Mixed reef 50% corals 50% macro. Nitrates?

Maxout
OP
KonradTO

KonradTO

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Aug 11, 2021
Messages
200
Reaction score
99
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Germany
The different macros have different requirements. The beauty of algea based systems is quick change. If you have animals now then stop dosing. The algea growth will match the nutrients available. If you dose how long dose it take to reach 0? Is there any nitrate being produced? If your algea is healthy with proper lighting you could just add some hardy live stock. I believe you are on the right track. The animals will dose for you.
Since I have only one goby it's like having no N/P input. The tank it's small but it's teaming with life so everything I put in disappear within hours. If everything was doing well I would have not started dosing but plants started to bleach and stopped growing. Shortly after I started to have red algae problems. Now it's hard to tell if it was because of not enough nutrients or because I dosed. My guess is that by increasing micro+N+Fe but not P, I created a further inbalance in nutrients. But I am very new with this so could be anything. Would you suggest to ignore red algae and remove some macros? Or I just wait they die and rot and release stuff in water?
 
OP
KonradTO

KonradTO

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Aug 11, 2021
Messages
200
Reaction score
99
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Germany
One last thing. Put as much flow on the algea as you can without messing up stuff. Oxygenation is better at higher flows. Enough to keep the sand clean. The cyano will pass. RODI and your macro will fix it. No chemicals.
Yes the moment it could be the problem. I have very little flow, I need to get a wavemaker soon.
 

Duncan62

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Oct 4, 2021
Messages
245
Reaction score
166
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Kannapolis
One last thing. Put as much flow on the algea as you can without messing up stuff. Oxygenation is better at higher flows. Enough to keep the sand clean. The cyano will pass. RODI and your macro will fix it. No chemicals.

Yes the moment it could be the problem. I have very little flow, I need to get a wavemaker soon.
I'll bet if you're flow is slack increasing it will fix most of your problems. You'll be amazed. Even a cheap powerhead will help. I want to see a pic a couple months from now.
 

Duncan62

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Oct 4, 2021
Messages
245
Reaction score
166
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Kannapolis
Since I have only one goby it's like having no N/P input. The tank it's small but it's teaming with life so everything I put in disappear within hours. If everything was doing well I would have not started dosing but plants started to bleach and stopped growing. Shortly after I started to have red algae problems. Now it's hard to tell if it was because of not enough nutrients or because I dosed. My guess is that by increasing micro+N+Fe but not P, I created a further inbalance in nutrients. But I am very new with this so could be anything. Would you suggest to ignore red algae and remove some macros? Or I just wait they die and rot and release stuff in water?
Increase your bioload. Get some gsp and a few damsels. Drop them in. Increase you nutrients with these guys.
 
A Piece of the Ocean for Every Reef Tank

inland_reef

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Jul 4, 2019
Messages
110
Reaction score
300
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Hey all. You can absolutely keep corals and macros together but understand they there will be issues when macros and corals come in proximity and/or touch. As everything is fighting to survive. OP love the tank and the idea. I see you’re from the EU area which is awesome cause there are some great macros that come from the Mediterranean. Looking at the macros you have in your tank, it’s predominantly Caulerpa sp. Caulerpa, although beautiful in its appearance and resemblance to seagrass, it grows quick and I mean quick. Usually starving tanks of nutrients as it’s using it’s ability of explosive growth to out compete it’s fellow inhabitants. I’m seeing a little bit of dinos appearing on one of your last pictures on the C. brachypus (the one with the small green blades). I’m assuming this is appearing to your issue at hand, low nutrients. It happens. If I were in your position trying to create this style of tank I would look to trim back heavily the Caulerpa and look to supplement with less demanding macros like Codium. Still green and actually has tons of specifies, some we still don’t know. They tend to grow much slower than the other green macros ive kept and with your addition of fish and regular feeding you will be able to sustain this type of environment. I agree with the other post about looking to move towards red macros vs greens but I will add that too many reds will deplete the iron concentration in your water and tend to make them bleach out so don’t go too crazy. Some of my favorites are Gracilaria hayi or G. mammilaris. Enjoy the setup! Good things never happen fast and look to get some cool fish in there. Some of my favorite fish for macro tanks are sailfin mollies. They love to pick at the fine filament algae growing on your lovely display algae. Just make sure you don’t have the flow ripping. They aren’t great swimmers.
 
OP
KonradTO

KonradTO

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Aug 11, 2021
Messages
200
Reaction score
99
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Germany
Increase your bioload. Get some gsp and a few damsels. Drop them in. Increase you nutrients with these guys.
I already have a stocking list, but saltwater is more expansive than planned I am planning to get some clowns in few weeks and a powerhead. For corals I have to wait and get a good light first
 
OP
KonradTO

KonradTO

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Aug 11, 2021
Messages
200
Reaction score
99
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Germany
Hey all. You can absolutely keep corals and macros together but understand they there will be issues when macros and corals come in proximity and/or touch. As everything is fighting to survive. OP love the tank and the idea. I see you’re from the EU area which is awesome cause there are some great macros that come from the Mediterranean. Looking at the macros you have in your tank, it’s predominantly Caulerpa sp. Caulerpa, although beautiful in its appearance and resemblance to seagrass, it grows quick and I mean quick. Usually starving tanks of nutrients as it’s using it’s ability of explosive growth to out compete it’s fellow inhabitants. I’m seeing a little bit of dinos appearing on one of your last pictures on the C. brachypus (the one with the small green blades). I’m assuming this is appearing to your issue at hand, low nutrients. It happens. If I were in your position trying to create this style of tank I would look to trim back heavily the Caulerpa and look to supplement with less demanding macros like Codium. Still green and actually has tons of specifies, some we still don’t know. They tend to grow much slower than the other green macros ive kept and with your addition of fish and regular feeding you will be able to sustain this type of environment. I agree with the other post about looking to move towards red macros vs greens but I will add that too many reds will deplete the iron concentration in your water and tend to make them bleach out so don’t go too crazy. Some of my favorites are Gracilaria hayi or G. mammilaris. Enjoy the setup! Good things never happen fast and look to get some cool fish in there. Some of my favorite fish for macro tanks are sailfin mollies. They love to pick at the fine filament algae growing on your lovely display algae. Just make sure you don’t have the flow ripping. They aren’t great swimmers.
Wow thanks for your input. Yes I noticed how fast caulerpa was when I left for a couple of weeks, left a tiny ball of leaves and found it HUGE covering the whole section of the corner.
Do you think the red slime on the rock is Dino as well? As I replied to Duncan62 I am planning to stock more soon with a couple of clowns and maybe a tailspot blenny. Then some demsels and a mate for my goby. But I still need to buy some pricey stuff (powerhead, light for corals, and THEN finally corals) so I was planning to do it slowly. I am realizing now that the idea of stocking slowly was not as good as I imagined.
Thanks for the ideas with the macros. Some stuff I have is actually coming from the Mediterranean directly. I am looking for some codium and some blue macro (can't remember the name) and gracilaria, but it seems that is harder here in EU to find macros.
 

Duncan62

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Oct 4, 2021
Messages
245
Reaction score
166
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Kannapolis
Wow thanks for your input. Yes I noticed how fast caulerpa was when I left for a couple of weeks, left a tiny ball of leaves and found it HUGE covering the whole section of the corner.
Do you think the red slime on the rock is Dino as well? As I replied to Duncan62 I am planning to stock more soon with a couple of clowns and maybe a tailspot blenny. Then some demsels and a mate for my goby. But I still need to buy some pricey stuff (powerhead, light for corals, and THEN finally corals) so I was planning to do it slowly. I am realizing now that the idea of stocking slowly was not as good as I imagined.
Thanks for the ideas with the macros. Some stuff I have is actually coming from the Mediterranean directly. I am looking for some codium and some blue macro (can't remember the name) and gracilaria, but it seems that is harder here in EU to find macros.
Get a cheap little powerhead asap. Believe me, I know about how expensive anything that says reef or coral on it. I make my scrubber tray and sump. I can't take full credit for the design. A guy from California sold me a scrubber in 1981 and I've made my own since then. Good luck. There's lots of " off brand" stuff that works great.
 
OP
KonradTO

KonradTO

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Aug 11, 2021
Messages
200
Reaction score
99
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Germany
Today I found my pistol shrimp dead and I started to panic there was something wrong with the nutrients or the algae that caused its death. I checked all parameters and nitrates seems to have doubled (now are between 10 and 20 ppm).
I was reading again all the thread to remember what did I do to the chemestry and I realized some says the red slime its dinos some says its cyano. Could any of the 2 have caused the death of the pistol shrimp?
maybe because of oxygen depletion?
Also its seems that there are 2 opposite approaches depending on which of the 2 you have. On another thread someone suggested to cut on nutrients, while many suggested to increase them. I have been told also to cut light.
I am confused. I am getting before the weekend a powehead to increase flow but as far as N&P I think I should stop dosing (even if P reaches 0?)
 
BRS
OP
KonradTO

KonradTO

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Aug 11, 2021
Messages
200
Reaction score
99
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Germany
Are you sure it wasn’t just a molt?
No unfortunately it was very dead. I really have no idea what could have caused it. it could be anything.
I added so much stuff to the tank (micro, N, P, iron) in the past week, plus all the algae problem. I added also a living black mussel few days ago (now its in another "tank") that could have had some disease. Or the shrimp might have been old.
 

Eagle_Steve

To many tanks!!!!!
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Jan 30, 2018
Messages
6,278
Reaction score
35,346
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Eagleville, TN
If you dump it all, you will kill your fish. That’s why Randy suggested using sodium nitrate. I have had 10K gallons of seaweed & live rock in cultivation. Ammonia is economical, but must be used carefully.

I use 1ml per every 10G of tank water. Apply in high flow area. In 25 yrs, I had one mishap when a fish swam to surface drip and liquid ammonia directly hit fish.
Little late, but I use this as well. Fully stocked macro tank, tied into a nem/ coral grow out system and fully stocked. Dose it multiple times a day and no issues.

E6C1D265-FC08-4984-824A-086645084749.jpeg
A5F65B4C-9B50-441F-90AA-D95F8C730205.jpeg
F275076E-77CF-4511-B140-2FD017D7710E.png
 

Subsea

2500 Club Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Jun 21, 2018
Messages
3,244
Reaction score
4,766
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Austin, Tx
No unfortunately it was very dead. I really have no idea what could have caused it. it could be anything.
I added so much stuff to the tank (micro, N, P, iron) in the past week, plus all the algae problem. I added also a living black mussel few days ago (now its in another "tank") that could have had some disease. Or the shrimp might have been old.
Not likely that a muscle parasite would effect a shrimp. If you have ornamental clams, I would not add wild grown mussels.
 

Coxey81

Well-Known Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Aug 25, 2021
Messages
698
Reaction score
1,414
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Huntsville
Hi all,
I am new to saltwater aquariums and I have been setting up my very first reef tank for a couple of months now.
I have an AIO fluval flex 32g whitout sump. As filtration system I have the original filter from the aquarium and an external filter on top of that, plus some 5-10 cm sand and live+dry rocks.
You can see how is set up my tank: one side corals one side macros.

369373.jpg

Now, I am planning to start stocking with corals in a month or so, but the problem is that no matter how much I feed the tank, I can't raise nitrates/phosphates higher than 0. I am under stocked with only one big watchman goby+pistol shrimp, a tiny hermit and a lot of snails and pods.
I am very undecided on how to proceed, if stocking more fish before corals would solve the problem or starting to dose nitrogen (which would make pointless my original idea to use macros to control nutrients) or even leaving it as it is. I would love to put some duncans/torches/zoas for now but I am worried that if I have 0 nitrates they will starve quickly.
Is anyone here with a similar setup? What do you suggest?


Do you have two lights? One of your macro side and one over your coral side?

If so, its my understanding you can "tune" you macro nutrient intake by adjusting light intensity and duration.

So if you have two lights you could try turning down or shortening on time for your macro side so it's not eating up all your nutrients.
 
Reef Chasers Aquaculture
OP
KonradTO

KonradTO

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Aug 11, 2021
Messages
200
Reaction score
99
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Germany
Do you have two lights? One of your macro side and one over your coral side?

If so, its my understanding you can "tune" you macro nutrient intake by adjusting light intensity and duration.

So if you have two lights you could try turning down or shortening on time for your macro side so it's not eating up all your nutrients.
Yes that's a good point. But as I stated above in the nuisance algae thread I have been told this is cyano and therefore I have to cut lights and reduce nutrients, while I get totally different feedback here. My idea on this is that I have actually a mix of Dino and cyano (so if I understood correctly the red stuff covering rocks is cyano while the filamentous algae on the caulerpa is Dino?) is this possible? In any case if I understood well cyano is better than Dino so in any case is better to keep nutrients higher rather than lower right?
 

Coxey81

Well-Known Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Aug 25, 2021
Messages
698
Reaction score
1,414
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Huntsville
Yes that's a good point. But as I stated above in the nuisance algae thread I have been told this is cyano and therefore I have to cut lights and reduce nutrients, while I get totally different feedback here. My idea on this is that I have actually a mix of Dino and cyano (so if I understood correctly the red stuff covering rocks is cyano while the filamentous algae on the caulerpa is Dino?) is this possible? In any case if I understood well cyano is better than Dino so in any case is better to keep nutrients higher rather than lower right?


Sorry, I had only read the original post.

As far as the Dino and cyano treatment I'll yield to others with more experience and knowledge.
 

Duncan62

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Oct 4, 2021
Messages
245
Reaction score
166
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Kannapolis
Today I found my pistol shrimp dead and I started to panic there was something wrong with the nutrients or the algae that caused its death. I checked all parameters and nitrates seems to have doubled (now are between 10 and 20 ppm).
I was reading again all the thread to remember what did I do to the chemestry and I realized some says the red slime its dinos some says its cyano. Could any of the 2 have caused the death of the pistol shrimp?
maybe because of oxygen depletion?
Also its seems that there are 2 opposite approaches depending on which of the 2 you have. On another thread someone suggested to cut on nutrients, while many suggested to increase them. I have been told also to cut light.
I am confused. I am getting before the weekend a powehead to increase flow but as far as N&P I think I should stop dosing (even if P reaches 0?)
 

inland_reef

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Jul 4, 2019
Messages
110
Reaction score
300
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
If your phosphates are low I would recommend continuing to dose especially because you have a genus of macro that tends to like to melt and release gametes if it gets really stressed (nutrient pour environment). You may not really be at zero as hobby grade test kits can have a small standard deviation in both directions. Dino’s tend to thrive in low nutrient environment or when there is an imbalance between nitrate and phosphates. at least that’s the common thought in the hobby. I had a terrible species that no matter how well balanced my tank was, my Dino’s wouldn’t disappear so it’s not always true. Cyano will most likely come and go usually with the season. I see it happen a ton from summer to fall and spring to summer. Flow will help as the person said above. Cyano is a bacteria so there is something that it is enjoying in your environment that it’s using to grow on your macros. By the way, not sure what kind of corals you’re going to keep, but I’m using a twinstar freshwater planted tank led over my mix coral and macro tank. Has grown corals really well even sps and I enjoy the white light look. So keep fw lights in mind as their spectrum might be just as good if you’re not looking for a super blue reef light.
 
Click to watch best scape method in 5 easy steps!
Motorcitycorals
Top