Paravortex?

ReefStick · Jun 16, 2017

Humblefish said:
Are the black specks completely gone now?

I'm not sure what that white dot is. Might just be where he rubbed up against some rocks or got slightly damaged in the net.

It seems like there is still tiny specks right below and along his dorsal fin and right above his pectoral behind the gill seems dark still, maybe not quite as dark but his color is darker right now.

melypr1985 · Jun 16, 2017

If the black dots didn't come off in the freshwater dip, then it's not black ich. Most of them would have disappeared in the dip if so. It could just be his pigment/coloring or something bacterial yet mild. I think I'd suggest vitamins in the food at this point and watching him to see if anything changes.

4FordFamily · Jun 16, 2017

melypr1985 said:
If the black dots didn't come off in the freshwater dip, then it's not black ich. Most of them would have disappeared in the dip if so. It could just be his pigment/coloring or something bacterial yet mild. I think I'd suggest vitamins in the food at this point and watching him to see if anything changes.

I agree with this. I would have kanaplex, furan 2, and metroplex on hand in case, however.

ReefStick · Jun 22, 2017

ReefStick · Jun 22, 2017

Six days now and the specks have returned, all over this time. As of yesterday what seems like ich has developed on the pectoral fins as well. Just looking for a prognosis, will research myself to remedy if need be. Would love to treat the DT but seems as though that may not be possible. Getting a QT set up later today.

Humblefish · Jun 22, 2017

ReefStick said:
Six days now and the specks have returned, all over this time. As of yesterday what seems like ich has developed on the pectoral fins as well. Just looking for a prognosis, will research myself to remedy if need be. Would love to treat the DT but seems as though that may not be possible. Getting a QT set up later today.

OK those look more like turbellarians now, which is usually treatable via Prazipro - a reef safe medication. Sometimes turbellarians can be prazi resistant, and you'll have to resort to using hyposalinity or even formalin to completely eradicate them.

I can also see "white dots" on the pectoral fin, but I'm unsure whether that's ich or velvet.

ReefStick · Jun 22, 2017

Based on symptoms it seems like I'm dealing with ich here. There is no sensitivity to light and everyone including the tang is eating just the same as always. I am going to continue to monitor and have all recommended medications on hand for either treatment. I am going to look over your QT set-up guide and get something started.

I see that a fallow period of 76 days is recommended. Am I mad man for already considering the introduction of coral while all my fish are in QT? (Currently running a FOWLR)

Humblefish · Jun 22, 2017

ReefStick said:
I see that a fallow period of 76 days is recommended. Am I mad man for already considering the introduction of coral while all my fish are in QT? (Currently running a FOWLR)

The main downside would be having to restart the fallow period to account for any tomonts on the corals. So, I would do it sooner rather than later.

Also, some claim nutrient levels drop too low for certain corals without fish in the tank. So be sure to spot/ghost feed, and also test for nitrates periodically.

ReefStick · Jun 22, 2017

Was hoping that wasn't the case, very thorough. Thanks.

Would I be right in assuming that it is ich based on my observations? I have noticed my flame angels fins having the white spots now. Upon very close observation the tang seems to have the spots over his body, not sure they qualify as dust particles in size though.

Humblefish · Jun 22, 2017

ReefStick said:
Would I be right in assuming that it is ich based on my observations? I have noticed my flame angels fins having the white spots now. Upon very close observation the tang seems to have the spots over his body, not sure they qualify as dust particles in size though.

Ich white spots are typically larger, oval shaped and can be counted on the fish. Velvet is small, perfectly round and often too numerous to count. Examples below.

ICH

VELVET

ReefStick · Jun 22, 2017

I'm having a really hard time diagnosing this one guys, being as how you've seen so many more cases than myself I have to ask. I'm leaning towards ich.

I have Formalin, Copper, antibiotics the whole deal to treat either. I would like to treat only what needs to be treated though.

My flame angel and PBT are the only ones showing symptoms at this point, QT just them or the whole tank?

Humblefish · Jun 22, 2017

ReefStick said:
My flame angel and PBT are the only ones showing symptoms at this point, QT just them or the whole tank?

Personally, I would treat all fish, go fallow, the whole nine yards. Be done with this. But start with the Flame & PBT if you are dealing with logistical concerns i.e. where to house all the fish in QT.

FWIW; I think that's probably ich as well. The white spots are so numerous because it's an Acanthurus Tang. But I would treat with copper or CP just to be safe (velvet).

ReefStick · Jun 23, 2017

Thank you for the advice. I plan on running fallow for a few months.

Starting with the PBT and Flame I am going to give FW dips, Quick Cure Baths and place them in a 20G medicated with Coppersafe.

While they are in QT over the next couple of days I am going to set up my 45G as a more permanent QT for them during the extended fallow period.

Once the 45G is set up I am considering another dip and bath for the PBT and Flame before adding to the 45 that will also be dosed with Coppersafe.

Once PBT and Flame are transferred to 45 I will repeat the process for my other inhabitants, two Ocellaris, three Green Chromis and a six line wrasse.

The PBTs turbellarian has become very noticeable in the morning before the lights kick on now. So I am also battling that. I'm confident these measures will eradicate them from the fish but as for my DT I am reading they can be very hard to get rid of. What are your thoughts?

Does this seem like a solid regiment and would you have any suggestions beyond this.

Also during the fallow period will my inverts not harbor any of these parasites or worms? I have crabs, snails and one cleaned shrimp.

Humblefish · Jun 23, 2017

ReefStick said:
The PBTs turbellarian has become very noticeable in the morning before the lights kick on now. So I am also battling that. I'm confident these measures will eradicate them from the fish but as for my DT I am reading they can be very hard to get rid of. What are your thoughts?

The fallow period you are planning will starve them out.

ReefStick said:
Also during the fallow period will my inverts not harbor any of these parasites or worms? I have crabs, snails and one cleaned shrimp.

Ich tomonts are probably still attached to any hard surface (including snail shells, crab/shrimp exoskeletons); but before the fallow period is up these tomonts will rupture and release theronts (free swimmers) into the water column. When the theronts don't find fish to feed upon, they'll die within 48 hrs.

ngoodermuth · Jun 23, 2017

I do agree that it looks like ich, and black ich together. It sounds like you have a solid plan though, I hope it all works out for you! Good luck!

ReefStick · Jun 25, 2017

Getting ready to dip and bath before introducing to QT. Everything is set up and ready to go I am having trouble finding info on if the formalin bath should be made up with saltwater or freshwater. I assume it's saltwater as nothing is indicating otherwise.

ReefStick · Jun 25, 2017

Humblefish said:
The fallow period you are planning will starve them out.

Ich tomonts are probably still attached to any hard surface (including snail shells, crab/shrimp exoskeletons); but before the fallow period is up these tomonts will rupture and release theronts (free swimmers) into the water column. When the theronts don't find fish to feed upon, they'll die within 48 hrs.

Would it be ok to dose the QT with Prazi after the Formalin bath to account for the Turbellarian worms as well?

ngoodermuth · Jun 25, 2017

Formalin

https://www.reef2reef.com/index.php?threads/Formalin.290925/

You should match the SG in your QT.

It's fine to dose the Prazi after, but I would personally give it a little time to recover in between.