! I thought I read somewhere that Reed has a commercial, concentrated version of phyto for like $75 that I can keep frozen and last a long time?

    thanks for all of your insight and education!

    Bryan
     
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  5. Reef Nutrition

    Reef Nutrition Well-Known Member R2R Supporter Gold Sponsor

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    @bh750! Good to hear from you. Oyster-Feast and Phyto-Feast would be the perfect products for your tank and proposed animals. These 2 products contain a wide variety of nutrition, and the particle size is great for many filter feeding inverts. Both feeds can be broadcast fed to the tank simultaneously. Putting the tank on feed-mode for 20-30 minutes is a good way for your animals to consume the food before the filters do. :) You can also target feed these two products to colonies. Some people will turn off the skimmer, add the food to the refugium and allow it to make its way into the display; this way, the zooplankton in the refugium will get a good dose of food, keeping them reproducing.

    You should start off with our 16oz. bottles and see how long they last. Expiration dates are on the products. Roughly 6 months for each product. Our blends that can be frozen are specifically for aquaculture, so they shouldn't be used in a reef tank. Ask your retailer about the larger sizes. If you go through the 16oz bottles long before expiration, then I would suggest buying the 32oz. sizes.

    Our Phyto-Feast contains 6 different species of micro algae, so the diversity is immense. Imagine culturing 6 species by yourself and doing it consistently; it's something that people don't want to deal with. Keep in mind that our products are very concentrated, so be conservative and continue to follow aquarium husbandry guidelines.

    Here are the pages with information on these two products: http://reefnutrition.com/phyto_feast.php & http://reefnutrition.com/oyster_feast.php

    If you have any more questions, don't hesitate to ask!

    Chad
     
  6. bh750

    bh750 Active Member

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    Great, thanks! I'll give them both a try in low doses first. I used the calculator and it said anywhere between 2-11 teaspoons per day for a tank my size! Thats fully stocked I'm sure but sounds like alot and not sure the budget could afford that. So will try lower doses. thanks!!!
     
  7. Reef Nutrition

    Reef Nutrition Well-Known Member R2R Supporter Gold Sponsor

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    Yes. Start off at a much lower dose or do the recommended dose 2-3 times a week. Play it by ear and use what makes sense for your system. All reef tanks are different. :)

    Thanks so much for giving us a try. Let me know how things go and post tank pics as often as you like!

    Regards,
    Chad
     
  8. bh750

    bh750 Active Member

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    OK will do. Also...

    Just curious as to why they shouldnt be used? seems nice to have a concentrated solution that can be frozen.
     
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  9. Reef Nutrition

    Reef Nutrition Well-Known Member R2R Supporter Gold Sponsor

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    The aquaculture products don't have the same species composition. They were designed for specific purposes, while products like SDaquarist and Phyto-Feast were built to be all-purpose feeds since we never know what kind of animals will be in any given reef tank. Out of all our products, these two contain the most variety of micro algal species . Also, some of the species in these two blends can't be frozen, so to keep them stable, we apply refrigeration. I hope this makes sense and I'm sorry we don't currently have an all purpose blend that can be frozen for long-term storage. It's definitely something we are working on.

    Chad
     
  10. Rakie

    Rakie Federal Coral Reserve R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award SCMAS Member Build Thread Contributor

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    I don't use your calculator, but here's how I feed with various products (including yours) in a 45g cube.

    My Food Mix (Glass Jar)
    - 2 cubes Hikari Mysis
    - 2 cubes Hikari spirulina brine
    - 6ml Reef Nutrition Arcti-Pods
    - 1TSP Reef Nutrition TDO Chroma Boost (Crushed)
    - 1/4 TSP PE Mysis 1ml Pellets
    - 1/4 TSP v20 pellets (hair larger than PE pellets)
    - 1/2 TSP BRS Reef Chili
    Supplements
    - 0.25ml Selcon
    - 1/2 'pump' SELCO Boost
    - 2-3 drops AquaForest FishV

    Feed
    - 2ml 3-6x per day

    This jar lasts about 3-4 days in the 'fridge.

    I like to overfeed the fish and make sure everything has plenty to munch on. The pure algae pellets in v20 make sure my fish have some roughage if they need it, and it makes sure there's something for the conch have something to munch on. All my fish love mysis and spirulina brine, my smaller fish especially love the RN Arcti-Pods.

    Slowly my fish are taking the TDO Chroma Boost, which is a first... The other pellets basically dissolve into my feed and stick around mysis/brine, kinda forcing them to take it -- But they will take the bits of TDO Chroma boost so long as it's been softened, soaked, and broken up a little smaller than medium size.

    I've tried every single pellet I could get my hands on. V20, New Life Spectrum, PE, Hikari, etc etc. Only one my fish even tried were TDO Chroma Boost. Eveything else floated by like it didn't exist and ends up as snail fodder.
     
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  11. DSC reef

    DSC reef Coral wasted R2R Supporter Reef Squad R2R Excellence Award Reef Tank 365 Build Thread Contributor

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    Loving the oyster feast and live phyto feast @Reef Nutrition, well the tank is anyway!
     
  12. jsker

    jsker Reefing is all about the adventure Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor Partner Member 2018

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    Here is how I do it link
     
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  13. Reef Nutrition

    Reef Nutrition Well-Known Member R2R Supporter Gold Sponsor

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    Very cool! Keep in mind that we have smaller versions of TDO so that you don't have to crush it. Here is a table:
    Screenshot-2017-10-31 Specialty Products.png

    Glad to see them taking the TDO. You can also soak the granules and pellets in our phytoplankton blend, Phyto-Feast, and some people are even soaking it in Oyster-Feast. Good stuff either way.

    Chad
     
  14. clsanchez77

    clsanchez77 Active Member Louisiana Reef Club

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    Hey Chad @Reef Nutrition, I just wanted to update this thread.

    So I developed a formula using various products, mixed a up a batch and threw it in a thermal fridge. Even with an ice pack, the fridge does not hold the product below 50F for very long, but this so far has not presented a problem. At the end of the week, the remaining food does not smell, well, repulsive I guess. I mean I would not eat it :D The product does not smell the same as "fresh" but certainly does not smell "spoiled".

    I have been doing this for since mid-August this year and the results are amazing.

    First, my chromis have stopped fighting and are displaying what I believe to be more natural shoaling behavior - I may now try to add more. Same for my gramma harem, but not as drastic as with the chromis. Other fish have not really demonstrated any changes. My Seaweed Blenny is the only fish to have figured out where the food comes from and now waits for it!

    Second, coral growth has been amazing. Now let me clarify my tank is only polyps, gorgonia and favia type LPS. Prior, my polyps and gorgonias were doing well and LPS was not receding with a few exceptions but no growth and some were losing color. I was getting ok PE at night, but nothing impressive. Now my gorgonias are displaying good growth, my previous receding LPSs have fully regrown their skeletons and all corals have exceptional PE at night. I am now getting good encrusting over the frag plugs and onto the rocks in most cases. LPS's higher in the tank with higher lighting exposure have now fully colored up.

    Third, I have had an explosion of feather dusters and other micro-fauna in the tank that I have been actively looking for but could never find.

    The setup was simple, thermoelectric car fridge (look for Uber fridge), a BRS 1.1 ml/min doser, some 1/4" tubing and a paycheck's worth of Reef Nutrition products :D. Tank is fed in 30-min intervals. I ran a 1/4" line off my return pump for a continuous supply of tank water, probably about 50-100 ml/min. The doser then pumps into this line via a 1/4" Tee for about 30 seconds every 30 minutes. Having the 1/4" loop ensures food does not stay in the 1/4" and rot while awaiting delivery to the tank. This also helps spread out the feeding as it enters the tank very diluted.

    My current recipe is:
    • Mysis-Feast, 6 ml daily
    • Acrti-Feast, 10 ml daily
    • Beta Brine, 12 ml daily
    • Real Ocean Eggs, 8 ml daily
    • Roti-Feast, 2 ml daily
    • Oyster-Feast, 1 ml daily
    • Phyto-Feast, 1 ml daily
    • Eco Reef Solution, 10 ml daily
    I get a total of 40 ml of food and 10 ml of Reef Solution. This is the only supplements to my tank, aside from kalkwasser and Seachem Reef Fusion. I mix up the batches in one bottle one week at a time.

    Parameter-wise, I maintain 0 on the nitrogen families but phosphates elevate quickly. The tank is maintained by the "Paletta" method, so skimmer on part-time and a small refugium with Miracle Mud. I grow both Caulerpa and Chaeto in the refugium and I cycle about 100 grams of GFO in a BRS mini-reactor monthly.

    In the tank, I am getting more caulerpa growth (spread from refugium I guess) but I have almost no hair algae or other nuisance algae. My coralline growth is now up and starting to take over the glass. I remove about a handfull of caulerpa weekly. I plan to add a molly miller blenny to help with this as I have no herbivores in my tank. Counter-intuitively, a seaweed blenny is not a herbivore. I also remove about 400 grams of chaeto from my refugium monthly - or half a buckets worth.

    The only major consequence noted so far was I lost all of my oysters/clams...all at the same time. Woke up one morning and found every single one on the sandbed and partially open and non-responsive. This was about a month ago I have no idea why. Two of them had corals encrusted and I'm having a hard time remounting them. Disappointing but I can't put this on the Reef Nutrition product. Rather something else happened, related or not. Perhaps they were living off the dirty water produced from thawing frozen food as I did not rinse. No other ideas really.

    So far Im very pleased with this.
     
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  15. Reef Nutrition

    Reef Nutrition Well-Known Member R2R Supporter Gold Sponsor

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    This is fantastic feedback. Thanks so much for being so thorough. Your fridge temperature scares me, but if you have been going this way since August without significant impact, then by all means keep it up. There are wine chillers that will cool down in the mid 30's. Here is what I use on my copepods: https://www.amazon.com/Vinotemp-One...=UTF8&qid=1512089076&sr=1-2&keywords=vinotemp. They are a little expensive but last a long time! I've had mine running for 2 years out in our greenhouse and they do great even in the summer when the temps get up over 100F. IMG_3552.JPG

    I have no idea what happened to your bivalves! Especially since nothing happened to your corals. Very odd. With the amount of food you are putting in they should have done fine. Especially when fed Phyto-Feast and Oyster-Feast.

    Can you make a video of the it feeding out? I would love to see your animals reacting to all that food.

    Chad
     
  16. vipete1985

    vipete1985 Member

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    Wow you feed that heavily?? How’s ur nitrates and phosphates? What are you using for nutrient export?
     
  17. Rakie

    Rakie Federal Coral Reserve R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award SCMAS Member Build Thread Contributor

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    My nitrates are 25, my phosphate is 0.08 -- Nutrient export is a skimmer.

    My LR and LS is very efficient.. My nutrients don't build up, and I've not had any algae's other than bryopsis which was introduced on a frag plug (don't be lazy!)
     
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  18. clsanchez77

    clsanchez77 Active Member Louisiana Reef Club

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    I thought about the wine cooler but didn't know how well one of your bottles would seal in there. An idea to play with next year for sure. On the bivalves, my only thought was they were living off "the rot" from un-rinsed, thawed, frozen food. Perhaps your food is just too clean! The way I developed the feeding formula, the majority of the food is arctipods and ocean eggs, both of which are likely too large. Not enough phyto I guess. Not sure where rotifers are in the oyster food chain.

    I feed 40 ml per day. I run a skimmer (Reef Octopus 150) for 6 hours a day around noon and otherwise I run a Miracle Mud style sump in a Trigger Emerald 34, lit by a DIY LED for 24/7. My nitrates remain at 0 but phosphate control does require GFO. I use 100 grams every 4-6 weeks.
     
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  19. Bryn

    Bryn Active Member R2R Supporter MTRCMember

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    I was looking for containers to hold Pods in and came across these that might help with keeping things cool, similar to the wine cooler from Walmart.



    [​IMG]

    and

    [​IMG]
     
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  20. Reef Nutrition

    Reef Nutrition Well-Known Member R2R Supporter Gold Sponsor

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    Great idea. You probably want to insulate them somehow to prolong the coolness.

    Chad
     
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