Neptune Systems Controller … GO ALL IN?

[HuduVudu]

@HuduVudu what are your opinions on the Hydors system?

I haven't used them.

To me they are going to be the same as the others, with whatever strengths and weakness' they will have. I did look into them, but I was so disgusted and tired of flushing money down the toilet I was pretty reluctant to try them out.

Pretty much my thinking is different, and for sure this isn't going to be everyone's view or opinion. I want to go onto eBay and get what I need. I don't mind talking to Rob at RoboTank to ask questions about equipment. He definitely helped when I set up my solenoid for my CaRx.

Another issue I haven't touched on with the named controllers is privacy and security. I am sick to death of the data collection. Most people don't care. I do. I went away from the fancy dosing. I prefer WiFi to be locked down. I don't want my controllers on the internet. If I need to get to them I will tunnel, and even then I would rather be able to walk away from them and know that they will work and I don't have to check up on them.

My dosers are old school. I just use Kamoer XST and X1 and I don't use the WiFi and I am using Bluetooth only. This is a lot more secure, and really the doser should work and you shouldn't have to bother with it.

I do have Mobius and EcoTech Lights and pumps. I love/hate the blue tooth mesh network, but it at least keeps me off of the internet. Plus I like Radions and Vectras they are solid hardware. Vortechs and Versas ... not so much.

That is what I found that you have to kind of patch together your stuff to get something that works. I wished that there were complete systems out there so that I could go with that but all of the problems I have mentioned ensure that those won't ever work.

Maybe that helps?

 

[Acros]

I haven't used them.

To me they are going to be the same as the others, with whatever strengths and weakness' they will have. I did look into them, but I was so disgusted and tired of flushing money down the toilet I was pretty reluctant to try them out.

Pretty much my thinking is different, and for sure this isn't going to be everyone's view or opinion. I want to go onto eBay and get what I need. I don't mind talking to Rob at RoboTank to ask questions about equipment. He definitely helped when I set up my solenoid for my CaRx.

Another issue I haven't touched on with the named controllers is privacy and security. I am sick to death of the data collection. Most people don't care. I do. I went away from the fancy dosing. I prefer WiFi to be locked down. I don't want my controllers on the internet. If I need to get to them I will tunnel, and even then I would rather be able to walk away from them and know that they will work and I don't have to check up on them.

My dosers are old school. I just use Kamoer XST and X1 and I don't use the WiFi and I am using Bluetooth only. This is a lot more secure, and really the doser should work and you shouldn't have to bother with it.

I do have Mobius and EcoTech Lights and pumps. I love/hate the blue tooth mesh network, but it at least keeps me off of the internet. Plus I like Radions and Vectras they are solid hardware. Vortechs and Versas ... not so much.

That is what I found that you have to kind of patch together your stuff to get something that works. I wished that there were complete systems out there so that I could go with that but all of the problems I have mentioned ensure that those won't ever work.

Maybe that helps?

It does.

I have components from different manufacturers on my nano. Can’t seem to stick to one manufacturer without compromising or spending way too much.

 

[Gundy]

I will be using nearly every component that Apex has to offer on my current 350 gallon build. As others have stated, the Apex system is not for everyone nor will smaller systems need all that Apex has to offer. There are other options to chose from depending on your needs. For me, I realize the investment will be significant but worth it for the automation, time savings and information it can provide constantly- even remotely if necessary.

 

[Sean Clark]

Of course you do not need to go "All in" all at once. This is true with any product ecosystem that you may choose.

 

[rtparty]

...The little spat with EcoTech says everything about Apex as a company...

That was Ecotech, not Neptune. Ecotech made all their gear not work with Neptune so you would have to use Mobius and Ecotech's new controller (whenever it makes its debut.)

 

[rtparty]

To the OP,

We're all crazy in this hobby. Anyone who says otherwise is still in the denial stage lol.

You don't have to go all in and get crazy. Get the Apex EL, or even better, wait for the ELMO to come back. Skip the EB832 and grab an EB8. Much better power strip. Less features but more reliable by a mile.

The Sky is a good light and Neptune software is an advantage here.

I like my DOS. Been rock solid for over a year now. Easy to make changes. It's semi loud but only runs for a couple seconds at a time for me. At least I know it's working.

Skip the ATK. Get a Tunze 3155 if you can find one. You'll be glad you did.

Trident? Wait a while and grab one down the road. Doesn't need to be day 1.

 

[Beez]

To the OP,

We're all crazy in this hobby. Anyone who says otherwise is still in the denial stage lol.

You don't have to go all in and get crazy. Get the Apex EL, or even better, wait for the ELMO to come back. Skip the EB832 and grab an EB8. Much better power strip. Less features but more reliable by a mile.

The Sky is a good light and Neptune software is an advantage here.

I like my DOS. Been rock solid for over a year now. Easy to make changes. It's semi loud but only runs for a couple seconds at a time for me. At least I know it's working.

Skip the ATK. Get a Tunze 3155 if you can find one. You'll be glad you did.

Trident? Wait a while and grab one down the road. Doesn't need to be day 1.

Lucky I have time to do more research … lots too look at … the Hydros look pretty great too. I just don’t know … what I do know is I want to make my life easy. More automation for me the better.

 

[rtparty]

Lucky I have time to do more research … lots too look at … the Hydros look pretty great too. I just don’t know … what I do know is I want to make my life easy. More automation for me the better.

I run both Hydros and Apex. Both work well. I can't stand the Hydros Wifi power bars but the new XP8 will alleviate that problem (at a much higher cost.)

Neptune doesn't design anything with water in mind so be careful where you place the equipment. One rusty USB connection and you will likely fry the brain. Hydros equipment can take a splash (minus the power outlets but this should be common sense.)

The Neptune community is WAY bigger and WAY more readily available to help with issues. I don't find the "coding" hard at all. Neptune has Tasks that alleviates most of that now anyway. Don't let anyone use "no coding" as a selling point. The Hydros connected to my network way faster but learning the program was just as long as Neptune. There is no advantage to either side here. The advantage in coding with Neptune is doing more advanced things is already there waiting for you. If Hydros doesn't code it for you and add it to the app wtih an update, you are stuck.

Hydros is much cheaper to get started with though. Neptune is seriously falling behind here. Hopefully, they are working on something and just keeping it super quiet.

 

[Beez]

What lights work with APEX other than sky?

 

[HuduVudu]

Lucky I have time to do more research … lots too look at … the Hydros look pretty great too. I just don’t know … what I do know is I want to make my life easy. More automation for me the better.

If I were you I would wait until you have your tank has been up for a while. It is too common for new reefers to get lost in the numbers early on. They also fall into complacency because the numbers don't "mean" anything to them and they seem stable. It takes time for the tank to get a "load". It happens in layers. All of the automation in the world isn't going to help with this. If I were you I would spend money on test kits instead. Buy the base ones (alk, calcium, nitrate, phosphate) and watch those. Honestly those are about all you need for where your understanding is at now an where it will be far into the future.

It takes time to build real understanding and no amount of equipment buying will make this process faster or easier. This is such a common mistake that new people make.

 

[Sean Clark]

What lights work with APEX other than sky?

Newer Kessils for the win.

 

[Beez]

Newer Kessils for the win.

kessil the only ones?

 

[Sean Clark]

kessil the only ones?

There are others. Like anything that uses 1-10v control. I can't recommend any of them because I am biased...
Only the full Apex supports 1-10v control out of the box. Apex EL does not, you would need to buy a module.

 

[Beez]

Newer Kessils for the win.

I’ve been looking pretty hard at the Kessil AP9X … the shimmer looks amazing and the spread looks perfect for my size tank.

 

[Acros]

You should consider 2x Kessil a360x as well. The AP9X will leave a hotspot in between the two pucks, whereas you can space the a360x to avoid a hotspot.

 

[I.AM.MR.MIKE]

Yeah I’d say it depends how comfortable you are paying way too much for what boils down to pretty inexpensive technology. Look at what reefpi and robotank are doing for an example of what a lot of the tech actually costs, and that’s still retail. I mean $330 for a 2 head DOS pump?! I paid like $40 for my 4 head jebao.

That said, Neptune really is the Apple of the controller world IMO. The most polished, adaptable, and user friendly. The app is great, the level of control and customization is awesome.

What I would say is that just because you use an apex controller doesn’t mean you have to go all in. There are just some things you’re going to get dialed in, set, and forget like lights, wave pumps, auto top off, etc. So if you think Neptune offers the best price:quality ratios in those categories, sure, go for it. Otherwise I highly support the Apex and Trident stand-alone. Full disclosure I did opt for 2 DOS pumps because I just love automation that much and needed auto water change (bought one used though). I also went with the ATK because adapting my Tunze for a separated fish room was too much. I also think the Apex is great for a separated fish room because you only have to run 1 cable to communicate with all the fish room modules.

DOS - Stepper motors if you buy 500 at a time- $39 Controller board if you buy 500 at a time- $39 so right there is about $120. Then you have to make the shell, tubing and hardware and software to work with Apex. Then you have to provide warranty service. Employee benefits etc... Not as cheap as you would think. Every company I have worked for has had a 100% mark up on hardware. They do have sales a few times a year. This is all Chinese parts otherwise would be even more.

 

[I.AM.MR.MIKE]

I’ve been looking pretty hard at the Kessil AP9X … the shimmer looks amazing and the spread looks perfect for my size tank.

I did not like the AP9X at all. Sold at a loss. Stick with Radion or try out the new SKY. I recently switched to Sky from two G5 Pro because I like the integration with Apex. The Sky has a couple of issues like heat cycle clicking and popping and noticeable ramping and hotter in center but it looks great hanging above my tank and my coral (SPS) are really responding (Sucking up Alk and Cal like never before-Colors getting better).