Quarantine with European available medications

[Erik the Red]

Hello,
I’ve recently bought a midas blenny, a gramma loreto, a Banggai cardinalfish and a clown goby.
Fishes have been doing well for about 3/4 weeks until now, and I can’t see any sign of disease so far. Apart from the clown goby, which likely suffered a prolonged shipment time and perished after a few days, all the others fishes are alive and kicking!
At the same time, I must say that I’m not a professional and there's no one close by to whom I can ask a second opinion.

I’ve been reading quite some articles about quarantine, but many cases the medications used by the author are not available in EU, due to stricter regulations.

What I managed to get, is Cupramine, Aquarium Münster Hexamor and eSHa-ndx

Fishes are housed in my previous DT, a 30G tank.
Just to quickly recap, I should get to the therapeutic level of Cupramine with 2 doses in about 48h, then I’ll keep it stable above 0.45 ppm for 21 days.
Once the 21 days are expired and no sign of disease is visible, I should change the water in the tank and proceed with Hexamor for 7 days, then I can briefly bath/wash the fishes in a bowl with freshly-made saltwater and transfer them to the DT tank.

Does all seems right?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Hello,
I’ve recently bought a midas blenny, a gramma loreto, a Banggai cardinalfish and a clown goby.
Fishes have been doing well for about 3/4 weeks until now, and I can’t see any sign of disease so far. Apart from the clown goby, which likely suffered a prolonged shipment time and perished after a few days, all the others fishes are alive and kicking!
At the same time, I must say that I’m not a professional and there's no one close by to whom I can ask a second opinion.

I’ve been reading quite some articles about quarantine, but many cases the medications used by the author are not available in EU, due to stricter regulations.

What I managed to get, is Cupramine, Aquarium Münster Hexamor and eSHa-ndx

Fishes are housed in my previous DT, a 30G tank.
Just to quickly recap, I should get to the therapeutic level of Cupramine with 2 doses in about 48h, then I’ll keep it stable above 0.45 ppm for 21 days.
Once the 21 days are expired and no sign of disease is visible, I should change the water in the tank and proceed with Hexamor for 7 days, then I can briefly bath/wash the fishes in a bowl with freshly-made saltwater and transfer them to the DT tank.

Does all seems right?

I've never used Hexamor, or its active ingredient (2-amino, 5-nitrothiazole).

eSHA-ndx is levamisole, a roundworm medication. Roundworms are not super common in marine aquarium fish, so I usually only treat for that if I've confirmed that as a diagnosis.

The copper aspect of your treatment sounds good though.

You are not able to locate any products containing Praziquantel?

Jay

 

[Tim'sReef]

If you are a little bit of a risk taker you can order stuff from outside the EU, but it could get taken out by customs in you're country. I'm from the Netherlands but i have ordered API general cure 2 times from the states. Took a while to get to me but it worked.

 

[Tim'sReef]

I've never used Hexamor, or its active ingredient (2-amino, 5-nitrothiazole).

eSHA-ndx is levamisole, a roundworm medication. Roundworms are not super common in marine aquarium fish, so I usually only treat for that if I've confirmed that as a diagnosis.

The copper aspect of your treatment sounds good though.

You are not able to locate any products containing Praziquantel?

Jay

I believe prazi is not allowed in the EU due to something cancer related if I'm correct. The EU is really weird about their regulations.

 

[MnFish1]

Hello,
I’ve recently bought a midas blenny, a gramma loreto, a Banggai cardinalfish and a clown goby.
Fishes have been doing well for about 3/4 weeks until now, and I can’t see any sign of disease so far. Apart from the clown goby, which likely suffered a prolonged shipment time and perished after a few days, all the others fishes are alive and kicking!
At the same time, I must say that I’m not a professional and there's no one close by to whom I can ask a second opinion.

I’ve been reading quite some articles about quarantine, but many cases the medications used by the author are not available in EU, due to stricter regulations.

What I managed to get, is Cupramine, Aquarium Münster Hexamor and eSHa-ndx

Fishes are housed in my previous DT, a 30G tank.
Just to quickly recap, I should get to the therapeutic level of Cupramine with 2 doses in about 48h, then I’ll keep it stable above 0.45 ppm for 21 days.
Once the 21 days are expired and no sign of disease is visible, I should change the water in the tank and proceed with Hexamor for 7 days, then I can briefly bath/wash the fishes in a bowl with freshly-made saltwater and transfer them to the DT tank.

Does all seems right?

1. Its thought (not sure its true) - that the regulations on imports, etc in the EU mean less need for QT.
2. The Hexamor is an amine based product - no knowledge about whether it works or not - and not sure what you're trying to 'treat'/QT with it
3. eSHa-ndx is a specific roundworm treatment - (levamisole) - and I'm not sure I would give that prophylactically.
4. I would follow the dose recommendations on the cupramine - checking copper levels with a reliable test. With the understanding that individual fish are not as tolerant as others.

To more succinctly answer your question - I would treat with cupramine. Try to get some prazipro (praziquantel) - and PS - if you have a veterinarian - they will also give you advice.

EDIT - Did not see @Jay Hemdal 's post when I posted. agree with what he posted.

 

[Erik the Red]

I've never used Hexamor, or its active ingredient (2-amino, 5-nitrothiazole).

eSHA-ndx is levamisole, a roundworm medication. Roundworms are not super common in marine aquarium fish, so I usually only treat for that if I've confirmed that as a diagnosis.

The copper aspect of your treatment sounds good though.

You are not able to locate any products containing Praziquantel?

Jay

1. Its thought (not sure its true) - that the regulations on imports, etc in the EU mean less need for QT.
2. The Hexamor is an amine based product - no knowledge about whether it works or not - and not sure what you're trying to 'treat'/QT with it
3. eSHa-ndx is a specific roundworm treatment - (levamisole) - and I'm not sure I would give that prophylactically.
4. I would follow the dose recommendations on the cupramine - checking copper levels with a reliable test. With the understanding that individual fish are not as tolerant as others.

To more succinctly answer your question - I would treat with cupramine. Try to get some prazipro (praziquantel) - and PS - if you have a veterinarian - they will also give you advice.

EDIT - Did not see @Jay Hemdal 's post when I posted. agree with what he posted.

Thanks for you replies.
All I could find is eSHa gdx which, according to an old instruction leaflet found online, has this dose rate “1 ml contains: 66 mg of praziquantel”

It should work fine, right?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Thanks for you replies.
All I could find is eSHa gdx which, according to an old instruction leaflet found online, has this dose rate “1 ml contains: 66 mg of praziquantel”

It should work fine, right?

Yes - that is exactly what you need.

Jay

 

[vetteguy53081]

Hello,
I’ve recently bought a midas blenny, a gramma loreto, a Banggai cardinalfish and a clown goby.
Fishes have been doing well for about 3/4 weeks until now, and I can’t see any sign of disease so far. Apart from the clown goby, which likely suffered a prolonged shipment time and perished after a few days, all the others fishes are alive and kicking!
At the same time, I must say that I’m not a professional and there's no one close by to whom I can ask a second opinion.

I’ve been reading quite some articles about quarantine, but many cases the medications used by the author are not available in EU, due to stricter regulations.

What I managed to get, is Cupramine, Aquarium Münster Hexamor and eSHa-ndx

Fishes are housed in my previous DT, a 30G tank.
Just to quickly recap, I should get to the therapeutic level of Cupramine with 2 doses in about 48h, then I’ll keep it stable above 0.45 ppm for 21 days.
Once the 21 days are expired and no sign of disease is visible, I should change the water in the tank and proceed with Hexamor for 7 days, then I can briefly bath/wash the fishes in a bowl with freshly-made saltwater and transfer them to the DT tank.

Does all seems right?

Try avloclor which is the ich/parasite /protozoan treatment in uk. You should also have access to sera Tremazol which is similar to prazi Pro and to have on hand in case of brooklynella- NT Labs acriflavin

 

[Erik the Red]

one last doubt, then I shut up

The purpose of the water change at the end of the 21 days with Cupramine is to lower the copper level in the water, before proceeding with the next treatment, or to get rid of the parasites which are now floating free in the water?

do I need to completely empty the tank between treatments?

thanks again, I’ll let you know how it goes. Hope none of the fish will suffer the copper treatment.

 

[Sharkbait19]

Assuming proper copper concentration was met, all parasites affected by copper should be killed. The water change is to lower the copper level in the water (adding carbon or cuprisorb also helps to get rid of it, though it does delay how long until you can start prazi).

 

[Erik the Red]

Copper quarantine done! Today I’m doing a water change and start dosing esha gdex

should I do the 3 day schedule (flukes) or the 12 day schedule (tapeworms)?

moreover, its not clear if I would have to do a 25-50% water change on the 5th day also when following the 12 days treatment.

Fish are in a qt tank.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Copper quarantine done! Today I’m doing a water change and start dosing esha gdex

should I do the 3 day schedule (flukes) or the 12 day schedule (tapeworms)?

moreover, its not clear if I would have to do a 25-50% water change on the 5th day also when following the 12 days treatment.

Fish are in a qt tank.

Note that they say the 12 day dose is for "cestoda or persistent Monogenea" - the latter are the egg laying monogeneans (flukes), so you need to follow this schedule unless you know the flukes you are treating are live bearing.

The partial doses on days 2 and 3 and on days 9 and 10 are not something I'm not familiar with. Praziquantel is known to have some effectiveness at lower doses and it isn't very toxic to fish, so this is an interesting idea.


Jay

 

[Erik the Red]

Is 0.35 ppm of copper low enough to start dosing the flukes treatment or should it be lower?

I had 0.58 ppm during the copper treatment.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Is 0.35 ppm of copper low enough to start dosing the flukes treatment or should it be lower?

I had 0.58 ppm during the copper treatment.

That should be o.k., but I typically suggest getting to half the full dose (in this case, 0.25 ppm) just to be sure.

Jay

 

[Erik the Red]

I made some water changes and I’m now into day 4 of the gdex treatment against flukes.
I dosed 110 drops the first day and 55 on both the second and third day, according to instructions.
However, I’m worried because fishes are not to hungry anymore and do not look very active now, especially my gramma and the banggai cardinal.

They looked in perfect shape before I started with the treatment. What should I do?

The aquarium is a 33G with mature biological filter, I am running an aerator 24/7 in the tank to make sure there's enough oxigen.

any advice?! @Jay Hemdal

thank you so much!

 

[Erik the Red]

These are the instructions https://www.eshalabs.eu/europe/products/esha-gdexsupregsup.pdf

 

[Jay Hemdal]

These are the instructions https://www.eshalabs.eu/europe/products/esha-gdexsupregsup.pdf

We don't have that product in the US, but the presumption is that it is praziquantel dissolved in a solvent (probably a glycol). If it is, then it is an analog to our Prazipro. Lack of aeration is the biggest issue seen when using prazipro, but you have that taken care of.

Looking back over this thread, I didn't see, what copper product are you using and what was the level when you started dosing the prazi?

Jay

 

[vetteguy53081]

These are the instructions https://www.eshalabs.eu/europe/products/esha-gdexsupregsup.pdf

In your country, the treatment for flukes is either Sera Tramazol or you can also use Fluke solve which is Praziquantel

 

[Erik the Red]

I used cupramine dosed at 0.58ppm and after quite some water changes (26L x 3 times) the copper level is around 0.3-0.25 ppm

 

[Erik the Red]

The banggai has stopped eating a couple days ago and now’s breathing hard and floating around.
I can’t understand what has gone wrong. All other fishes are OK

any idea? Also the rear fins are slightly damaged