Need some opinions on dosing nitrate and phosphate

[Nick Steele]

There is a short version at the bottom.

Tank is a Nuvo 20 that has 2 AI 16hds for lights and only filtration is Filter floss and Rubble rock and water changes.

Hello everyone I have a curious question regarding some sps and my phosphate and nitrate levels. 3 sps corals where added about 6 weeks ago. I believe they are slowly getting use to my tank as they are growing slightly but after the addition they all lost color and browned out. I ran into an issue about 4 weeks ago when I noticed my phos dropped from .03-.06 to 0 and nitrate stayed at 0. This caused Dino’s that are clinging to my rocks (I did scope them). So I started to feed heavy. 1/4 cube mysis or equivalent of rods food and 1/8tsp of reef roids daily for just 2 clownfish. I didn’t think much of it as I assumed my levels would raise but I checked this past weekend and nothing 0/0 again.

So I ordered neophos and neonitro to help bring my levels up. While waiting for them to arrive I slowly started to notice that all 3 of the sps frags are starting to color up better. Pink lemonade went from completely purple to starting to regain some yellow/green to it. A rainbow Millie is doing the same thing has some green/red now. Pc rainbow is also starting to show some greens.

While I’m still showing 0/0 phos and nitrate I’m curious if I should ride it out for a little to let the sps gain some colors or should I start dosing to help eliminate the Dino’s?

Short version:
losing a battle with Dino’s and 0/0 phos and nitrate. Sps are starting to look better though so should I start dosing neophos and neonitro to increase my numbers or try to ride out the Dino’s itself?

Full tank shot

Pink lemonade (before and after)

 

[Subsea]

I question the sensitivity of your test kit.

By feeding more, you are adding nitrogen & phosphate. If your corals are showing improvement, then consider that as proof you are going the right way.

As you already found out, when nitrogen & phosphorous are limited, desirable organisms suffer and opportunistic/undesirables proliferate without the competition.

 

[Nick Steele]

I question the sensitivity of your test kit.

By feeding more, you are adding nitrogen & phosphate. If your corals are showing improvement, then consider that as proof you are going the right way.

As you already found out, when nitrogen & phosphorous are limited, desirable organisms suffer and opportunistic/undesirables proliferate without the competition.

Phosphate is Hannah/salifert both have always read the same. Nitrate is salifert.

And yeah sps is looking better but I still have Dino’s (reason I ordered the neon products in first place)

 

[Cole.mormon]

Start dosing now

 

[Subsea]

Phosphate is Hannah/salifert both have always read the same. Nitrate is salifert.

And yeah sps is looking better but I still have Dino’s (reason I ordered the neon products in first place)

If you have a marine tank, you have Dinoflagellate. It’s a “Question of Balance” as to how much diversity and competition you have to keep it in check.

Dinoflagellate - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

[In terms of number of species, dinoflagellates are one of the largest groups of marine eukaryotes, although this group is substantially smaller than diatoms.[8] Some species are endosymbionts of marine animals and play an important part in the biology of coral reefs. Other dinoflagellates are unpigmented predators on other protozoa, and a few forms are parasitic (for example, Oodinium and Pfiesteria). Some dinoflagellates produce resting stages, called dinoflagellate cysts or dinocysts, as part of their lifecycles, and is known from 84 of the 350 described freshwater species, and from a little more than 10% of the known marine species.[9][10] Dinoflagellates are alveolates possessing two flagella, the ancestral condition of bikonts.]

 

[Nick Steele]

If you have a marine tank, you have Dinoflagellate. It’s a “Question of Balance” as to how much diversity and competition you have to keep it in check.

Yes while this is true I have an over abundance of them. They are completely covering my rocks making them turn brown and not stay the purple color we all love. I’m trying to get ahead of them before the become an issue for some of my corals.

 

[Subsea]

Phosphate is Hannah/salifert both have always read the same. Nitrate is salifert.

@Nick Steele
After 48 years of keeping marine ornamentals, I don’t test. I periodically send off for lab results. I have little knowledge of the test kits you are using.

I noticed you lived near Indian River Lagoon. I had been trying to obtain some Gracilaria Tikvahiae from that area for several years when I grew Gracilaria Parvispora for Asian food market here in Austin

Indian River Lagoon Species Inventory Home

 

[Subsea]

Yes while this is true I have an over abundance of them. They are completely covering my rocks making them turn brown and not stay the purple color we all love. I’m trying to get ahead of them before the become an issue for some of my corals.

If rock is able to be removed from tank, then soak for 10 minutes in 10% solution of 3% H202. This can be done with corals attached. For more sensitive corals, reduce soak time.

 

[SMSREEF]

I would dose if you have Dino’s. My goal was 5-10 nitrate and 0.05-0.1 phosphate until you start seeing green algae on the glass.
Then use the algae as your guide.

if you used a microscope, get a pic of what you are dealing with. Certain strains That leave the sand/rock at night you can get rid of very quickly with UV. They build a UV specifically for the Nuvo.

 

[SMSREEF]

If rock is able to be removed from tank, then soak for 10 minutes in 10% solution of 3% H202.

This will kill most of the beneficial bacteria as well.
There are other options before going to this extreme. Corals are looking better so OP has time.

 

[Subsea]

This will kill most of the beneficial bacteria as well.
There are other options before going to this extreme. Corals are looking better so OP has time.

only on the rock that is soaked will bacteria suffer. The tank bulk water, sand and other rock left in tank maintain bacteria populations.

UV should also be used but watch out for heat gain.

 

[SMSREEF]

I noticed you lived near Indian River Lagoon. I had been trying to obtain some Gracilaria Tikvahiae from that area for several years

That’s a really nice looking macro @Subsea

Sea Vegetables : Florida Atlantic University - Harbor Branch Oceanographic Institute

 

[ScottB]

As @SMSREEF suggests, UV is very effective against MOST (not all) species of dinos. Can you share an image of your dinos?

And "YES" start dosing. Start with PO4 first. In a nitrate depleted system, the addition of NO3 will hammer your PO4. Get PO4 measurable first before adding nitrate.

 

[Nick Steele]

I noticed you lived near Indian River Lagoon. I had been trying to obtain some Gracilaria Tikvahiae from that area for several years when I grew Gracilaria Parvispora for Asian food market here in Austin

Indian River Lagoon Species Inventory Home

I see that stuff all the time out fishing. Well I don’t know about the exact species but gracilaria none the less.

If rock is able to be removed from tank, then soak for 10 minutes in 10% solution of 3% H202. This can be done with corals attached. For more sensitive corals, reduce soak time.

Don’t want to do this as the sps are starting to encrust the rock and all my rocks are connected with epoxy and glue so would have to nuke most of my beneficial bacteria.

I would dose if you have Dino’s. My goal was 5-10 nitrate and 0.05-0.1 phosphate until you start seeing green algae on the glass.
Then use the algae as your guide.

Did you use neophos or neonitro? If so any tips


I’ll try and get a decent picture tomorrow of the Dino’s. It’s a very cheap microscope so not easy to get clear pictures but works for now.

 

[Aqua Man]

NeoPhos is also what I used. I suggest buying 2 bottles. Used up a whole bottle in a 20 gallon. On my second Bottle now and still reading low for phos.

 

[SMSREEF]

Did you use neophos or neonitro? If so any tips

I did not. I used Sodium nitrate and sodium phosphate dibasic and mixed my own.
But many people have used neophos and neonitro to raise levels. It doesn’t require a scale or calculator and I think there is less room for error.

Just go slow. Whatever dosage you calculate you need, use half. Let your tank circulate for 30 minutes and then retest. This way you get a good handle on exactly how much a dose will raise your level.

My tank blew through it so quickly that I would be 0 the next day. That’s why I suggest testing after you dose at first.

I did not do it like @ScottB suggested (I dosed both nitrate and phosphate) and that likely could be why this happened to me. I wish I would have read this when I first started dosing.

I now have taken my skimmer offline and rarely need to dose nitrate because I am Also feeding more. I also now understand how much PO4 my tank uses on average after dosing for a couple months and I just add to my ATO water.

 

[ScottB]

As @Aqua Man says, the first bottle of NeoPhos will hardly make a dent as it will all get bound to the rock and substrate unlike nitrate which will remain in the water.

I mixed my own using this at 2 grams per liter.

 

[MabuyaQ]

If both are at zero just add more fishfood to the system. This will also help build up more microfauna. This microfauna will help with controling pests like dino's, cyano's and diatoms. Phosphate and/or Nitrate supplements are great for disbalance adjustments.

 

[SPS2020]

I'm in the same boat as the OP. I just started using Plus-NP from Tropic Marin. In five days, the PO4 went from 0 to 12 ppb (.04). NO3 is still zero. I plan to increase feeding to help with that aspect.

 

[Nick Steele]

Thanks everyone!

I’m going to start dosing about .05ml today. That should put me at .03ppm. And I will see how the corals react.