Placing coral frags - Question (arguement with hubby))

BummersReef

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so we are getting a few coral frags in the next few days and me and hubby are having an arguement on what to do with them when we get them. For the few corals we already have in the DT, hubby did a messy, anxiety-provoking ritual of trying to figure out where to put them permanently and getting glue all over and trying to stick down putty and OHHH it was a mess! we now have at least one in a place we would rather not have had it! (it's looking sad and we want to move to a spot it might be happier but darn if it isn't STUCK with the silly putty)
I am telling him to just put the new coral frags on the bottom, in the sand, at least the ones that say low or moderate light, and then just wait awhile until we see how they do and can make a better decision on where to put them.
He wants to stick them all down permanently where he thinks they should be permanently. arrghhhhh
What do you pros do? how can it possibly hurt to just set them down in a way that they can be moved in a month or so - we could even stick them to a little piece of rubble that is moveable.
(someone tell me I am right and he is wrong! or .... well .... tell me he is right if you must)
:)
 

Chefbill

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Um...what's the question? The usual way is to start the frag low or on the sand bed and slowly move them upwards in the tank as they get acclimated to the light. Once you have found the depth that particular coral likes then you just need to figure out the flow. Once you have the spot picked out the easy way to do is smear a tiny dab of superglue on your rock, really mash it around with your fingertip, then prepare your coral or frag plug by using a small dab of superglue followed by a ball of putty followed by a dab of superglue, mash to where you smeared the glue and it should stick darn near forever.
 

twilliard

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an easy way to solve the frag plug problem is to use a little bit of egg crate with magnetic holders.
This will allow you to move the rack up and down for lighting and to watch coral health.
Once they are nice and happy then you will be able to glue them down in the location of choice at that lighting level.
of course this is done after QT of the coral
an easy way to glue coral if you are unable to remove the rock for placement is to use the 3 step process

superglue, putty, superglue
To help with the mess once these 3 things are placed on the coral in that order is to dip this in a cup of tank water to set the surface of the superglue.
 

mcarroll

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Well, first of all you need to know how well your tank is lit. If you have never used a light meter, you can't know this.

To get started just download a [HASHTAG]#lux[/HASHTAG] [HASHTAG]#meter[/HASHTAG] app (like "Galactica luxmeter" for IOS) for your smartphone. It uses the camera's light sensor and a few tricks to give you a traditional lux reading. I would plan to order an "LX-1010B" lux meter from amazon or eBay, etc.....$15 delivered, better results, safer to use around saltwater than your smartphone! :)

Next you'd ideally like to know the light levels of the tank where the frags came from, so if possible, take your meter to where you got them and (with permission) take some readings.

Last, flow is at least as important as light - maybe more important when they are frags. So if you can tell the frag is flow-starved, either move a pump to correct it, or break him back off the glue spot and move him into some flow.

If light and flow don't turn out to be issues (you have to use your judgement, I'm only guessing) then triple-check your water chemistry before doing anything drastic.
 

twilliard

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Um...what's the question? The usual way is to start the frag low or on the sand bed and slowly move them upwards in the tank as they get acclimated to the light. Once you have found the depth that particular coral likes then you just need to figure out the flow. Once you have the spot picked out the easy way to do is smear a tiny dab of superglue on your rock, really mash it around with your fingertip, then prepare your coral or frag plug by using a small dab of superglue followed by a ball of putty followed by a dab of superglue, mash to where you smeared the glue and it should stick darn near forever.
you beat me to it!
 

Chefbill

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Bummers, did you edit your post or did I just not read the last half the first time through?
 
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BummersReef

BummersReef

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Um...what's the question? The usual way is to start the frag low or on the sand bed and slowly move them upwards in the tank as they get acclimated to the light. Once you have found the depth that particular coral likes then you just need to figure out the flow. Once you have the spot picked out the easy way to do is smear a tiny dab of superglue on your rock, really mash it around with your fingertip, then prepare your coral or frag plug by using a small dab of superglue followed by a ball of putty followed by a dab of superglue, mash to where you smeared the glue and it should stick darn near forever.
yup you have zeroed in on the main question! Is it ok to start it in a temporary position and move it around until you pick the final place? and you answered that very well. thank you so much.
hubby freaks about keeping coral frag out of the water long enough to do gluing and/or putty and he tried to do it all with his hand in the tank and we got glue everywhere! we didn't know about the sandwhich thing - glue/putty/glue
I did see this new stuff on BRS that is called Instant Coral Gum that we might try. (truly the glue fiasco was tramatic and we are now both afraid of the glue
 

reeftanker17

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so we are getting a few coral frags in the next few days and me and hubby are having an arguement on what to do with them when we get them. For the few corals we already have in the DT, hubby did a messy, anxiety-provoking ritual of trying to figure out where to put them permanently and getting glue all over and trying to stick down putty and OHHH it was a mess! we now have at least one in a place we would rather not have had it! (it's looking sad and we want to move to a spot it might be happier but darn if it isn't STUCK with the silly putty)
I am telling him to just put the new coral frags on the bottom, in the sand, at least the ones that say low or moderate light, and then just wait awhile until we see how they do and can make a better decision on where to put them.
He wants to stick them all down permanently where he thinks they should be permanently. arrghhhhh
What do you pros do? how can it possibly hurt to just set them down in a way that they can be moved in a month or so - we could even stick them to a little piece of rubble that is moveable.
(someone tell me I am right and he is wrong! or .... well .... tell me he is right if you must)
:)
I know I just feels so permanent hah I was just thinking 5his.... but on the other hand every morning I have to pick up my frags cause snails and hermits knocked them off the rock!
 

Chefbill

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No need to worry about the coral. Most corals can stay out of the water for the few minutes it will take the glue them up. Some coral in the wild spend hours out of the water during tide changes
 
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BummersReef

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(wow .... like 5 awesome helpful answers in 5 minutes ... I love this place)
as far as light, we have a very unprofessional/temporary situation. we know we eventually want to grow atleast LPS and need/want real good lights for this (yes, we want Radions) but we can not afford them yet and are saving until we can get the best lights possible. that is at least 4 months in the future. It's a pretty big tank (125) but it's early into it so we are only putting in a few very basic soft corals, with maybe a zoa and maybe a paly-thing. (OK I love Xenia, I have to confess) For lights, we currently have (this is embarassing) tw0 40 watt florescents and a 4-ft long ecoxotic LED strip with white and blue dimmables. tank is 5-ft long. so essentially we have no clue as to what PAR we have going in there but do not want to expend any money to figure it out because we are saving for Radions. We are just assuming we have low light everywhere except at the very top (do have some rocks close to top of tank and in middle for as much LED happiness as we can get) We figure we can put "medium" light-wanting softies up there. We have two good, new Sicce powerheads on each side so not too worried about flow (no wave-makers yet, someday) Scape has different levels and shading options (not just an island) -
(dang I talk a lot ... sorry)
so I am going to show hubby this thread and say "SEE, I told you it was wise to not place corals permanently as soon as you get them"
Loving the egg crate with magnet idea up there!!!
Great thanks
Carla
 
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BummersReef

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Next, we need pictures. Xenia...great, but you better really love it because it will be everywhere.
I really really do love it. Had to force myself not to buy two frags. I could happily have a tank full of it!! (am I going to eat my words someday? heeee heeeee) it's so pretty, swaying in the breeze .......
 

Chefbill

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I like it too...but I got it all out of my tank. Too much work to keep it from spreading. Search for Xenia fuge videos. Mesmerizing.
 
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BummersReef

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I like it too...but I got it all out of my tank. Too much work to keep it from spreading. Search for Xenia fuge videos. Mesmerizing.
ohhhh you can put them in the refug?? sweet!! I got a BIG refug in the basement!! happy dance .....
 

mcarroll

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I know I just feels so permanent hah I was just thinking 5his.... but on the other hand every morning I have to pick up my frags cause snails and hermits knocked them off the rock!

I went a step further and asked which is the problem – the frags or the snails and hermits?

Turns out the snails and hermits are all too big (and the hermits too nasty) for most tanks. Try smaller snails like Ceriths and keep hermit populations to zero or the minimum.

The only frags I glue to plugs are the ones that are too small and that might get lost in the live rock if they get moved. Anything big enough to wedge into a space I wedge, but most corals will affix themselves in place in due time.

I've had to glue very few frags....birdsnests are a common one since they don't encrust, but they are also quite wedge-able.

That Tunze Coral Gum (the newest product....I could be getting the name wrong) is pretty phat.....I might do things differently if that was around when I started. :)

I also don't typically move corals once they are in place.....they need to be allowed to adapt to the conditions they're in and A.S.A.P. is better than later. Don't stress about it, but try to minimize the number of moves.....eventually you will know enough to place them on the first or second try.

we know we eventually want to grow atleast LPS and need/want real good lights for this (yes, we want Radions) but we can not afford them yet and are saving until we can get the best lights possible.

Saving Is Good, But...
Look at more affordable fixtures.

"Best" like you've defined it carries a ton of unnecessary (so far as the corals are concerned) extras which jack up the cost to about x5 what it needs to be.

For a comparison, I run two displays on my system: one gets about 14,000 lux (low light) from a DIY blue+white LED system; the other gets about 50,000 lux (fairly bright) from a Maxsprect Razor.

It's possible the corals are growing faster in one tank than the other, but I can't tell and all the corals seem very happy.

My point? The DIY fixture has no creature comforts at all (no dimming, no extra colors, etc) and only cost me $75 in LED bulbs and sockets. The Razor, which is great and has sunrise/sunset, etc, cost me around $500.

The Best Light
Now if my corals (almost all stony corals) are happy in both scenarios I described, how "best" can a light be that costs from $400-$900? Get them if you want, but I'd be careful about over-selling yourself on them :)

In particular for a long, skinny tank like your 150 (60" x 18" x 30H"?) the lights you're looking at are not a great fit....much better for a cube-shaped tank, though they still create a lot of shadowing for what seems like many peoples' tastes.

Your EcoXotic strip is better at lighting your tank - adding more wouldn't be the worst way to go. There's nothing wrong with blue+white fixtures.

If you want something with a few more human features, I'd look at the CurrentUSA Orbit Marine Pro. A single 4'-5' strip would be all you need to add. I'd probably keep your current LED strip too.

so essentially we have no clue as to what PAR we have going in there but do not want to expend any money to figure it out because we are saving for Radions. We are just assuming...

My 11th grade English teacher had a great saying about assuming....I'm sure everyone has heard it by now though.

Start by downloading a $free [HASHTAG]#lux[/HASHTAG] [HASHTAG]#meter[/HASHTAG] app (like "galactica luxmeter" for IOS) for your smartphone. It uses your camera's light meter and some software trickery to generate a usable lux reading. While you are downloading the app, go to amazon or eBay (etc) and order an inexpensive handheld lux meter (search for the "LX-1010B"). Better readings, safer to use around your tank and only $15, delivered. Sometimes less.

Anything around 15,000-20,000 lux on up is fine. Usually there's no need for more than around 50,000 lux.

I hope this helps!!
 

mcarroll

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No need to worry about the coral. Most corals can stay out of the water for the few minutes it will take the glue them up. Some coral in the wild spend hours out of the water during tide changes

But some don't tolerate it at all.

I say do your homework before starting....it's usually not hard to find out about a given coral if you just search the forum or google a little.

Consider the condition of the coral too.

 

BoneXriffic

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The frag mag is the best!
20160813_162637.jpg
how i acclimate to light. Then i just use gel superglue to place them. Any i can remove from the plug i do, the really encrusted ones i use dykes to break the bottom of plug off and glue em down
 
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