Saltwater cycling

[Emma_fish]

Ok sk h have this 22 gal tank that I have had running for two weeks I have added one dose of stabalise bacteria last week and I have half the amount of colony I need but I haven’t added any colony yet I tested and the results are :
Ammonia: 0.25 - 0.5 ppm
Nitrite : 0 - 0.25 ppm
Nitrate : 0 - 0.25 ppm
I tested ph last week and it was 8.2 ppm
I am hoping to add two clownfish this Sunday it’s Friday on the day I’m posting this the fish I’m definitely getting are :
2x ocellaris clownfish
1x emerald crab
1x Watchman Goby or Green clown goby
Is there any way that I can add the two clowns on Sunday if so how do I get the levels right add more stabilise ? get the right amount of colony and add that aswell ?
Help is appreciated

 

[Sick_man]

Ok sk h have this 22 gal tank that I have had running for two weeks I have added one dose of stabalise bacteria last week and I have half the amount of colony I need but I haven’t added any colony yet I tested and the results are :
Ammonia: 0.25 - 0.5 ppm
Nitrite : 0 - 0.25 ppm
Nitrate : 0 - 0.25 ppm
I tested ph last week and it was 8.2 ppm
I am hoping to add two clownfish this Sunday it’s Friday on the day I’m posting this the fish I’m definitely getting are :
2x ocellaris clownfish
1x emerald crab
1x Watchman Goby or Green clown goby
Is there any way that I can add the two clowns on Sunday if so how do I get the levels right add more stabilise ? get the right amount of colony and add that aswell ?
Help is appreciated

No dont add more than one fish at once. Wait until you have 0 ammonia and 0 nitrite before u put anything else in the tank. You really can't overdose bacteria so you can add more if you really need it. It shouldn't take 2 weeks if you have bottled bacteria along with an ammonia source.

 

[Emma_fish]

No dont add more than one fish at once. Wait until you have 0 ammonia and 0 nitrite before u put anything else in the tank. You really can't overdose bacteria so you can add more if you really need it. It shouldn't take 2 weeks if you have bottled bacteria along with an ammonia source.

So should I add another dose of stabalise and right before I add fish the colony that I have ? And if I add one clownfish then another say a week later won’t that affect the bond between the clowns and increase aggression chances ? And which fish do I add first on my list ? Will the bacteria in a bottle remove the ammonia and nitrite because don’t you have to wait for an ammonia reading before adding the bacteria ? And do I need a refrxcyometer even if I got my water from my local fish shop ?

 

[Sick_man]

So should I add another dose of stabalise and right before I add fish the colony that I have ? And if I add one clownfish then another say a week later won’t that affect the bond between the clowns and increase aggression chances ? And which fish do I add first on my list ? Will the bacteria in a bottle remove the ammonia and nitrite because don’t you have to wait for an ammonia reading before adding the bacteria ? And do I need a refrxcyometer even if I got my water from my local fish shop ?

You can add more bacteria right now and provide an ammonia source by just phantom feeding a little bit or you can get ammonia itself in a bottle. (a little bit goes a long way) Since your tank is new, id add the one goby first and then wait til the tank matures to add the pair of clowns. You definitely need a refractometer or something to test the salinity. What worked for me is just dumping a whole bottle of bio-spira into my 20 gallon and it was cycled in a 5 days. Keep in mind that I added fish too early by mistake and i had some ammonia in the water but fortunately everything lived. Don't repeat my mistake, it would suck to waste your money. Just keep constantly testing your water and play it safe.

 

[Emma_fish]

You can add more bacteria right now and provide an ammonia source by just phantom feeding a little bit or you can get ammonia itself in a bottle. (a little bit goes a long way) Since your tank is new, id add the one goby first and then wait til the tank matures to add the pair of clowns. You definitely need a refractometer or something to test the salinity. What worked for me is just dumping a whole bottle of bio-spira into my 20 gallon and it was cycled in a 5 days. Keep in mind that I added fish too early by mistake and i had some ammonia in the water but fortunately everything lived. Don't repeat my mistake, it would suck to waste your money. Just keep constantly testing your water and play it safe.

Ok I already have an ammonia reading so I will ad the second dose of stabilise bacteria and the colony on Sunday then add the goby on Sunday if the levels are correct does that sound right to you I will get a refractometer in the shop when I’m getting the fish or get next day delivery on Amazon

 

[K7BMG]

OK IMO you need to do some research and learn a few more things before you add fish.
From your post I would say no fish on Sunday sorry, I know this is not what you wanted to hear.

Your test results for a week long cycle do not add up properly. .25 across the board is just not right for a new system in a proper cycling process.

Tank has been running two weeks but only had bacteria in for one week.

Can you clarify what you mean by you have half of a colony but have not added any colony yet? I don't understand what your trying to say here.

I have a few questions for you to answer please.
What do you have for filtration?
What do you have for rock and substrate?
What brand of test kits are you using?

What ammonia source did you use to feed the bacteria?
Most important question what was the peak of the ammonia?


Yes, you must have a refractometer, this is a very important tool.
You have to check your salinity often. As water evaporates from your tank the salt stays behind, so your salinity will rise quickly. You will need to add fresh RO/DI water to top off the tank. The salt water from your store may change as well and you need to know this.

Please post a pic of the tank and filtration if possible.

Have you researched the fish you want and understand their proper care needs.
What temperature, salinity, and proper foods, each fish needs.
Goby's need a deep sand bed. Do you have a sand bed.

Also know that fish stores can be good and bad with advice. So double check everything you learn, before you go for it.

 

[jgirardnrg]

Ok I already have an ammonia reading so I will ad the second dose of stabilise bacteria and the colony on Sunday then add the goby on Sunday if the levels are correct does that sound right to you I will get a refractometer in the shop when I’m getting the fish or get next day delivery on Amazon

Get a bottle of Bio-Spira from Petco or your LFS:

 

[Emma_fish]

OK IMO you need to do some research and learn a few more things before you add fish.
From your post I would say no fish on Sunday sorry, I know this is not what you wanted to hear.

Your test results for a week long cycle do not add up properly. .25 across the board is just not right for a new system in a proper cycling process.

Tank has been running two weeks but only had bacteria in for one week.

Can you clarify what you mean by you have half of a colony but have not added any colony yet? I don't understand what your trying to say here.

I have a few questions for you to answer please.
What do you have for filtration?
What do you have for rock and substrate?
What brand of test kits are you using?

What ammonia source did you use to feed the bacteria?
Most important question what was the peak of the ammonia?


Yes, you must have a refractometer, this is a very important tool.
You have to check your salinity often. As water evaporates from your tank the salt stays behind, so your salinity will rise quickly. You will need to add fresh RO/DI water to top off the tank. The salt water from your store may change as well and you need to know this.

Please post a pic of the tank and filtration if possible.

Have you researched the fish you want and understand their proper care needs.
What temperature, salinity, and proper foods, each fish needs.
Goby's need a deep sand bed. Do you have a sand bed.

Also know that fish stores can be good and bad with advice. So double check everything you learn, before you go for it.

For the colony I only bought like a bottle for a ten gallon tank rather than a 20 gallon rock I have dry Marco type rock and I have quite a deep sand bed both dry I use the api master test kit I didn’t use an ammonia source It just came Urm the highest I have tested the ammonia yet was 0.5 but I haven’t been testing as much as I should once a week I have my tank heating up to 24 degrees C with a 25w heater I tried a bigger one but it overheated to 40 degrees C I am now looking for a refractometer on Amazoni have done quite a bit of research on the fish I want but I still have a lot more to do and that is why I’m on this forum approximately when do u think I will be able to get fish ? And how do I tell that it is ready come I bout the bacteria so that I could instantly cycle my tank why do I have to wait now ?

 

[K7BMG]

Well the cycle is not complete, and like everything the bacteria has to go through its gestation process. On average this is 14 to 21 days. If you added the bacteria 7 days ago
well that's when your cycle clock started. Your a week short, and if you did not feed the bacteria it cant grow, so its delayed even longer.
As you say the tank overheated, chances the bacteria died putting you back to square one.
That is if id overheated after the addition of the bacteria.

I am not familiar with this Stabilize bacteria you used but what are the instructions for it?

The ammonia (Bacteria's food) with a fishless cycle should be at 1.0.
then you will see Nitrite's rise and ammonia will start to drop.
Then Nitrites will start to drop and Nitrate will rise.
The cycle is completed when both ammonia and Nitrates have dropped to 0 or close to 0, and Nitrates will be reading at or above 1.0. Most likely closer to 5.0 if your ammonia was at 1.0.
Then a 50% water change should be done and then and only then will you be ready for fish.

 

[Emma_fish]

Well the cycle is not complete, and like everything the bacteria has to go through its gestation process. On average this is 14 to 21 days. If you added the bacteria 7 days ago
well that's when your cycle clock started. Your a week short, and if you did not feed the bacteria it cant grow, so its delayed even longer.
As you say the tank overheated, chances the bacteria died putting you back to square one.
That is if id overheated after the addition of the bacteria.

I am not familiar with this Stabilize bacteria you used but what are the instructions for it?

The ammonia (Bacteria's food) with a fishless cycle should be at 1.0.
then you will see Nitrite's rise and ammonia will start to drop.
Then Nitrites will start to drop and Nitrate will rise.
The cycle is completed when both ammonia and Nitrates have dropped to 0 or close to 0, and Nitrates will be reading at or above 1.0. Most likely closer to 5.0 if your ammonia was at 1.0.
Then a 50% water change should be done and then and only then will you be ready for fish.

But doesn’t the colony benificial bacteria speed it up instantly ?

 

[Sick_man]

But doesn’t the colony benificial bacteria speed it up instantly ?


[/QUOTE
Since the water overheated it probably died. Go yo your nearest pet store and get the smaller bottle of bio-spira (think its rate for 30 gallons) and just dump the whole thing in there. Add some fish food for ammonia and just test the water. You should be able to add a fish in a week. You could also do a fish in cycle but thatll hurt the fish and it may die so I dont recommend that.

 

[K7BMG]

But doesn’t the colony benificial bacteria speed it up instantly ?

Well here's the thing.
With humans is there a way to speed up up a pregnancy? No
It is the same with bacteria. Its just nature.

Considering your current situation with what ever you have or don't have in the tank is not known.
Until you see each test rise and fall well what can I say.

There are ways to do things differently yes.
You could have done a fish in cycle.
A fish in cycle uses the fish's excretion's as the bacteria's food source. (Ammonia)
So yes this is the "fast" method so to speak.
None the less the bacteria still takes 14 to 21 days to grow out. However the tank must be monitored daily to make sure there is not a spike of ammonia that will kill the fish.
I also say this method is for the more experienced person, for many reasons.

 

[Porpoise Hork]

But doesn’t the colony benificial bacteria speed it up instantly ?

All your various starter cultures like Stability for example can speed the process up to a point. It ultimately comes down a few key factors. Bacteria need time to get established. If you used uncured dry rock as well as dry or dead sand, then it will take far longer to establish your biological filtration than if cured live rock and live sand were used. If dry rock was used it can take up to 4-6 weeks at minimum for the aerobic nitrifying bacteria to establish a bio-film on the rockwork and top of the substrate. During this time frame you can get unexpected spikes in ammonia and nitrites if you add too many fish and over power the new colonies of bacteria ability to consume the ammonia produced by the fish. Ideally you want to have a zero reading on both ammonia and nitrites for at least a week for each before you want to even consider the addition of inverts. The ammonia should bottom out while the nitrites are still elevated. Then as the nitrites fall the nitrates and phosphates will start to climb. Ammonia is highly toxic to fish and can easily burn their gills, hindering their ability to exchange Co2 for oxygen, as well as various other compounds like ammonia.

If you used cured live rock (was well seasoned in an established tank, for at least 6 months to a year to fully colonize) as well as live sand then the use of starter cultures acts as a general booster to the existing bacteria present. A new tank started this way could be ready to support 1-2 small fish and inverts in 1-2 weeks from start date provided all the water chemistry levels are good and remain stable during that time. This is significantly more risky as unusual spikes in ammonia and nitrites can still happen so test often and be prepared to act instantly if needed.

Bottom line is in this hobby, patience is key. If you try to rush too much, your chances for success start to fall rapidly. I know how hard it is sitting there staring at a tank with nothing but rock and water in it, but the more time you give a new young tank to get established, the better off you will be long term and ultimately the more satisfaction you will get from being in this hobby.

 

[K7BMG]

If the Seachem Stability product was used and not compromised by the overheating then maybe. I don't know if this is what you used or if it's available to you in the UK.

SeaChems Stability directions.
Copied and quoted.

"Shake well before use. Turn off UV/ozone. Use 1 capful (5 mL) for each 40 L (10 US gallons) on the first day with a new aquarium. Then use 1 capful for each 80 L (20 US gallons) daily for 7 days. Fish and other aquatic species may be introduced at any time as long as dosage is maintained for 7 days. For optimum biofilter performance use 1 capful for each 80 L (20 US gallons) once a month or with each water change and whenever introducing new fish or whenever medicating an aquarium. Product shelf life is 4 years from date of manufacture.

Stability® should ideally be used in conjunction with biological filtration such as Seachem Matrix™. For emergency ammonia control, use Seachem"

 

[K7BMG]

All your various starter cultures like Stability for example can speed the process up to a point. It ultimately comes down a few key factors. Bacteria need time to get established. If you used uncured dry rock as well as dry or dead sand, then it will take far longer to establish your biological filtration than if cured live rock and live sand were used. If dry rock was used it can take up to 4-6 weeks at minimum for the aerobic nitrifying bacteria to establish a bio-film on the rockwork and top of the substrate. During this time frame you can get unexpected spikes in ammonia and nitrites if you add too many fish and over power the new colonies of bacteria ability to consume the ammonia produced by the fish. Ideally you want to have a zero reading on both ammonia and nitrites for at least a week for each before you want to even consider the addition of inverts. The ammonia should bottom out while the nitrites are still elevated. Then as the nitrites fall the nitrates and phosphates will start to climb. Ammonia is highly toxic to fish and can easily burn their gills, hindering their ability to exchange Co2 for oxygen, as well as various other compounds like ammonia.

If you used cured live rock (was well seasoned in an established tank, for at least 6 months to a year to fully colonize) as well as live sand then the use of starter cultures acts as a general booster to the existing bacteria present. A new tank started this way could be ready to support 1-2 small fish and inverts in 1-2 weeks from start date provided all the water chemistry levels are good and remain stable during that time. This is significantly more risky as unusual spikes in ammonia and nitrites can still happen so test often and be prepared to act instantly if needed.

Bottom line is in this hobby, patience is key. If you try to rush too much, your chances for success start to fall rapidly. I know how hard it is sitting there staring at a tank with nothing but rock and water in it, but the more time you give a new young tank to get established, the better off you will be long term and ultimately the more satisfaction you will get from being in this hobby.

As he said.

 

[K7BMG]

If you decide to go for it I would not do the Goby.
They are a little more sensitive to ammonia and the like and will have a lesser success rate in this situation.

Clowns are much hardier and can handle SOME fluctuations.
But adding a mated pair as you should might be a bit much for a new (maybe cycled) 22G

 

[Emma_fish]

If you decide to go for it I would not do the Goby.
They are a little more sensitive to ammonia and the like and will have a lesser success rate in this situation.

Clowns are much hardier and can handle SOME fluctuations.
But adding a mated pair as you should might be a bit much for a new (maybe cycled) 22G

Could I just add one clown and then add the other smaller one later on ?

 

[Emma_fish]

All your various starter cultures like Stability for example can speed the process up to a point. It ultimately comes down a few key factors. Bacteria need time to get established. If you used uncured dry rock as well as dry or dead sand, then it will take far longer to establish your biological filtration than if cured live rock and live sand were used. If dry rock was used it can take up to 4-6 weeks at minimum for the aerobic nitrifying bacteria to establish a bio-film on the rockwork and top of the substrate. During this time frame you can get unexpected spikes in ammonia and nitrites if you add too many fish and over power the new colonies of bacteria ability to consume the ammonia produced by the fish. Ideally you want to have a zero reading on both ammonia and nitrites for at least a week for each before you want to even consider the addition of inverts. The ammonia should bottom out while the nitrites are still elevated. Then as the nitrites fall the nitrates and phosphates will start to climb. Ammonia is highly toxic to fish and can easily burn their gills, hindering their ability to exchange Co2 for oxygen, as well as various other compounds like ammonia.

If you used cured live rock (was well seasoned in an established tank, for at least 6 months to a year to fully colonize) as well as live sand then the use of starter cultures acts as a general booster to the existing bacteria present. A new tank started this way could be ready to support 1-2 small fish and inverts in 1-2 weeks from start date provided all the water chemistry levels are good and remain stable during that time. This is significantly more risky as unusual spikes in ammonia and nitrites can still happen so test often and be prepared to act instantly if needed.

Bottom line is in this hobby, patience is key. If you try to rush too much, your chances for success start to fall rapidly. I know how hard it is sitting there staring at a tank with nothing but rock and water in it, but the more time you give a new young tank to get established, the better off you will be long term and ultimately the more satisfaction you will get from being in this hobby.

Ok I understand that but one question if I add the right dose of colony then will that bring the levels down ?

 

[Emma_fish]

If the Seachem Stability product was used and not compromised by the overheating then maybe. I don't know if this is what you used or if it's available to you in the UK.

SeaChems Stability directions.
Copied and quoted.

"Shake well before use. Turn off UV/ozone. Use 1 capful (5 mL) for each 40 L (10 US gallons) on the first day with a new aquarium. Then use 1 capful for each 80 L (20 US gallons) daily for 7 days. Fish and other aquatic species may be introduced at any time as long as dosage is maintained for 7 days. For optimum biofilter performance use 1 capful for each 80 L (20 US gallons) once a month or with each water change and whenever introducing new fish or whenever medicating an aquarium. Product shelf life is 4 years from date of manufacture.

Stability® should ideally be used in conjunction with biological filtration such as Seachem Matrix™. For emergency ammonia control, use Seachem"

Yes that is what I used but the bacteria was in there when it overheated so I think I should do a second dose

 

[K7BMG]

If it was me I would add a second full dose, maybe a bit more just 10%.
Then slowly add liquid ammonia keep testing it until you reach 1.0 but absolutely no more than 1.5.
Your LFS should carry a bottle of the stuff, Seachem does not make it that I know of but there is Dr. Tims, Brightwell, and others.
Keep the tank running as you will when you have fish.
Then wait for mother nature to work her magic.
When your testing reveals the following results,
0 ammonia
0 Nitrite
5-25 Nitrate
Its time to do enough of a water change and lower the Nitrites down by half.
Wait 24 hours and test everything again to make sure.

Then your ready to add your fish.
If you go this way then you can add the clown pair without issue.
Do your best to make sure they are a mated pair and healthy.
The eyes should be clear not cloudy.
The body should look good and smooth, no chunks, blemishes, or flaking.
There should be no white bumps on the body or fins
They should be breathing slowly, not panting.
They may stay in the same spot but clowns are always actively moving.