PraziPro didn't work on fairy wrasse eye fluke

[pseudorand]

Below is my redfin fairy wrasse with what I think is an eye fluke. She's been on PraziPro for 22 hours now. Since she's a wrasse, which may be sensitive to PraziPro, I was planning to add carbon to take the PraziPro out at 24h. But the fluke appears to still be there. What do I do?

What happened? Did the PraziPro not work? Could it be something other than a fluke? Could the fluke be dead but just hasn't fallen off yet? What do I try next? A second dose? When and how much? Freshwater dip (that scares me)?

She did eat fine this evening, so I don't currently see any ill effects attributable to the PraziPro. But in my experience, by the time you notice, it's too late.

 

[Mr. Fishy Fish]

Below is my redfin fairy wrasse with what I think is an eye fluke. She's been on PraziPro for 22 hours now. Since she's a wrasse, which may be sensitive to PraziPro, I was planning to add carbon to take the PraziPro out at 24h. But the fluke appears to still be there. What do I do?

What happened? Did the PraziPro not work? Could it be something other than a fluke? Could the fluke be dead but just hasn't fallen off yet? What do I try next? A second dose? When and how much? Freshwater dip (that scares me)?

She did eat fine this evening, so I don't currently see any ill effects attributable to the PraziPro. But in my experience, by the time you notice, it's too late.

As I recall flukes are translucent, unless you did a FW dip they shouldn't be visible to that extent. Yup, according to Humblefish "Because flukes are naturally clear a visual confirmation is nearly impossible. Confirmation of flukes can be obtained via a freshwater dip."

Edit: I just found out that Neobenedenia is visible to the naked eye. So you might be dealing with that.

 

[Mr. Fishy Fish]

Okay I did a little more reading using the link below and according to Humblefish " Capsalidae – common in saltwater fish. They have 2 hooks and are oviviparous. The most common genus of Capsalid found in saltwater aquaria is the Neobenedenia. It is host specific, attacking angelfish, butterflyfish, and elasmobranchs, to name a few targets and location specific (face, lips, and eyes). However, if a fish has an extensive infestation the fluke will find somewhere else on the body to host."

Humblefish also provides a detailed treatment plan in the link below. Good luck.

Flukes – General Guidelines

Many thanks to "Newsmyrna80" for writing this. Reposted with her permission. Some facts: Flukes are not true flukes. They are actually parasitic flatworms belonging to the class of Monogeans. There are 13 families of flukes. However, only three families infect saltwater fish. 1...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[pseudorand]

Okay I did a little more reading using the link below and according to Humblefish " Capsalidae – common in saltwater fish. They have 2 hooks and are oviviparous. The most common genus of Capsalid found in saltwater aquaria is the Neobenedenia. It is host specific, attacking angelfish, butterflyfish, and elasmobranchs, to name a few targets and location specific (face, lips, and eyes). However, if a fish has an extensive infestation the fluke will find somewhere else on the body to host."

Humblefish also provides a detailed treatment plan in the link below. Good luck.

Flukes – General Guidelines

Many thanks to "Newsmyrna80" for writing this. Reposted with her permission. Some facts: Flukes are not true flukes. They are actually parasitic flatworms belonging to the class of Monogeans. There are 13 families of flukes. However, only three families infect saltwater fish. 1...

www.reef2reef.com

Good catch, and I just found that one too. However, the #1 treatment is PraziPro, which apparently hasn't worked. It's "82% effective against Neobenedenia girallae". Just my luck to get one of the 18%ers. I'd probably screw up hyposalinity, so I guess I'm in the market for som Formalin.

 

[Mr. Fishy Fish]

Good catch, and I just found that one too. However, the #1 treatment is PraziPro, which apparently hasn't worked. It's "82% effective against Neobenedenia girallae". Just my luck to get one of the 18%ers. I'd probably screw up hyposalinity, so I guess I'm in the market for som Formalin.

Read part a) and b) of treatment 1)

 

[pseudorand]

Read part a) and b) of treatment 1)

I did, but this is for a wrasse.

"The exception is wrasses. They are able to handle the 2.5 mg dosage but anything over that can be detrimental."

 

[Mr. Fishy Fish]

Part a) states " The most common method of dosing Prazi is dosing 2.5 mg for 5-7 days, then performing a water change, and finally redosing the full amount for another 5-7 days. A third and fourth dose may be necessary. Prazipro is reportedly (via personal communication with Hikari) “out of the water” 72 hours after the initial dose. However, once treatment is concluded it is recommended to do a large water change and add carbon to remove all traces of Prazi."


Basically, flukes have a life cycle, they hatch from eggs, then latch onto fish and finally they lay eggs again. This cycle just repeats itself. You need to complete the treatment as directed by part a). 24-hours is not enough, think of it as only killing one wave.

 

[Mr. Fishy Fish]

Also, I'm not sure why you're under the assumption that Prazi treatment is complete after 24 hours, I've never read that before.

 

[pseudorand]

#1 states "Prazi does not kill flukes. It induces uncontrollable spasms to where the fluke dislodges from the fish and continues to spasm. Studies have shown that after 10 hours the fluke dies."

I understand that multiple rounds of medication are required to kill additional baddies as they go through their lifecycle, but the Neobenedenia I can see (assuming that's what it is) should have fallen off by now, no? From the Humblefish's Prazi article:

"If you are treating a known prazi sensitive species (e.g. wrasse), you can run carbon or perform a water change 24 hours after dosing in order to limit exposure time. While praziquantel does remain active in the water column for up to 72 hours, only 24 hours are needed for it to eradicate external worms. Don’t forget to still do the second round though!"

 

[Mr. Fishy Fish]

#1 states "Prazi does not kill flukes. It induces uncontrollable spasms to where the fluke dislodges from the fish and continues to spasm. Studies have shown that after 10 hours the fluke dies."

I understand that multiple rounds of medication are required to kill additional baddies as they go through their lifecycle, but the Neobenedenia I can see (assuming that's what it is) should have fallen off by now, no? From the Humblefish's Prazi article:

"If you are treating a known prazi sensitive species (e.g. wrasse), you can run carbon or perform a water change 24 hours after dosing in order to limit exposure time. While praziquantel does remain active in the water column for up to 72 hours, only 24 hours are needed for it to eradicate external worms. Don’t forget to still do the second round though!"

Hmm, I'm not sure then. I'd definitely follow Humblefish's recommendations and wait for an expert to chime in tomorrow to be honest. I tried my best to reason through it with you, but my experience is limited sorry I couldn't help.

 

[pseudorand]

Hmm, I'm not sure then. I'd definitely follow Humblefish's recommendations and wait for an expert to chime in tomorrow to be honest. I tried my best to reason through it with you, but my experience is limited sorry I couldn't help.

Thanks for your help. IDing it as a Neobenedenia rather than just generically a "fluke" has been very helpful I think. It may be that there's simply not enough research on what to do with the 18% that don't respond to Prazi, but I'm still searching the Interwebs and reading. But there seem to be plenty of folks who swear by freshwater dips, so perhaps it's not a horribly dangerous as I imagine. If the thing isn't gone in a day or so, I may have to do a bit of "science" on fw dips for wrasses with Neobenedenia myself (and publish the results here, of course).

 

[Mr. Fishy Fish]

Thanks for your help. IDing it as a Neobenedenia rather than just generically a "fluke" has been very helpful I think. It may be that there's simply not enough research on what to do with the 18% that don't respond to Prazi, but I'm still searching the Interwebs and reading. But there seem to be plenty of folks who swear by freshwater dips, so perhaps it's not a horribly dangerous as I imagine. If the thing isn't gone in a day or so, I may have to do a bit of "science" on fw dips for wrasses with Neobenedenia myself (and publish the results here, of course).

I think you should do a FW dip, it will at least confirm if it is flukes. A freshwater dip relieves many illnesses, it greatly reduces the overall stress levels at the end of the day. Also, I haven't given up just yet, I'll let you know if I find anything useful.

 

[pseudorand]

Looks like I just need to pick up some cleaner shrimp and a cleaner wrasse (which are both high on my stocking list anyway):

From this article:

The Bluestreak Cleanerwrasse (Labroides dimidiatus) has also proven to be an effective fluke-eater, though it appears to preferentially target only the larger adult worms. On the other hand, the Cleaner Shrimp (Lysmata amboinensis) has been shown to feed on the eggs of Neobenedenia, as well as the newly hatched larvae, being able to reduce populations by half in aquarium studies.

Of course, adding cleaner shrimp to QT would severly limit treatment options if something else pops up.

 

[Mr. Fishy Fish]

Looks like I just need to pick up some cleaner shrimp and a cleaner wrasse (which are both high on my stocking list anyway):

From this article:

The Bluestreak Cleanerwrasse (Labroides dimidiatus) has also proven to be an effective fluke-eater, though it appears to preferentially target only the larger adult worms. On the other hand, the Cleaner Shrimp (Lysmata amboinensis) has been shown to feed on the eggs of Neobenedenia, as well as the newly hatched larvae, being able to reduce populations by half in aquarium studies.

Of course, adding cleaner shrimp to QT would severly limit treatment options if something else pops up.

I wanted a cleaner wrasse myself, but after considering the damage caused by taking cleaner wrasses out of the ocean; I opted out of getting one completely. Their survivability rate is extremely poor in captivity. I recommend you avoid it completely for eliminating a part (adults only) of the whole population of flukes. It will also eventually get infected by the flukes as well. The cleaner shrimp will also only deal with a part of the whole population, therefore it isn't a solution. We should be looking for a complete removal here or the fish will only suffer.

 

[Mr. Fishy Fish]

If you decide to do a FW dip, do it in a bucket that's black so you can see the flukes come out. If you don't see flukes come out, then you know for a fact you're not dealing with flukes.

 

[Mr. Fishy Fish]

Before I head off to bed, Humblefish explains how to do a proper FW dip in regards to Neobenedenia below (post #10).

Flukes – General Guidelines

Many thanks to "Newsmyrna80" for writing this. Reposted with her permission. Some facts: Flukes are not true flukes. They are actually parasitic flatworms belonging to the class of Monogeans. There are 13 families of flukes. However, only three families infect saltwater fish. 1...

www.reef2reef.com

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