My Honest Opinion About The Alkatronic
- Thread starter mitch91175
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mitch91175
2500 Club Member
Yeah when they are available if you are interested in getting one, don't blink twice.
Richyreefer
Active Member
Hi Mitch, I am having a problem with my unit not dosing even though the action mode switch is on. The graph shows a red dot, but i stand there and watch the entire test and it does not dose. pump d calibrates fine and primes fine as well, it just does not move when the test is run. any suggestions?Dang bro get that thing setup already
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mitch91175
2500 Club Member
Is your dKH range setup? When it measures, if the range is setup is the measurement outside of your range?
Richyreefer
Active Member
Yes, the range is set-up. Can you get blue and red dots without doing that? I cut back on the dosing from my Apex to let the Alkatronic do the fine tuning, and it did nothing but test still. I turned the action mode off, then on again, to see if that would get it going. I will let you know if that worked tonight. Like i said, i get the red dot showing the unit knows the level is low, but the lcd screen only shows test results and no amount of dosing. I really appreciate any help!
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mitch91175
2500 Club Member
Are you running the latest firmware? Just checking to make sure that can be a potential resolution. Are you able to access your unit from the website? If so, maybe setting "Action Mode" there will get it going. You can always adjust your range so when it test it is outside your range to make sure it is dosing then change your range again.
Richyreefer
Active Member
It is running V01.01.16. I watched it test twice last night from all the way through the process and pump D never engaged. The LCD screen never showed that it dosed wither, just displayed a red dot on the graph.
Richyreefer
Active Member
Also, the LCD screen did acknowledge that the action mode was enabled. Carlos at Coralvue will not help until i can get it connected to WifI and i am having trouble with that too. It does not want to connect.
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mitch91175
2500 Club Member
You want to update the firmware first. I think the latest version is V01.04.07. You can download it from here:
http://www.focustronic.net/media/wy...kGd8WS7pZh4wSszAyLJfCGYqdsVnBqdxyWbGRE9ZxPUlE
Also make sure that you have the latest version of the app on your iPhone/Android device.
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mitch91175
2500 Club Member
The biggest issue that I do see that the unit still has is getting it setup for the first time. If they can figure out that part then it'll really be icing on the cake. Would be even better if they can implement firmware updating from the cloud too (so you do not need to use USB to update).
markstubb
Well-Known Member
I've always agreed with that. The initial set up can be a bit of a pain, but it sure seems like they've come a long way with it. The only thing about the firmware is there are two of them - one gets updated via the cloud, the other is the actual local system controller which seemingly requires USB and that's just how it works. I think the local controller is mostly out of band with everything that happens online.
Looks like an Alkatronic is in my future. One question that I think remains unanswered, and maybe some of you guys have already figured it out, is what the DIY reagent ought to be. Randy's testing recipe calls for 0.1N hydrochloric or sulfuric acid.
I'd be really surprised if Alkatronic's reagent is other than either of those two acids, though I'm willing to be surprised. The normality of the reagent is open to a guessing game..
Amazon has 4L of either hydrochloric or sulfuric acid 0.1N at about $39.00
At Hach.Com, a 1L container of HCL 0.1N is only $22.19.
By the way, Hach has an alkalinity testing method on their site for the digital titrator I picked up for pennies on Ebay: https://www.hach.com/asset-get.download.jsa?id=7639983929.
If you take a look at the foregoing link, you'll see that Hach's procedure is essentially the same procedure as Randy's. Although the procedure is based on a color-change, it is easily used with a pH meter instead, titrating to a pH 8.3 endpoint..
The similarity of Randy's DIY test and the Hach procedure is, I am guessing, due to the fact that this is an age-old, well-understood method of determining alkalinity. Nobody is stealing anybody else's intellectual property. I'm a lawyer, when my inner chemist hasn't taken over, and I find it odd that Focustronic claims that the contents of their reagent is a trade secret.
If anybody is in the NYC area (I live northwest in Rockland County) and has some Alkatronic reagent to spare, we could get together and tap our inner chemists to do some comparison titrations between the Alkatronic reagent and a known acid to see what we find out about the reagent's normality.
I understand (solely from Dr. Google) that if you place a bottle of strong ammonia next to the open mouth of the acid bottle, it's hydrochloric acid if a white cloud forms at the top of the bottle, sulfuric acid if no white cloud forms. I'm not sure it makes a difference which acid is used.either. The Hach method considers the two acids interchangeable.Randy's DIY test does the same.
I'd be really surprised if Alkatronic's reagent is other than either of those two acids, though I'm willing to be surprised. The normality of the reagent is open to a guessing game..
Amazon has 4L of either hydrochloric or sulfuric acid 0.1N at about $39.00
At Hach.Com, a 1L container of HCL 0.1N is only $22.19.
By the way, Hach has an alkalinity testing method on their site for the digital titrator I picked up for pennies on Ebay: https://www.hach.com/asset-get.download.jsa?id=7639983929.
If you take a look at the foregoing link, you'll see that Hach's procedure is essentially the same procedure as Randy's. Although the procedure is based on a color-change, it is easily used with a pH meter instead, titrating to a pH 8.3 endpoint..
The similarity of Randy's DIY test and the Hach procedure is, I am guessing, due to the fact that this is an age-old, well-understood method of determining alkalinity. Nobody is stealing anybody else's intellectual property. I'm a lawyer, when my inner chemist hasn't taken over, and I find it odd that Focustronic claims that the contents of their reagent is a trade secret.
If anybody is in the NYC area (I live northwest in Rockland County) and has some Alkatronic reagent to spare, we could get together and tap our inner chemists to do some comparison titrations between the Alkatronic reagent and a known acid to see what we find out about the reagent's normality.
I understand (solely from Dr. Google) that if you place a bottle of strong ammonia next to the open mouth of the acid bottle, it's hydrochloric acid if a white cloud forms at the top of the bottle, sulfuric acid if no white cloud forms. I'm not sure it makes a difference which acid is used.either. The Hach method considers the two acids interchangeable.Randy's DIY test does the same.
markstubb
Well-Known Member
I dunno, I'm all for finding cheaper solutions to things in this hobby but so far, that 4L bottle of reagent has lasted me like 10 months and I'm barely halfway through the thing, and I used to do 8 tests a day, down to 3 now. At this rate, it'll last me another few years. By all means though - do what works for you!
I didn't realize it was $100 before I wrote this. I don't recall paying that much, but maybe the price changed.
I didn't realize it was $100 before I wrote this. I don't recall paying that much, but maybe the price changed.
It's the $100 price for something that's undoubtedly generic that gets me. If I'm paying just a bit under $1,000 for the equipment, I'm certainly not being a cheapskate. It's the principal of the thing. Kudos to them for develop a machine that fits the need and apparently does so very well. I'll gladly pay for that machine. Paying a premium price for easily obtainable sulfuric or hydrochloric acid? Not so much.
Printer companies do this, too. Sell a printer for $100. Then receive a continuing annuity as the poor sucker who purchased the "bargain" pays $40 per ink cartridge every couple of months.
Honestly, I wouldn't create "DIY printer ink" or consider buying an off-brand ink, because I treasure the quality of the photos I produce on my prosumer photo printer. I don't feel the same way about generic chemicals for a standard alkalinity titration, unless someone convinces me there's something non-standard about the reagent in this case.
Printer companies do this, too. Sell a printer for $100. Then receive a continuing annuity as the poor sucker who purchased the "bargain" pays $40 per ink cartridge every couple of months.
Honestly, I wouldn't create "DIY printer ink" or consider buying an off-brand ink, because I treasure the quality of the photos I produce on my prosumer photo printer. I don't feel the same way about generic chemicals for a standard alkalinity titration, unless someone convinces me there's something non-standard about the reagent in this case.
markstubb
Well-Known Member
I totally understand. I think in the example of printers, that's how the printing companies get away with selling you the printer for a lower cost - they suck you in with a good printer for not a lot of $$, then try to get that money back out of you with high priced ink cartridges. No idea if that's Alkatronic's gameplan, supplementing overhead of producing the actual unit with higher cost reagent. But, they're in business to make money, too.
I do agree with your points on the markup for a generic product, but sometimes we have to think about what all we're paying for. If I had to pay 1/2 the cost of a bottle of generic reagent and get no tech support, verses paying $100 and getting literally the best tech support I've had of most any product I've ever owned, then I'm happy to do the latter.
I do agree with your points on the markup for a generic product, but sometimes we have to think about what all we're paying for. If I had to pay 1/2 the cost of a bottle of generic reagent and get no tech support, verses paying $100 and getting literally the best tech support I've had of most any product I've ever owned, then I'm happy to do the latter.
Sean1986
Active Member
For those that have a Alkatronic and Apex, is there a difference in BNC cables? I’m trying to order one and need about 8-12 feet of cable. I’m seeing all kinds of cables from audio to video BNC? Can someone assist me in getting the correct cable?
Thank you in advance
Thank you in advance
Coralvue had them this morning
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