New blue eye kole tang with light spots

[Idech]

Above all the meds you tried, this needs to be verified. This fish is obviously under stress and Hypo will work as will ruby Rally pro which is reef safe and will turn water green

Ruby reef rally pro was received frozen and is useless. I tried it anyways, as the company said it wouldn’t hurt. But I won’t use it again.

I can’t use hypo salinity in my DT ad I have corals and one anemone.

 

[Idech]

I ordered Copper power blue and API copper test kit (the only one available that would get here quick).

If I can catch the fish, I’ll treat it in copper.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I see tiny white spots and dust on him though. Isn’t that a proof of ich ?

I’ve just not been able to see it in the videos. Velvet would have killed the fish by now. Ich produces salt sized white spots that change in number fro day to day, but generally increasing in number over time. I’m not sure what the dust is that you are seeing - possibly excess mucus?

edit: I went through and reread the whole thread. In the still photos #2 and 3, I can see some possible ich spots on its left pectoral fin. So - given that you are in Canada your choices are pretty limited - continue with reef safe meds or treat the fish with hypo salinity. I don’t have a lot of faith in the reef safe meds, but maybe?

Jay

 

[vetteguy53081]

I ordered Copper power blue and API copper test kit (the only one available that would get here quick).

If I can catch the fish, I’ll treat it in copper.

Hypo best bet and would require a simple starter tank kit with the basics. to determine you will treat in the display only will have ill effects. I realize QT is not feasible for many aquarists but in a country as yours, UK and Australia, with limited treatment access- Its a must

 

[Idech]

Hypo best bet and would require a simple starter tank kit with the basics. to determine you will treat in the display only will have ill effects. I realize QT is not feasible for many aquarists but in a country as yours, UK and Australia, with limited treatment access- Its a must

Okay, I’ll look into hypo too. I suppose you don’t just drop the fish into 1.009 water…

 

[vetteguy53081]

Okay, I’ll look into hypo too. I suppose you don’t just drop the fish into 1.009 water…

no but you place them in tank at regular salinity and bail out a quart, add a quart of RODI at same temp and periodically repeat until salinity is reached

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Okay, I’ll look into hypo too. I suppose you don’t just drop the fish into 1.009 water…

Here is a write up on hypo:

Hyposalinity

Hyposalinity Jay Hemdal 2021 This term refers to a long-term bath treatment for marine fishes in which the salt content of the water is lowered and held below the point that certain parasites can survive. The salt level reached, and the time of the treatment are the two variables...

www.reef2reef.com

Jay

 

[Idech]

Here is a write up on hypo:

Hyposalinity

Hyposalinity Jay Hemdal 2021 This term refers to a long-term bath treatment for marine fishes in which the salt content of the water is lowered and held below the point that certain parasites can survive. The salt level reached, and the time of the treatment are the two variables...

www.reef2reef.com

Jay

Thank you so much ! I managed to catch the fish when the lights were out. It was swimming in the flow.

I put it into a 5 gallons tank with a place to hide, filter with seeded bio media, heater and power head aimed at the surface. I lowered salinity to 1.022 but it was late and I had to stop.

I’ll read your article so I’m ready for tomorrow.

 

[Idech]

@Jay Hemdal I read your article quickly (it’s late, will read again tomorrow) but now I know hypo is not for velvet.

I need someone to help me determine if this is velvet or ich. I know you said ich kills fast, but I have read stories where some fish can last months. I haven’t seen my firefish since early afternoon, so I’m wondering if it died. It showed no symptoms (being white).

Anyways, here at the tang symptoms :

- white powder
- clutters of very tiny specs (not as big as ich and in much greater number. The fish is covered)
- erratic swimming
- swimming in front of the outlet

The first tang that died had cloudy eyes near the end. Is that a sign or ich also or only velvet ?

It’s still eating well but his behavior is definitely not normal.

I will be receiving Copper power blue tomorrow (hopefully not frozen).

I also have just enough Prazipro to treat my display a second time (for eggs, in case the fish also had flukes. The first dose took care of the dark patches on his skin). Should I use that in the 5 gallons ? If I do I won’t have enough left for the DT and won’t be able to buy more for a while. It would freeze.

Last, I have General Cure and Malachite green.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

@Jay Hemdal I read your article quickly (it’s late, will read again tomorrow) but now I know hypo is not for velvet.

I need someone to help me determine if this is velvet or ich. I know you said ich kills fast, but I have read stories where some fish can last months. I haven’t seen my firefish since early afternoon, so I’m wondering if it died. It showed no symptoms (being white).

Anyways, here at the tang symptoms :

- white powder
- clutters of very tiny specs (not as big as ich and in much greater number. The fish is covered)
- erratic swimming
- swimming in front of the outlet

The first tang that died had cloudy eyes near the end. Is that a sign or ich also or only velvet ?

It’s still eating well but his behavior is definitely not normal.

I will be receiving Copper power blue tomorrow (hopefully not frozen).

I also have just enough Prazipro to treat my display a second time (for eggs, in case the fish also had flukes. The first dose took care of the dark patches on his skin). Should I use that in the 5 gallons ? If I do I won’t have enough left for the DT and won’t be able to buy more for a while. It would freeze.

Last, I have General Cure and Malachite green.

No, that's backwards - velvet kills quickly and ich can linger on. I just cannot see how this could be velvet - we are going on 3 weeks now, velvet typically kills fish in less than 72 hours after people notice the symptoms (perhaps 5 days if you are good at catching the early symptoms). Ich can linger longer - typically 10 days in serious outbreaks, but it can linger for months in some cases. Flukes are similar to ich in their timing.

The key symptoms for velvet are: rapid breathing and lack of appeitite. I do not see those being listed above.

Velvet does not show as spots - that is erroneous information that is posted all over the internet, but it stems from two things: freshwater velvet (a different organism) does show spots and people think since they have the same name, they will look the same. Then, "stale ich", that is, ich that has been simmering a long time, has smaller, less distinct spots. This seems to be a result of the fish's skin becoming congested and a bit cloudy, obscuring the normally distinct spots. People almost always misidentify that as "velvet".

In severe cases of velvet, when the fish are close to death, you will see a general haze on the fish, but the "spots" will be indistinct.

Either way - getting fish into coppersafe or copper power ASAP is the best course of action.

Jay

 

[Idech]

No, that's backwards - velvet kills quickly and ich can linger on. I just cannot see how this could be velvet - we are going on 3 weeks now, velvet typically kills fish in less than 72 hours after people notice the symptoms (perhaps 5 days if you are good at catching the early symptoms).

Sorry, I meant to say velvet. Waiting on my Copper power; it’s supposed to be here before 8 pm.

Thanks again, I’ll keep you posted.

 

[Idech]

@Jay Hemdal if the tang makes it after 30 days of Copper power, can he be returned in the display tank where I still have 2 fish that I can’t catch ?

If not I guess I’ll have to rehome him.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

@Jay Hemdal if the tang makes it after 30 days of Copper power, can he be returned in the display tank where I still have 2 fish that I can’t catch ?

If not I guess I’ll have to rehome him.

That’s tough to say, at minimum it should be out of the tank for 45 days, but the two remaining fish, while presumably symptom free could conceivably still be maintaining an active population of this parasite.
Jay

 

[Idech]

The tang has been in copper for 3-4 days but ramping up to 2.5 ppm finished today.

I don’t know how these poor animals can stand being in copper for so many days. Just mixing 1-2 ml in water gave me a mega headache. :-(

I’ve decided to go for the 14 days treatment and 14 days in observation in a different tank without copper.

Then I have to decide if I take the risk of putting him back in the same tank with the same fish, or if I rehome him with someone whose tank most probably also has ich. Since we don’t have meds available here, it seems most people have to deal with ich in their tanks. That’s just how it is.

That’s what you call a lose-lose situation.

 

[Idech]

Update : after 17 days in Copper safe (14 at 2.0-2.5 ppm) I decided to put the tang directly in the display. It was looking very bad and I thought if he had a chance to make it, the display would be the place he needed to go.

It’s been a month now since the transfer. There is still ich in the tank, since I never went fallow, but the UV (and maybe other measures I have taken) has helped keep it to a manageable level.

As soon as he entered the tank, the tang went from pale beige/white to dark purple. He started swimming fast and cruising between the rocks. That made me smile and I knew he had a chance. He did have a few white spots (1 to 3) on him a few times, but they disappear quickly.

He eats like a pig and is doing really well. He still has the round spots he had when I got him but they are not getting bigger. I am still fearful he will get ill but less and less.

Here he is today (sorry I didn’t take the time to turn on the whites, as he is fast to hide) :