Moving tank and livestock

MonsterTaco · Feb 19, 2020

First, I'm completely new to this. Never had a SW tank before but have been researching and learning for the past year and was planning to get my first tank going in the next 6 months or so. However, I came across a deal locally where someone is moving away and is selling their entire Red Sea Reefer 250 (54gal DT/11gal sump) setup - livestock, tank, stand, pumps, lights, rock, sand, etc. Livestock includes 2 Ocellaris Clowns, a Pistol Shrimp/Goby pair and some coral (no description and not a great picture). This seems to be a great starter tank and the fish included are already on my "must have" list. The seller is about a 30 minute drive from my house, 15 minutes from my work so I could easily make multiple trips if necessary.

Assuming I buy this, including the livestock, what is the best way to move and reestablish the tank and it's inhabitants? Should I house the fish in a separate tank until the DT is established for a few weeks? What about the corals? I've read bad things regarding reusing sand - should I scrap it and buy new (it's Fiji pink live sand)? Rinse and reuse? New water? Or do I somehow try to transfer water from the existing setup? I don't even know what other questions to ask... And speaking of, what questions should I be asking the seller?

Again, I am completely new and have no equipment. I know I'll need to get an RODI system, salt and a mixing station setup. I know I'll need testing kits. Maybe another tank if I need to house the fish outside of the DT. What else do I need immediately?

Is this even a good idea? If I (or more likely the fish) am better off to start without having the fish to care for immediately, please tell me that. The seller has everything listed separately, so I can wait until he/she sells off the livestock and just purchase the equipment. Thanks!

Ckdada · Feb 19, 2020

That sounds like an amazing first tank, I would keep the sand and as much of the water as you could to avoid shocking the coral/fish and mage sure to keep salinity the sand when adding new water as well as using the same salt mix, the best way to learn is from failure in this hobby. Also always quarentine fish/treat with copper. It seems like something thats not necessary but these days is it very crucial in preventing pests and diseases. Good luck!

Eleni18 · Feb 19, 2020

If it was me, I would put fish and corals in two separate buckets with water from the DT. Live rock in another bucket with water from the DT, enough so they don't dry up. Use as much of the DT water you can in the fish, coral and live rock buckets. Move the DT to your house with the live sand and just enough water to cover it. Set it up, put back the live rock creating your aquascape and fill up with new salt water. So what you have done in essence is a very large water change. Then, once your tank is stable which should not be very long as you would be mainly using the same rock, sand and salt water, do your tests and if everything is OK, start adding the corals and fish

BeejReef · Feb 19, 2020

You've got your hands full!

The standard answer is more or less keep the rock, ditch the sand, make the move as fast as you can.
Ofc have your water mix and storage ready ahead of time. Have bottled bac and prime on hand, and hope for the best.

Some will encourage you to keep the sand, or to rinse the sand. That's a debate.

I'd just say it's very doable w a half hour drive. My calculus would depend more on 1) how cooperative and helpful the seller is prepared to be in the move, 2) how well has the tank been maintained, 3) How closely does the existing system match your desires for what you want to run.

You probably don't want to inherit someone else's failure and compound it by stirring everything up. If it's running reasonably well though, you'll save a ton of $ and maybe skip a good chunk of the uglies.

Just remember, a lot of whole systems go up for sale in the summer when peoples' interest wanes. This won't be your only opportunity.

MonsterTaco · Feb 19, 2020

Eleni18 said:
If it was me, I would put fish and corals in two separate buckets with water from the DT. Live rock in another bucket with water from the DT, enough so they don't dry up. Use as much of the DT water you can in the fish, coral and live rock buckets. Move the DT to your house with the live sand and just enough water to cover it. Set it up, put back the live rock creating your aquascape and fill up with new salt water. So what you have done in essence is a very large water change. Then, once your tank is stable which should not be very long as you would be mainly using the same rock, sand and salt water, do your tests and if everything is OK, start adding the corals and fish

Thanks for the advice! How long is "not very long"? Hours, days, weeks? Just thinking about heating and circulating water in the fish/coral buckets while waiting for tank to stabilize.

BeejReef said:
You've got your hands full!

The standard answer is more or less keep the rock, ditch the sand, make the move as fast as you can.
Ofc have your water mix and storage ready ahead of time. Have bottled bac and prime on hand, and hope for the best.

Some will encourage you to keep the sand, or to rinse the sand. That's a debate.

I'd just say it's very doable w a half hour drive. My calculus would depend more on 1) how cooperative and helpful the seller is prepared to be in the move, 2) how well has the tank been maintained, 3) How closely does the existing system match your desires for what you want to run.

You probably don't want to inherit someone else's failure and compound it by stirring everything up. If it's running reasonably well though, you'll save a ton of $ and maybe skip a good chunk of the uglies.

Just remember, a lot of whole systems go up for sale in the summer when peoples' interest wanes. This won't be your only opportunity.

If the boss (AKA the wife) gives me the thumbs up, I'll talk more with the seller about the tank and go have a look at it. From his selling post, it's been running for about 1.5 years and it looks well maintained in the picture. Of course, the picture isn't great quality and I don't know when it was taken. And I'll talk to him about planning the move to see how much help he's willing to be. Thanks for the advice!

Jon Fishman · Feb 19, 2020

What I would do....

Empty water into a couple of heavy duty rubbermaid containers. Much nicer than buckets for not breaking coral etc. Put all rocks/coral stuff in these. I personally would put each fish in their own tupperware (think 1-qt container)

I would, like I said, empty water into these containers..... do so via siphon etc, and try not to disturb the sand.

Have someone help you carry the tank WITH SAND to your vehicle. 54g is easy..... wet sand is gonna make it heavy though, but doable.

Get home, put rocks back in. Pump water back in very slowly to not disturb sand..... run pumps and filters after it is all setup..... try to run for a couple hours until the water clears a bit. Place the fish in (float them during this) and you will probably need to add quite a bit of water for whatever was lost in the move/spilled.

Let it run with fish until the next day or day after, depending on when you have time, and do a 50% water-change.

Option 2 is to put sand in buckets if the tank is too heavy. I did this with a larger tank, and despite 10 years of detritus etc, I had no ill effects of re-using the sand this way. Just smooth it out and don’t MIX it up as the water goes in.

Good luck. How much are they asking?

mayday0237 · Feb 19, 2020

Do not get rid of the sand. It is the essential component of the bio filter for that tank. If you get rid of it the tank has to start over from scratch creating a new biofilter

Eleni18 · Feb 19, 2020

MonsterTaco said:
Thanks for the advice! How long is "not very long"? Hours, days, weeks? Just thinking about heating and circulating water in the fish/coral buckets while waiting for tank to stabilize.
Hours...just like a major water change. Until the water clears really and your tests show all is OK. Good luck, sounds like a great starter choice

Jon Fishman · Feb 19, 2020

mayday0237 said:
Do not get rid of the sand. It is the essential component of the bio filter for that tank. If you get rid of it the tank has to start over from scratch creating a new biofilter

I have no sand in my tank, so I will politely disagree with that. It has rock......

champyeti · Feb 19, 2020

Jon Fishman said:
I have no sand in my tank, so I will politely disagree with that. It has rock......

Yeah that is what my rock is for. Bare bottom and no issues.

My best advice for a tank move is to premix the entire new volume of water and have a heater in it. Get it to temp and salinity so once the tank is in position it's easy to refill.

MonsterTaco · Feb 19, 2020

Jon Fishman said:
I have no sand in my tank, so I will politely disagree with that. It has rock......

champyeti said:
Yeah that is what my rock is for. Bare bottom and no issues.

My best advice for a tank move is to premix the entire new volume of water and have a heater in it. Get it to temp and salinity so once the tank is in position it's easy to refill.

I've read about the benefits of bare bottom, but I just like the look with sand. I may end up with bare bottom if/when I eventually get the 72" peninsula I want, mainly to help getting good flow without needing equipment on the viewing end.

mayday0237 · Feb 19, 2020

So taking a fully cycled mature tank that has been set up since the owner put it together to a bare bottom is not for a brand new saltie. At least not if you want to keep anything alive.
The rock is loaded to share the biofilter with the sand now. If he removes that large of a component his tank will crash. It's fine if he has somewhere else to put his fish and corals. He does not have anything set up from what I read.
So I understand why you feel that way, but he wants to keep the fish and corals and inverts /in the tank after set up. Unless I'm missing something, that advice is setting him up to fail.

brandon429 · Feb 19, 2020

in the sand rinse thread, we rip out fifteen year old sandbeds instantly and without loss, multiple times. the way it works is, live rock is either enough surface area by itself or its not, the surrounding surface area doesnt affect the bare minimums.

so the final guess is whether the live rock alone is enough. In the sand rinse thread, we've never seen any degree of live rock be too little, 5 yrs thread.

removing sand can kill a tank though by upwelling dangerous waste, but not for lack of bacteria. separate the fish from the potential mess, before the move. transfer no detritus, no recycle

if you transfer some waste, you risk some recycle. the loss event is solely tied to detritus and not any other factor in tank moves. moving clean surfaces always works, its why you dont see old sandbeds at a macna convention though there are 500 reefs with sand.

*it is possible to move old sand, people have. Im merely quoting the actions the only relocation thread on the web shows. customize as you see fit, but the thread is very specific in order to have zero recycles/200 reefs.

mayday0237 · Feb 19, 2020

Jon Fishman said:
I have no sand in my tank, so I will politely disagree with that. It has rock......

The set up advice is great other than disagreement over sand

Funwithreefer · Feb 19, 2020

I’ll take a different direction. As nice as it would be to go from 0 to established tank with livestock, I would say one of the joys of being new to this hobby is starting new and learning along the way about cycling, testing, dosing, coral placement, clean up crews and fish selection. I started my tank 4 months ago, with months of research and planning and it’s been an exciting and educational ride. To me, that is part of the joy of it all.

MonsterTaco · Feb 19, 2020

Jon Fishman said:
What I would do....

Empty water into a couple of heavy duty rubbermaid containers. Much nicer than buckets for not breaking coral etc. Put all rocks/coral stuff in these. I personally would put each fish in their own tupperware (think 1-qt container)

I would, like I said, empty water into these containers..... do so via siphon etc, and try not to disturb the sand.

Have someone help you carry the tank WITH SAND to your vehicle. 54g is easy..... wet sand is gonna make it heavy though, but doable.

Get home, put rocks back in. Pump water back in very slowly to not disturb sand..... run pumps and filters after it is all setup..... try to run for a couple hours until the water clears a bit. Place the fish in (float them during this) and you will probably need to add quite a bit of water for whatever was lost in the move/spilled.

Let it run with fish until the next day or day after, depending on when you have time, and do a 50% water-change.

Option 2 is to put sand in buckets if the tank is too heavy. I did this with a larger tank, and despite 10 years of detritus etc, I had no ill effects of re-using the sand this way. Just smooth it out and don’t MIX it up as the water goes in.

Good luck. How much are they asking?

Thanks for the info. Would you put the coral in at the same time as the fish? Or right away with the rocks?

He's asking $3000 for all equipment or $3400 with rock, sand and livestock, but is willing to negotiate. I priced out all equipment on BRS and it was around $4400 I think.

Jon Fishman · Feb 19, 2020

If you do it, rock/coral all at once, fish once the water settles a bit

MonsterTaco · Feb 19, 2020

Funwithreefer said:
I’ll take a different direction. As nice as it would be to go from 0 to established tank with livestock, I would say one of the joys of being new to this hobby is starting new and learning along the way about cycling, testing, dosing, coral placement, clean up crews and fish selection. I started my tank 4 months ago, with months of research and planning and it’s been an exciting and educational ride. To me, that is part of the joy of it all.

I don't disagree... I've been watching, reading and learning about this hobby for well over a year and I do feel like I'll be missing out on part of the experience by doing it this way (if I do). I know it's hard for a lot of people to play the waiting game and/or go through the "uglies" but I am kinda looking forward to it. On the other hand, if I can/do pull this off and have a great tank almost immediately, maybe my wife won't just roll her eyes at me when I bring up the big tank like she does right now...