New and need advice

[amoon]

My 75 gallon tank has been up and running for 3 and a half weeks now, started with a dose of microbacter, about 25lbs live rock (and 25lbs dry rock), live sand, and seachem matrix in the sump (no skimmer). Added a pair of baby clowns right away. Parameters have been consistently - ph7.8ish, nitrites 0, nitrates 0 and ammonia has wavered between 0 and 0.25. After a week my LFS suggested adding turbo start since there had been no ammonia spike and they didn’t believe that the cycle had ever started. Still no ammonia spike, or any other change in parameters so I added a royal gramma a week later in the hopes of adding more ammonia to cause the spike to get the cycle going. A week and a half later and parameters are still the same, all the fish seem ok. Testing with API.
I’m hesitant to add any more fish if the cycle hasn’t truly happened yet, but not really sure what’s going on. Thank you in advance!

 

[Azedenkae]

My 75 gallon tank has been up and running for 3 and a half weeks now, started with a dose of microbacter, about 25lbs live rock (and 25lbs dry rock), live sand, and seachem matrix in the sump (no skimmer). Added a pair of baby clowns right away. Parameters have been consistently - ph7.8ish, nitrites 0, nitrates 0 and ammonia has wavered between 0 and 0.25. After a week my LFS suggested adding turbo start since there had been no ammonia spike and they didn’t believe that the cycle had ever started. Still no ammonia spike, or any other change in parameters so I added a royal gramma a week later in the hopes of adding more ammonia to cause the spike to get the cycle going. A week and a half later and parameters are still the same, all the fish seem ok. Testing with API.
I’m hesitant to add any more fish if the cycle hasn’t truly happened yet, but not really sure what’s going on. Thank you in advance!

You will only see an ammonia spike if 1. you added enough ammonia for there to be a spike, and 2. there is not enough nitrifiers in your aquarium to oxidize all that ammonia prior to registering the spike.

If you started with live rock or 'pre-cycled' biomedia, then there may already be enough nitrifiers to handle all the ammonia produced, and so you won't see a spike. Think about it as if you transferred all your stuff from one tank to another - you would not expect everything to be undone right? Same concept.

If your LFS thinks there has to be an ammonia spike no matter what, I'd suggest a new LFS. Because yeah, your 'cycle' may never actually happen in this case.

The question is, how well is your nitrifiers in the tank currently handling ammonia (ignore the fact that you sometimes read 0.25ppm, I presume you are using the API test kit - that is very common even for 100% cycled aquariums). Anyways, this would have been super easy to test if there are no fish, but that's not the case anymore.

It's fine.

Your tank has been up almost a month now, and given ammonia and nitrite is at 0 or close enough, your aquarium can at least handle whatever stock you have at the moment. My recommendation then is probably go slow with fish stocking, adding one or two at a time since we don't exactly know how well the nitrifiers are 'established'.

P.S. Nitrate readings at 0 is a bit unusual. Do you have corals, algae, or something that may be using up the nitrates?

 

[amoon]

You will only see an ammonia spike if 1. you added enough ammonia for there to be a spike, and 2. there is not enough nitrifiers in your aquarium to oxidize all that ammonia prior to registering the spike.

If you started with live rock or 'pre-cycled' biomedia, then there may already be enough nitrifiers to handle all the ammonia produced, and so you won't see a spike. Think about it as if you transferred all your stuff from one tank to another - you would not expect everything to be undone right? Same concept.

If your LFS thinks there has to be an ammonia spike no matter what, I'd suggest a new LFS. Because yeah, your 'cycle' may never actually happen in this case.

The question is, how well is your nitrifiers in the tank currently handling ammonia (ignore the fact that you sometimes read 0.25ppm, I presume you are using the API test kit - that is very common even for 100% cycled aquariums). Anyways, this would have been super easy to test if there are no fish, but that's not the case anymore.

It's fine.

Your tank has been up almost a month now, and given ammonia and nitrite is at 0 or close enough, your aquarium can at least handle whatever stock you have at the moment. My recommendation then is probably go slow with fish stocking, adding one or two at a time since we don't exactly know how well the nitrifiers are 'established'.

P.S. Nitrate readings at 0 is a bit unusual. Do you have corals, algae, or something that may be using up the nitrates?

 

[amoon]

This is so helpful, thank you! No corals or algae, at the moment running without lights.

 

[Rmckoy]

You will only see an ammonia spike if 1. you added enough ammonia for there to be a spike, and 2. there is not enough nitrifiers in your aquarium to oxidize all that ammonia prior to registering the spike.

If you started with live rock or 'pre-cycled' biomedia, then there may already be enough nitrifiers to handle all the ammonia produced, and so you won't see a spike. Think about it as if you transferred all your stuff from one tank to another - you would not expect everything to be undone right? Same concept.

If your LFS thinks there has to be an ammonia spike no matter what, I'd suggest a new LFS. Because yeah, your 'cycle' may never actually happen in this case.

The question is, how well is your nitrifiers in the tank currently handling ammonia (ignore the fact that you sometimes read 0.25ppm, I presume you are using the API test kit - that is very common even for 100% cycled aquariums). Anyways, this would have been super easy to test if there are no fish, but that's not the case anymore.

It's fine.

Your tank has been up almost a month now, and given ammonia and nitrite is at 0 or close enough, your aquarium can at least handle whatever stock you have at the moment. My recommendation then is probably go slow with fish stocking, adding one or two at a time since we don't exactly know how well the nitrifiers are 'established'.

P.S. Nitrate readings at 0 is a bit unusual. Do you have corals, algae, or something that may be using up the nitrates?

Everything points to a “instant cycle “ with the few fish , and the bottle of microbactor .
but I believe 0 ppm nitrate is a test error

 

[Uncle99]

My 75 gallon tank has been up and running for 3 and a half weeks now, started with a dose of microbacter, about 25lbs live rock (and 25lbs dry rock), live sand, and seachem matrix in the sump (no skimmer). Added a pair of baby clowns right away. Parameters have been consistently - ph7.8ish, nitrites 0, nitrates 0 and ammonia has wavered between 0 and 0.25. After a week my LFS suggested adding turbo start since there had been no ammonia spike and they didn’t believe that the cycle had ever started. Still no ammonia spike, or any other change in parameters so I added a royal gramma a week later in the hopes of adding more ammonia to cause the spike to get the cycle going. A week and a half later and parameters are still the same, all the fish seem ok. Testing with API.
I’m hesitant to add any more fish if the cycle hasn’t truly happened yet, but not really sure what’s going on. Thank you in advance!

Initial cycle must have been complete or the fish would have died by now.

 

[MaxTremors]

Yeah, the ‘0’ nitrates is unusual (have you been doing a lot of water changes?). The lack of an ammonia spike isn’t concerning if you started with ample live rock, bottled bac, and light stocking. I would invest in some better testing kits and verify where your nitrates actually are before adding a bunch of stock, but if it’s confirmed to be zero or within the acceptable range, I don’t see any issue with starting to slowly stock the tank.

 

[Azedenkae]

Everything points to a “instant cycle “ with the few fish , and the bottle of microbactor .
but I believe 0 ppm nitrate is a test error

Yes I agree. I do think it is an 'instant cycle'. Just slightly hesitant to call it as such in case it is read as an invitation to fully stock the tank right away and happen to be that nitrifiers can't quite handle that yet.

But yeah I also believe 0ppm nitrate is a test error. But without knowing the full setup, I am not 100% sure.

 

[amoon]

Yeah, the ‘0’ nitrates is unusual (have you been doing a lot of water changes?). The lack of an ammonia spike isn’t concerning if you started with ample live rock, bottled bac, and light stocking. I would invest in some better testing kits and verify where your nitrates actually are before adding a bunch of stock, but if it’s confirmed to be zero or within the acceptable range, I don’t see any issue with starting to slowly stock the tank.

 

[amoon]

No water changes yet. I will look into better tests, what would you recommend?

 

[amoon]

Yes I agree. I do think it is an 'instant cycle'. Just slightly hesitant to call it as such in case it is read as an invitation to fully stock the tank right away and happen to be that nitrifiers can't quite handle that yet.

But yeah I also believe 0ppm nitrate is a test error. But without knowing the full setup, I am not 100% sure.

I am definitely happy to play it safe when stocking the tank. What test would you recommend for better nitrate reading? Thank you!

 

[MaxTremors]

I am definitely happy to play it safe when stocking the tank. What test would you recommend for better nitrate reading? Thank you!

Either Nyos, Salifert, or the Hanna checker (a lot of people don’t like the Hanna because it’s kind of a process, personally I like it just because I can’t stand color matching tests).

 

[Azedenkae]

I am definitely happy to play it safe when stocking the tank. What test would you recommend for better nitrate reading? Thank you!

I mean normally I am happy with the API nitrate test kit, so I don't have a suggestion for an alternative. XD Somebody else will be able to chime in with better suggestions lol.

 

[amoon]

I mean normally I am happy with the API nitrate test kit, so I don't have a suggestion for an alternative. XD Somebody else will be able to chime in with better suggestions lol.

No worries! Thank you so much for all of your input!

 

[Rmckoy]

I like salifert for nitrate .
hanna is a pain in the butt if your nitrates are above 4ppm .

salifert is a little tricky to determine the colour difference . But you can confirm by looking through the side and dividing it to equal the same number .
So example : if you think it’s 10ppm looking down .
durn it to look through the side and it will be darker ( should match 100ppm colour

 

[amoon]

I like salifert for nitrate .
hanna is a pain in the butt if your nitrates are above 4ppm .

salifert is a little tricky to determine the colour difference . But you can confirm by looking through the side and dividing it to equal the same number .
So example : if you think it’s 10ppm looking down .
durn it to look through the side and it will be darker ( should match 100ppm colour

This is great info, thank you!