Moving from radion back to T5in SPS dominated tank (poll inside)

Good or bad idea?


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Da8

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Hi, think here will be better, than on others thread (sorry)



I have 3 radion G4proXR30 + 2 T5 to reduce shadows.

Would like to switch to 8x39 t5 (main source of light) and support it with 4 tuna blue 160 (one on each corner)

Is going back to T5 but with that extra blue that kessils (and led) give so well.


What are you thoughts?

Thank you all!! :D
 

Big E

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T5 to do the heavy lifting and LED for supplementation and shimmer is going to make you very happy.

Most have it backwards with the LEDs as the dominant light source and T5 as supplements. The only reason this became popular is that so many people piled their $ into those LED boxes only to find out they needed T5.

I'm mainly speaking for acropora dominant systems........notice I didn't say sps.
 

reefwiser

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The problem is that constant changing on the lighting over a tank causes corals to stop growing. SPS do not like lighting changes they can stop growing and will set there for up 6 months before they start growing again. Things happen slowly moving lighting and adjusting lighting is not a good thing.
 
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Da8

Da8

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The Radion XR15 is equivalent to a Kessil A360 so as long as you're swapping one for one, there wont be any issues. Having owned the XR15 (G3) and the Kessils, I kept the Kessils and ditched the Radions but that was a matter of personal preference; both can grow corals but the shimmer and wider spread of the Kessil are the reasons I stuck with them (had no desire to mount the lights a foot and half off the tank to get the same spread). As for the bad move comment, that is likely coming from a user that lacks experience with one or both of the arrays mentioned (both are plenty capable).

Thank you. But moving from g4 xr30w pro to t5 8x39 + 4 tuna 160 is less amou t of light at least in w.

But I've always thought that I'm over illuminating.

Thanks for your asbwer.
I've had the A360's for almost two years now. On paper, yes there are the "same" as an XR15, but in reality they're far away from eachother. First of all, the Kessil has great shimmer, and that's about the only + for it. Let's see the negatives:
1, In reality it puts out less PAR's (around 2/3) as the XR15pro (not to mention the 160, which is only 50% as powerful)
2, It has a somewhat predifined spectrum, so if you want just a hint more red or purple for a picture maybe or just see where your corals are the most happy at? Yep, you won't get that. It just doesn't have the needed leds for that in it's matrix array. The Radion on the other hand is fully customizable spectrum wise
3, It has horrible cut-off (or shading). It's basicly a single-point light source (hence the great shimmer effect), but the corals don't care that much about shimmer, they care if they get light or not. Before adding the T5's the base of the corals were dying because they were not getting light.
(+1, It has an arrogant and delusional fan base, but so does the Ecotech club, so that's not really a thing to bring up against Kessil:DD)

All 3 "issues" are solveable with a T5 - Kessil hybrid setup (that's how I use mine), but then you're really keeping the Kessils just for the shimmer and as a poor par (compared to other options) base light, and set the spectrum/color (once) with the T5's, which you would need to swap every year or so. This might get ugly & access/space limiting unless you're using something like the AquaticLife fixture, which is also not on the cheap side for what it is. You don't have moonlight, weather simulation either - if that's something you'd like.

Ooor, for about the same price as 4 t5 bulbs, aquaticlife fixture, 2x a360we, spectral controller, you could get 3 XR15's with the diffusers, and have the same par and coverage, but with less energy consumption + a tidyer setup + no need to replace bulbs + be able to set the spectrum whenever and however you want.

I'm not saying I'm right, I'm just saying that if you let go of the fan-hype for a minute & look around on the internet, you'll see the results (and a lot of them) with the Radions, and won't see a single full blown away SPS tank with Kessils only. There must be a reason to this.
I do believe that radion are superior in average to kessil, but if I want to mix it with plenty of t5 I can only use kessil o SB actinic bars.

So do you think it's a good change?


T5 to do the heavy lifting and LED for supplementation and shimmer is going to make you very happy.

Most have it backwards with the LEDs as the dominant light source and T5 as supplements. The only reason this became popular is that so many people piled their $ into those LED boxes only to find out they needed T5.

I'm mainly speaking for acropora dominant systems........notice I didn't say sps.
I mainly keep acropora and lobophylia.
I think it's a killer move, but maybe a bit radical. I'm afraid. But I do believe as you that the t5 are superior light for the acropora. And I love the fact that every year, after changing the t5 you've got new lights, not as with led, that you don't know when they are losing performance.
The problem is that constant changing on the lighting over a tank causes corals to stop growing. SPS do not like lighting changes they can stop growing and will set there for up 6 months before they start growing again. Things happen slowly moving lighting and adjusting lighting is not a good thing.

That's one of mi main frights. I don't want to bother my colonies. Have been using this fixtures for years... Don't know how are they going to react.

Thanks for the help!!!
 

madweazl

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I'm assuming this is a 72" long tank with four, 36" T5s planned for each half?
 

madweazl

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And a 48" fixture is out of the question? I wouldnt use the LEDs to fill in the area the T5s are missing in the corners, I want them to blend with the T5s all the way across (not something you'd be able to do with a 8 bulb fixture due to the width). You're going to have two zones (one on each end) that will look significantly different from the center of the tank.
 

Jimbo662

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To see a good example of what that combo can do look at FarmerTy's tank.
 
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To see a good example of what that combo can do look at FarmerTy's tank.

He is one of my followed reeffers as well as Bubba and ricky.
Love the colors he gets and the health of the SPS.

But is he using kessil?


And a 48" fixture is out of the question? I wouldnt use the LEDs to fill in the area the T5s are missing in the corners, I want them to blend with the T5s all the way across (not something you'd be able to do with a 8 bulb fixture due to the width). You're going to have two zones (one on each end) that will look significantly different from the center of the tank.

Thanks! not out the 48" but thought it would be great to use a smaller one (can get it at good price by the way) and get that spaces to push the kessils, not to light the corners , but to get their light across.

I'm not sure if I'm able to explain myself. Or maybe it won't work the way I'm thinking.

Use each corner to throw kessil blue light diagonaly to the center of the tank.

Maybe I'm wrong...
 

Zach W

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T5 to do the heavy lifting and LED for supplementation and shimmer is going to make you very happy.

Most have it backwards with the LEDs as the dominant light source and T5 as supplements. The only reason this became popular is that so many people piled their $ into those LED boxes only to find out they needed T5.

I'm mainly speaking for acropora dominant systems........notice I didn't say sps.
I wouldn't say necessarily most people have it backwards, lots of well regarded shops run 100% LED systems such as WWC who run all their tanks under radions. I dont think their can be much contention that they have very successful acro dominant tanks.

The progression towards LEDs from MH/T5 is the same trend the we see in tech all the time. LEDs can now mimic very very closely the spectrum of T5 and MH at a lower power consumption and heat generation, and last for a longer period of time.
 

Big E

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I wouldn't say necessarily most people have it backwards, lots of well regarded shops run 100% LED systems such as WWC who run all their tanks under radions. I dont think their can be much contention that they have very successful acro dominant tanks.

The progression towards LEDs from MH/T5 is the same trend the we see in tech all the time. LEDs can now mimic very very closely the spectrum of T5 and MH at a lower power consumption and heat generation, and last for a longer period of time.

I'm not going to get into debates about lighting.............if you think WWC are expert acro growers then that's cool...............I'm of a totally different opinion. I gave my suggestions to the OP and I'll leave it at that.
 
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Da8

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I wouldn't say necessarily most people have it backwards, lots of well regarded shops run 100% LED systems such as WWC who run all their tanks under radions. I dont think their can be much contention that they have very successful acro dominant tanks.

The progression towards LEDs from MH/T5 is the same trend the we see in tech all the time. LEDs can now mimic very very closely the spectrum of T5 and MH at a lower power consumption and heat generation, and last for a longer period of time.


Don't want to be another lighting battle.

For me leds got their lights and their shadows, never said better.

For my needs, I love what T5 can give me, but want the extra only blue led lighting can give, and In which , Kessil, I think are extremely good.

I want to stop using radion because even it's wonderful performance, I don't trust in its durability nor the performance of some key points.

For the W consumption, I guess is more or less the same...since I use almost 480w , but I'm also worried about the extra heat....that could be a mayor drawback.

thanks everybody for your answers!! let's keep on!!
 

Zach W

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I'm not going to get into debates about lighting.............if you think WWC are expert acro growers then that's cool...............I'm of a totally different opinion. I gave my suggestions to the OP and I'll leave it at that.
Not trying to argue at all, just stating that you can have success in acro dominant tanks with any of the major lighting options (MH/T5/LED) and there are multiple examples of that. Obviously WWC has a partnership with ecotech and that is why they run their lights but they do have healthy thriving acro systems with only LED lighting. What im saying is you can be successful multiple ways, LED only being one of them
 

madweazl

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Don't want to be another lighting battle.

For me leds got their lights and their shadows, never said better.

For my needs, I love what T5 can give me, but want the extra only blue led lighting can give, and In which , Kessil, I think are extremely good.

I want to stop using radion because even it's wonderful performance, I don't trust in its durability nor the performance of some key points.

For the W consumption, I guess is more or less the same...since I use almost 480w , but I'm also worried about the extra heat....that could be a mayor drawback.

thanks everybody for your answers!! let's keep on!!

I was surprised by how much additional heat the T5s added when I went from two, to four bulbs. I run six on the 150g but added a pair of fans in the canopy that took care of that.
 
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Da8

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that's one of my main concerns. It's a very small room and I control heat with fans and AC.
 

jda

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Ed nailed this in the first reply... I am also only into acropora and only apply this to keeping them...

It goes like this...
Step 1: some people believe the BS that shops, stores and shills can really get good results out of LEDs alone for acropora, or that each type of light can do the same thing.
Step 2: after a while, and once they get to a higher level of reefing awareness, they see the issues and add a few T5s
Step 3: the reefer is amazed by the difference a few makes
Step 4: start to wonder what will happen if they add more T5s since people that they never wanted to listen to have always tried to tell them that they were better for acropora... and they saw what only a few did
Step 5: they change the paradigm and start to have the T5 do the heavy lifting and keep around some LEDs to satisfy their hunger for thunderstorms and black light
Step 6: become less dependent on the LEDs at all since now they don't need them to make their corals look good when you "blue it up"... they just look good all the time now that you have better lighting.

I will also totally contend that the oft-mentioned coastal reef shops are only really impressive to those who are in step 1 mentioned above. Each time that I go, I only think: man... this could be so much better. Then, I remember that they are building/running a business and have different goals than us and catering the needs of people in Step 1 is amongst the highest priority for them. Their tanks are middling level for acropora hobbyists, and that is ok... they are not hobbyists.

Seriously, just skip to the end if you want to really work in Acropora, and work well. I would strongly recommend a 48" T5 fixture and then get some LED light bars for each end - that would look better and the ReefBrites (if you can get them in Spain) pop better than Kessils do, IMO.
 

madweazl

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Surprising to hear there is only one single way to have a healthy/successful acropora dominant tank

Dont look at it as the only way but it's certainly the easiest way (and likely most economical) if MH is out of the question.
 

Zach W

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Dont look at it as the only way but it's certainly the easiest way (and likely most economical) if MH is out of the question.
Oh I agree with that, I was merely stating the opinion is that you can keep a healthy/successful/growing acro tank with any of the three lighting options.
 
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