Phytoplankton Life In Reef Tank

geeked

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Unlike the ocean it's very difficult to get phytoplankton to reproduce in our closed loop tank systems from the info I've read on the internet hence the reason we must dose it.
That wouldn't make much sense. If they can be bred in a glass jar and bubbler with a tiny bit of light, they can be easily bred in a reef aquarium.
 

fryman

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That wouldn't make much sense. If they can be bred in a glass jar and bubbler with a tiny bit of light, they can be easily bred in a reef aquarium.
They cannot, unless you disinfect that reef aquarium, which would kinda defeat the purpose of a reef aquarium display.

Biodiversity means predators. Phyto is bottom of the food chain, so many things eat it. If you let predators in that glass jar, no more phyto either.

*edit* Predators come in all forms. Most of the predators crashing phyto cultures are microscopic, so you won't see them unless you get a microscope. Things that can float in on dust and reproduce very fast. The ocean has billions of gallons to get lost in, but in a little glass box there's no-where to hide.
 
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They cannot, unless you disinfect that reef aquarium, which would kinda defeat the purpose of a reef aquarium display.

Biodiversity means predators. Phyto is bottom of the food chain, so many things eat it. If you let predators in that glass jar, no more phyto either.

*edit* Predators come in all forms. Most of the predators crashing phyto cultures are microscopic, so you won't see them unless you get a microscope. Things that can float in on dust and reproduce very fast. The ocean has billions of gallons to get lost in, but in a little glass box there's no-where to hide.
Ok I suppose that makes sense. So the rate of reproduction of the microscopic predators would be outpacing the rate of reproduction of the phyto I'm assuming?
 

Jay'sReefBugs

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That wouldn't make much sense. If they can be bred in a glass jar and bubbler with a tiny bit of light, they can be easily bred in a reef aquarium.
That's like comparing an apple and a chicken to completely different environments. I dose and my system's are still void of phytoplankton a few hours later ( confirmation samples under micro scope ) . I once thought I had phytoplankton Nannochloropsis strain reproduction in my system turns out it was a fourm of cyano after digging into it
 

geeked

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They cannot, unless you disinfect that reef aquarium, which would kinda defeat the purpose of a reef aquarium display.

Biodiversity means predators. Phyto is bottom of the food chain, so many things eat it. If you let predators in that glass jar, no more phyto either.

*edit* Predators come in all forms. Most of the predators crashing phyto cultures are microscopic, so you won't see them unless you get a microscope. Things that can float in on dust and reproduce very fast. The ocean has billions of gallons to get lost in, but in a little glass box there's no-where to hide.
If that were true pods wouldn't survive in an aquarium. They only eat diatoms and phyto nothing else.
 

geeked

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That's like comparing an apple and a chicken to completely different environments. I dose and my system's are still void of phytoplankton a few hours later ( confirmation samples under micro scope ) . I once thought I had phytoplankton Nannochloropsis strain reproduction in my system turns out it was a fourm of cyano after digging into it
Of course different types will out pace different species depending on what pod eats what type. But phyto has to survive in an aquarium otherwise pods wouldn't survive. Try looking at old filter socks and see what phyto is present.
 

Jay'sReefBugs

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Of course different types will out pace different species depending on what pod eats what type. But phyto has to survive in an aquarium otherwise pods wouldn't survive. Try looking at old filter socks and see what phyto is present.
Copepods eat way more then phytoplankton not sure where you got your information from but that's clearly false .That's not how phyto works in a reef system copepods eat phyto but that's not thier sole food source . Copepods are not the only thing that competes and eats phyto you need to look at it on a biological level all the way down bacteria etc not to mention filtration . What you see in your filter sock is more then likely silicate diatoms not the phyto you introduced into the reef system .
 

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If that were true pods wouldn't survive in an aquarium. They only eat diatoms and phyto nothing else.
Copepods will eat an array of planktonic organisms, including phytoplankton and bacterioplankton.

Just to clarify, I'm not saying there are exactly zero phytoplankton cells in a reef tank, but the number is negligable in most cases and not a significant food source for your livestock.

I don't think anyone selling phyto claims you can "seed" your tank with phyto and it will perpetually feed the tank. You need to continually feed phyto in order to detect any changes in the tank's biome.
 

geeked

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Copepods will eat an array of planktonic organisms, including phytoplankton and bacterioplankton.

Just to clarify, I'm not saying there are exactly zero phytoplankton cells in a reef tank, but the number is negligable in most cases and not a significant food source for your livestock.

I don't think anyone selling phyto claims you can "seed" your tank with phyto and it will perpetually feed the tank. You need to continually feed phyto in order to detect any changes in the tank's biome.
I disagree. There's no proof that dosing phyto does anything. I never said adding phyto would seed a tank I think phyto already exist in the tank.
Copepods eat way more then phytoplankton not sure where you got your information from but that's clearly false .That's not how phyto works in a reef system copepods eat phyto but that's not thier sole food source . Copepods are not the only thing that competes and eats phyto you need to look at it on a biological level all the way down bacteria etc not to mention filtration . What you see in your filter sock is more then likely silicate diatoms not the phyto you introduced into the reef system .
They would die off if phyto wasn't present.
here you go https://www.fisheries.noaa.gov/feat...lled “copepods,abundant animals on the planet.
 

fryman

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I disagree. There's no proof that dosing phyto does anything. I never said adding phyto would seed a tank I think phyto already exist in the tank.

They would die off if phyto wasn't present.
here you go https://www.fisheries.noaa.gov/feature-story/copepods-cows-sea#:~:text=Tiny crustacean zooplankton called “copepods,abundant animals on the planet.
Wow, really? There is a billion-dollar aquaculture industry which depends on using phytoplankton as feed. I think if you told them they were wasting their time doing so they might be skeptical. Perhaps you could start your own aquaculture business and dramatically undercut everyone else.

I don't see anywhere in that article stating copepods eat only phytoplankton, which by the way is a rather broad term. Depending on your definition phytoplankton may include diatoms, dinoflagellates, and cyanobacteria which may be present at significant levels in a typical reef aquarium but aren't ideal foods.

Phytoplankton is considered the most nutritious feed for copepods but if you research it a little more, you will find that copepods can feed on lots of other things with the appropriate size such as bacteria.
 

Jay'sReefBugs

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I disagree. There's no proof that dosing phyto does anything. I never said adding phyto would seed a tank I think phyto already exist in the tank.

They would die off if phyto wasn't present.
here you go https://www.fisheries.noaa.gov/feature-story/copepods-cows-sea#:~:text=Tiny crustacean zooplankton called “copepods,abundant animals on the planet.
I literally have a copepod culture that has no phytoplankton what so ever in it eating forms of detritus and film alage on my Facebook page . Your theory can easily be debunked by anyone on reef2reef....just let film alage build up on your glass and if you have copepods they will come out to feed on it . You do realize that artical you posted is pertaining to Oceanic copepods right and also it doesn't prove your point as it doesn't state anywhere that they only feed on phyto cells ......?
 

LgTas

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All my tanks have no mechanical filtration... as in no skimmers, filter socks etc. All i have is caulerpa in the sump on an opposite light schedule that I harvest when it gets out of hand. I also use NSW for water changes.

Phyto is filtered out the water column in a matter of hours. Predation is the obvious answer to this given the limited variables. My scope confirms the removal. The only benefits I've noticed are an increase in invert populations though in my most mature system (3 years) the same to be fairly abundant without the need to dose.
 

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