New 180 Build - Mini Coop's Dream Tank

Diesel

ME=1, CANCER=0.
View Badges
Joined
Apr 14, 2012
Messages
13,613
Reaction score
16,448
Location
Katy
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
I must say it take courage to tackle a BIG build like this.
When you think you did enough reading, ask many many questions, started a build thread and hobbyist tell you all the right things................. and yet some questions go unanswered.
If you go on a budget and everyday something else pops up and you got to go deeper in the pocket cause you got this far and really there's now way back.
I remember sometimes only one thing............. make it like your life depends on it as it could be the last thing you ever do.
That might be for a lot overrated heavy words but I made it my own.

Question though, how much water volume (gallons) is in your pipes (Drains and return)?
Did you ever test the system and shut one drain off and see if the other will hold up for you?
You always can set a float switch on your DT as a last resort connected to your apex and linked to your return pump, just incase as it will shut your return pump off.
What's your failsafe for a E-drain? (emergency drain)
It's not a question of IF but more like a WHEN.
The flow in your tank could be plenty with the Gyre and vortech but try to create contra flow as you don't want to interfere with the flow what one pump does or vice versa.
 
OP
OP
Mini Coop

Mini Coop

Valuable Member
View Badges
Joined
Sep 20, 2016
Messages
1,276
Reaction score
1,534
Location
Columbus, Ohio
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Alright - we’ll, all leaks are good to go so far!
We have let the system run all last night and today and all is well!! We still need to play with the pipes to stop the gurgling (we didn’t have time today) but will do that before we start the full cycling! Tested nitrates and ammonia today just cause and all were 0. (Duh) but just testing.

My salinity is saying it’s at 1.027. So, I’ve run RODI as a top off several times and it hasn’t moved. ;Jawdrop I did a test to calibrate the refractometer and it said 0. I pulled out the old school plastic one and it said 1.025. And it seemed to work fine while I was mixing the water. So maybe it really is just going to take a lot more to get the salinity down.

Also, we shut down one of the drains today to test and make sure that if one drain gets clogged completely, we had an emergency drain. The overall level raised about 1/4” in the main tank (maybe less) but we let it go with one drain for 10 minutes and it worked fine! Good to know the emergency drain fail safe is there!

Next:
1. Mess with pipes
2. embark on the APEX set up journey. (Heaven help us). Any advice is welcome.
 

pluikens

Valuable Member
View Badges
Joined
Sep 11, 2017
Messages
1,107
Reaction score
702
Location
Minneapolis, MN
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Alright - we’ll, all leaks are good to go so far!
We have let the system run all last night and today and all is well!! We still need to play with the pipes to stop the gurgling (we didn’t have time today) but will do that before we start the full cycling! Tested nitrates and ammonia today just cause and all were 0. (Duh) but just testing.

My salinity is saying it’s at 1.027. So, I’ve run RODI as a top off several times and it hasn’t moved. ;Jawdrop I did a test to calibrate the refractometer and it said 0. I pulled out the old school plastic one and it said 1.025. And it seemed to work fine while I was mixing the water. So maybe it really is just going to take a lot more to get the salinity down.

Also, we shut down one of the drains today to test and make sure that if one drain gets clogged completely, we had an emergency drain. The overall level raised about 1/4” in the main tank (maybe less) but we let it go with one drain for 10 minutes and it worked fine! Good to know the emergency drain fail safe is there!

Next:
1. Mess with pipes
2. embark on the APEX set up journey. (Heaven help us). Any advice is welcome.
Do you have refractometer calibration solution so you're not calibrating to zero? I'd suggest using that before testing salinity. Also, topping off with RO water is what you should always be doing since the salt doesn't evaporate. To lower salinity in my system, I remove some salt water and let the ATO replace it with RO water.
 
OP
OP
Mini Coop

Mini Coop

Valuable Member
View Badges
Joined
Sep 20, 2016
Messages
1,276
Reaction score
1,534
Location
Columbus, Ohio
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Do you have refractometer calibration solution so you're not calibrating to zero? I'd suggest using that before testing salinity. Also, topping off with RO water is what you should always be doing since the salt doesn't evaporate. To lower salinity in my system, I remove some salt water and let the ATO replace it with RO water.

I don’t have the solution, no. But I can get some. And yes, I always top off with RODI, it just shouldn’t need a “top off” yet so I was adding more water to the overall volume of the tank. I want thinking of taking some of the saltwater out. So I will do that. I’m curing some rock right now, so I can use some of the removed water for that!
Thanks!!
 

Daniel Waters

Well-Known Member
View Badges
Joined
Dec 30, 2015
Messages
811
Reaction score
713
Location
Knoxville. TN
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Alright - we’ll, all leaks are good to go so far!
We have let the system run all last night and today and all is well!! We still need to play with the pipes to stop the gurgling (we didn’t have time today) but will do that before we start the full cycling! Tested nitrates and ammonia today just cause and all were 0. (Duh) but just testing.

My salinity is saying it’s at 1.027. So, I’ve run RODI as a top off several times and it hasn’t moved. ;Jawdrop So maybe it really is just going to take a lot more to get the salinity down.
When you say you have run RODI as top off several times, I'm assuming you mean you are adding more water to the overall system, as you'd want to be using RODI for your auto-top off water anyway (and normal auto top off will not impact your salinity if you are using RODI water). If you've reached your full tank and connected sumps volume levels, you need to remove saltwater and replace with RODI to lower your salinity. On 180 gallon system, you're going to probably need to remove 5 to 6 gallons of saltwater and replace with equal RODI to lower to 1.026. This is assuming you are confident in the 1.027 reading. 1.027 is perfectly fine and within an acceptable range, though.
 
OP
OP
Mini Coop

Mini Coop

Valuable Member
View Badges
Joined
Sep 20, 2016
Messages
1,276
Reaction score
1,534
Location
Columbus, Ohio
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Yes. I meant add water to the system - not top off. Sorry - amazing how choice of words can change things! Never run a system this large before, so I suppose that would make sense. Probably have a total of 300 gallons. It didn’t occur to me to remove any of the water (duh). I’m pretty sure the reading is right now. I just tested the QT tank salinity and it was 1.025. So it must be working fine!
 

Daniel Waters

Well-Known Member
View Badges
Joined
Dec 30, 2015
Messages
811
Reaction score
713
Location
Knoxville. TN
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
300 total gallons...nice! You'd probably have to remove 8+ gallons of saltwater and replace with RODI to move your salinity down by 1 pt. I think the lesson here is you can see how having a large system can be inherently more stable. Once you get your parameters all in line, it takes a lot more effort to shift a particular parameter one direction or another!
 
OP
OP
Mini Coop

Mini Coop

Valuable Member
View Badges
Joined
Sep 20, 2016
Messages
1,276
Reaction score
1,534
Location
Columbus, Ohio
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
300 total gallons...nice! You'd probably have to remove 8+ gallons of saltwater and replace with RODI to move your salinity down by 1 pt. I think the lesson here is you can see how having a large system can be inherently more stable. Once you get your parameters all in line, it takes a lot more effort to shift a particular parameter one direction or another!

Well, I’m glad to see it’s working already!! That was kind of the idea!! Haha.
 

pluikens

Valuable Member
View Badges
Joined
Sep 11, 2017
Messages
1,107
Reaction score
702
Location
Minneapolis, MN
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
If you're curious... with 300 gallons at 1.027, removing 22 gallons of 1.027 water and replacing it with RO water will result in a system salinity of 1.025. I often refer to https://www.hamzasreef.com/Contents/Calculators/ResultingSalinity.php and the other calculators by Hamza when making adjustments to my salinity. Lots of useful stuff there!
 

dansreef

Well-Known Member
View Badges
Joined
May 29, 2012
Messages
628
Reaction score
1,407
Location
Gilberts, IL
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
just a friendly note... You have a 180.... with a 100 gal rubber maid tub for a sump.... then a 20 gal for the glass tank. While this may equal up to a total of 300 possible gals of capacity, reality is much less. You need to subtract the displacement of rock, sand and any equipment. I have a roughly similar system and I estimate total water volume of about 225 gals. This takes into account all the rock, sand, skimmer in the sump.... and the fact that I probably only fill my 100 gal sump about 1/2 full at any time.... btw... by doing so it gives a buffer in the sump if power goes out and the display tank need to drain some into the basement sump before the returns siphon breaks. Just another one of those things you can learn the hard way if you are not careful.

Why is this important? The calculations you do in the future and such as Pluikens is providing you above wont be accurate if you use the larger total volume potential. Also... as you get further along and need to dose something.... the closer you can be to your total water volume the more exact you can be with your dosage amounts. My guess is you also are around 225 gals based on the amount of rock you are using in your display...and assuming you load up your sump as I have.
 

Diesel

ME=1, CANCER=0.
View Badges
Joined
Apr 14, 2012
Messages
13,613
Reaction score
16,448
Location
Katy
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
IMO, you doing just great.
SG isn't as much important as you still cycling and I think you really didn't start up to really cycle your tank yet.
You doing still a lot of tweaking on plumbing and other stuff.
That said don't worry about your 1,o27 as when you cycle that # will come down by itself.
Many ppl freak out if their tank level drops below the 1.025 or for that matter they will go over it.
You (Mrs Mysis) as I know that you don't freak out and if corals and fish are involved it won't matter that much.
I had my full SPS tank ran for 8 months on 1.022 and to prove it even more ran it for 6 months on 1,030 with no effects on color or PE.
I think right now my tank sits to low and I'm supriced it sits at 1.o20 with only the ATO going but no new salt water coming in for a long time and yet the skimmer is taking water out which results in slowly drop of my SG and the corals are perfectly fine with that.
In any time always target to get as close to 1.025 SG but in this stage you are fine.
Cycle that tank and you'll see what a difference it makes.
 
OP
OP
Mini Coop

Mini Coop

Valuable Member
View Badges
Joined
Sep 20, 2016
Messages
1,276
Reaction score
1,534
Location
Columbus, Ohio
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
just a friendly note... You have a 180.... with a 100 gal rubber maid tub for a sump.... then a 20 gal for the glass tank. While this may equal up to a total of 300 possible gals of capacity, reality is much less. You need to subtract the displacement of rock, sand and any equipment. I have a roughly similar system and I estimate total water volume of about 225 gals. This takes into account all the rock, sand, skimmer in the sump.... and the fact that I probably only fill my 100 gal sump about 1/2 full at any time.... btw... by doing so it gives a buffer in the sump if power goes out and the display tank need to drain some into the basement sump before the returns siphon breaks. Just another one of those things you can learn the hard way if you are not careful.

Why is this important? The calculations you do in the future and such as Pluikens is providing you above wont be accurate if you use the larger total volume potential. Also... as you get further along and need to dose something.... the closer you can be to your total water volume the more exact you can be with your dosage amounts. My guess is you also are around 225 gals based on the amount of rock you are using in your display...and assuming you load up your sump as I have.

Yes. you are probably right. About 225-250 I am thinking. The glass is 44 long and 1/2 full and the trough is about 1/2 full. So 225 is probably a great estimate. I appreciate the information!
 
OP
OP
Mini Coop

Mini Coop

Valuable Member
View Badges
Joined
Sep 20, 2016
Messages
1,276
Reaction score
1,534
Location
Columbus, Ohio
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
IMO, you doing just great.
SG isn't as much important as you still cycling and I think you really didn't start up to really cycle your tank yet.
You doing still a lot of tweaking on plumbing and other stuff.
That said don't worry about your 1,o27 as when you cycle that # will come down by itself.
Many ppl freak out if their tank level drops below the 1.025 or for that matter they will go over it.
You (Mrs Mysis) as I know that you don't freak out and if corals and fish are involved it won't matter that much.
I had my full SPS tank ran for 8 months on 1.022 and to prove it even more ran it for 6 months on 1,030 with no effects on color or PE.
I think right now my tank sits to low and I'm supriced it sits at 1.o20 with only the ATO going but no new salt water coming in for a long time and yet the skimmer is taking water out which results in slowly drop of my SG and the corals are perfectly fine with that.
In any time always target to get as close to 1.025 SG but in this stage you are fine.
Cycle that tank and you'll see what a difference it makes.

Thank you, Mr. Diesel. I will stick with the 1.027 right now as it isn't that far off. No, haven't started the official cycle yet, still messing with pipes.

So - here is the durso we have. I messed with it tonight doing the chart that was sent - one completely open pipe lower in the overflow, with the other durso turned down to about 5%. The water level didn't rise in the open pipe section, and it was even louder than the durso . . . but we tried it! This is the picture of what came with the tank. The thing I was noticing tonight is the 3 holes in the side of the pipe at the top. However, when we closed these off, the water level would rise and lower, like it was flushing. And was still loud.

Screen Shot 2018-01-08 at 7.57.38 PM.png
 
OP
OP
Mini Coop

Mini Coop

Valuable Member
View Badges
Joined
Sep 20, 2016
Messages
1,276
Reaction score
1,534
Location
Columbus, Ohio
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Well, I went tonight to my in-laws and got 3 of my corals that I am going to be keeping. My leather, my duncan and my acans. Being the good girl I am trying to be - I brought them home, did coral dip in coral RX for 10 minutes, rinsed and put them in QT. I know I have bristle worms in the old tank (no big deal). I don't think I have anything else in there, but just to be safe, I am QT'ing all corals. Dip every 4 days, will QT for 45 days. These poor guys were NOT happy. But they are starting to come out and have only been in QT for about 2 hours. My acans weren't happy when I picked them up tonight, so not sure what is going on with them.

Also took this opportunity tonight to label my buckets! I don't want to risk mixing any equipment at all - so they are now labeled. Nothing from the QT table goes near the main tank.

Fishies are doing well tonight! The awesome thing is that I tried the Fritz turbo start with the QT tanks first. I have had a TERRIBLE time with ammonia in my QT tanks. I am constantly doing water changes. The fish have now been in QT for about a week with zero spikes, and the tank even appears to be cycling - I am getting a diatom bloom! :) I thought that was pretty cool! They will get a water change tonight after I feed them just for good measure! :)
IMG_4258.JPG
IMG_4261.JPG
IMG_4264.JPG
IMG_4265.JPG
IMG_4266.JPG
IMG_4268.JPG
 

cycled123

Active Member
View Badges
Joined
Nov 22, 2016
Messages
395
Reaction score
358
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
I like the labeling bucket idea with dip and rinse too. We just have QT and DT. Might need to get a few more buckets...
 

Diesel

ME=1, CANCER=0.
View Badges
Joined
Apr 14, 2012
Messages
13,613
Reaction score
16,448
Location
Katy
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Well, I went tonight to my in-laws and got 3 of my corals that I am going to be keeping. My leather, my duncan and my acans. Being the good girl I am trying to be - I brought them home, did coral dip in coral RX for 10 minutes, rinsed and put them in QT. I know I have bristle worms in the old tank (no big deal). I don't think I have anything else in there, but just to be safe, I am QT'ing all corals. Dip every 4 days, will QT for 45 days. These poor guys were NOT happy. But they are starting to come out and have only been in QT for about 2 hours. My acans weren't happy when I picked them up tonight, so not sure what is going on with them.

Also took this opportunity tonight to label my buckets! I don't want to risk mixing any equipment at all - so they are now labeled. Nothing from the QT table goes near the main tank.

Fishies are doing well tonight! The awesome thing is that I tried the Fritz turbo start with the QT tanks first. I have had a TERRIBLE time with ammonia in my QT tanks. I am constantly doing water changes. The fish have now been in QT for about a week with zero spikes, and the tank even appears to be cycling - I am getting a diatom bloom! :) I thought that was pretty cool! They will get a water change tonight after I feed them just for good measure! :)
IMG_4258.JPG
IMG_4261.JPG
IMG_4264.JPG
IMG_4265.JPG
IMG_4266.JPG
IMG_4268.JPG

That's the way to go.
Matter the fact can I hire you and you do my tank as yours and I promise that I won't get rid of the Diesel tank next month ;)
 
OP
OP
Mini Coop

Mini Coop

Valuable Member
View Badges
Joined
Sep 20, 2016
Messages
1,276
Reaction score
1,534
Location
Columbus, Ohio
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Ok - update for today - my amazing LFS guy - I called him to see if he could stop by and see the drains. He didn't have time, so I sent some videos. Apparently I just had WAY too much water draining through the 1" pipes - I didn't understand the physics of turning dow the return would slow the drains!!!!

I turned the ball valve that is after the return pump about a 1/4 turn, and SILENCE!!!! YEAHHHHHHH!!!!!
So - next step - make the screens for the top of the tank

Meanwhile - start setting up apex.

Then I will be ready for turbo start and the cycle start!! YAHHOOOOOO!!!!
 

A worm with high fashion and practical utility: Have you ever kept feather dusters in your reef aquarium?

  • I currently have feather dusters in my tank.

    Votes: 66 37.5%
  • Not currently, but I have had feather dusters in my tank in the past.

    Votes: 59 33.5%
  • I have not had feather dusters, but I hope to in the future.

    Votes: 25 14.2%
  • I have no plans to have feather dusters in my tank.

    Votes: 26 14.8%
  • Other.

    Votes: 0 0.0%
Back
Top