Pyramid butterflyfish and copper

The Opinionated Reefer · Sep 14, 2019

I got a large pyramid butterflyfish exactly one week ago. I put into my qt tank for observation and two days later I noticed it had white spots forming. So I then dosed seachem cupramine at the recommended dose. The tank is 240L so I dosed 6ml initially and anther 6ml 48hours later. The spots vanished within a day which makes me suspect it was actually velvet the fish had not ich. I thought thanksfully I have caught it in time and the cupramine will exterminate the next generation of parasites. But the fish doesn't seem to be doing to well, it's hiding in the corner and looks stressed. Seems to have stopped eating. There are also yellow-tailed chromis in the qt which are fine and seem to eating and behaving normally.

Are Pyramid butterflyfish sensitive to copper? Whats should I do now? I don't want to loose it and I also don't want to risk allowing the velvet to return or get into my main display tank. I am thinking about doing a water change and lowering the copper concentrations.

Qasimja · Sep 14, 2019

i found this chart another member posted should be of help https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/fish-and-treatment-guidelines-with-chart.283450/

Bbfishb81 · Sep 14, 2019

Where were the spots? Butterflies frequently get Lymphocystis, especially when stressed, a new tank can possibly cause a stress reaction.

The Opinionated Reefer · Sep 14, 2019

It was definitely ich or velvet, it look just like the pictures and I got confirmation that the someone else bought a fish from the same shop and it dam near wiped out his tank.

Also according to that chart pyramid butterflyfish are sensitive to cupramine. Dam!

HotRocks · Sep 14, 2019

Do you have access to copper power?

I just treated two pyramids without any issue at all. It’s much less harsh than cupramine.

falconut · Sep 14, 2019

I had a pyramid that went through cupramine without any issues, never stopped eating either & had a few spots in the beginning.

However, I added the cupramine slowly, took about 5 days or so to get up to the full dose. Sounds like you may have added all at 1 time. If so, that could have caused an issue. While slowly raising the level, I keep an eye to make sure the fish are still eating. This has worked for me for all types of fish.

If the spots are gone or just a few, maybe lower the copper & see if it starts acting better. If so, raise it more slowly. Good luck, these things can drive us crazy.

The Opinionated Reefer · Sep 15, 2019

I followed the instructions on the bottle, dosed half the dose straight away and then the other half 48h later. I had to remove the fish to another clean tank as it was really suffering. The fish was shaking and its tail fin has become all frayed. It is almost as if its ammonia poisoning, not copper thats affecting it. Yet the chromis that are also in the tank seem fine and are swimming around and eating etc.. Not sure what to do now as the clean tank has no filtration and I just used JBL Detox to deal with any ammonia that builds up.

falconut · Sep 16, 2019

Just make sure not to mix copper with the ammonia remover. It becomes toxic.

Do you have an ammonia alert badge? You need that to see the ammonia levels when using copper.

Can't you just refill the 1st tank with new water & put them back in? I don't think they'll do well without any filtration.

Butterflyfish are typically more sensitive than other fish, probably why it's showing the signs while the chromis aren't.

The Opinionated Reefer · Sep 25, 2019

I moved the butterfly into a clean tank and used prime to detoxify the ammonia as the fish was dying in the cupramine. It was in the clean tank for about a week with water changes and top-ups of prime. Seemed to do fine and made a complete recovery. So I reduced the copper amount in the larger qt tank and moved the fish back in. It was not practical to keep it in the small bare tank for much longer.

No sooner had I moved it back to the big qt tank, and I noticed spots were forming again. This is weird, so the velvet has survived on the fish even though it was nearly a week in cupramine and then went into a hydrogen peroxide bath and then into the clean tank. And I hadn't noticed any spots when in the smaller cleaner tank due to either lack of spots or low lighting.

here is a video from this morning

Here is another two videos taken 10 hours later and the spots have reduced already

Does it look like velvet?