SDReef's 330G CDA Acropora Dominant Mixed Reef

[Operator Wrasse]

So I'm considering tapping out on the phosphates and considering using TM Elimi Phos as @ScottB had suggested at one point.

I had one millie frag RTN last month. This particular frag had been puttering along since I dipped all the corals all summer and I didn't make too much of it.

Then this week my acrolandia tenuis which had been growing very well (and my favorite tenuis) RTN'd out of no where . Most of the corals in the system look really good with good growth and polyp extension. In general, the tank looks good, but two months ago everything looked really good. Now, there are some pieces that looks less happy.

I removed the dying sponge to remove that as a variable. The alkalinity has been very stable around 7.8. In the past 3 months it has never been below 7.6 or above 8.2 and I've adjusted the kalk dosing to flatten the alkalinity curve. Temperature has been 76-78 consistently. pH has been stable and currently is 8.1 to 8.4. I calibrated the probe in mid September and then again last night. Calcium is up to 460. Mg is 1340. That's a long way of saying, I think all the other usual parameter have been stable and in a good range.

I sent a new ICP test this morning and await results. I checked phosphates today and measured 0.9 on the Hanna. That is likely elevated above the true level a little because I had already started feeding for the day. I'll recheck in the morning but believe the true value of phosphates are likely around 0.7 to 0.8. So I'd like to bring it down to below 0.5 in the short term and down to 0.1 to 0.2 in the long term. Although, I'm not clear that things are less happy due to the elevated phosphates, I also don't believe those levels are helping anything. Nitrates are 0.25 to 0.4 on the Nyos test kit.

Nothing is crashing, There's no emergency. It's possible I'm just upset I lost of one of my favorite acros, but I've decided it would be best to correct course a bit. So where should I start?

Here's what I have to play with:

• 100 gallons of fresh salt water on hand.
• rowa phos on hand, and an available reactor
• I have ordered TM elimiphos, lanthanum chloride
• *The fuge is maxed out in terms of the amount of chaeto and the photoperiod is at 16 hours. When I went up to 18 hours, I thought chaeto growth slowed which was counterproductive

I plan to go slow and lower phosphates by no more than 0.1 in a day or 0.2- 0.3 in a week. I was thinking starting with a couple 10% water changes. Adding a small amount of rowa phos to the reactor since I have it on hand. I will receive the elimiphos in a couple days and will plan to dose it to the overflow. I'll need to calculate the dosage, but the actual volume of water in my system accounting for displacement is about 250 gallons.

I appreciate any input.

An ICP-OES test would be great to make sure none of your trace minerals are off or your messing with something like Tin from a worn out dosing line.

I would only choose ONE method of reducing PO4 at a time... your system is running so well and you have all the right knowledge. Take it slow and don't rush by taking a multi-pronged attack; you'll end up throwing things way out of wack. Also, make sure you're monitoring your nitrates with your PO4. Depending on the method of reduction you use, it may have a proportional effect on reducing nitrate. I would probably start with lanthanum chloride.

 

[sdreef]

An ICP-OES test would be great to make sure none of your trace minerals are off or your messing with something like Tin from a worn out dosing line.

I would only choose ONE method of reducing PO4 at a time... your system is running so well and you have all the right knowledge. Take it slow and don't rush by taking a multi-pronged attack; you'll end up throwing things way out of wack. Also, make sure you're monitoring your nitrates with your PO4. Depending on the method of reduction you use, it may have a proportional effect on reducing nitrate. I would probably start with lanthanum chloride.

Thanks, there's an ICP test in the mail. It's going to be at least a week before I get ICP results and with the holiday shipping possibly longer. Given that my phosphates and nitrates are definitely high, I don't think there is a huge downside to bringing them down a little bit and SLOWLY.

The nitrates and phosphates are both high, so I'm thinking maybe I'll just start with a good old fashioned water change and bring them down proportionally. The lanthanum will be here in a couple days. I can retest and reconsider this weekend the best next step depending on the levels at that time.

 

[ScottB]

and bring them down proportionally.

Yes agree this, but it won't likely be the end of the world (done slowly) if you miss.

Changing the balance NO3/PO4 in either of my systems leaves me with cyano without fail. Hard to avoid and really not that big a deal. If visitors are expected just syphon it out. Cyano does not kill corals, just other -- more attractive --surface competitors.

Yeah cyano sux but it doesn't really have much medium to longer term effect. It is transitory with some patience. It is a marginal competitor.

 

[ScottB]

Thanks for the advice. I'm fortunate I have a friend who has a frag of the acrolandia for me, but I don't want to find frags periodically bailing out on me. I was just partial to how it was coloring up. I'm sure anyone who's kept acros has experienced this at some point. The nitrates measure 25 to 40 on the Nyos test kit. I will order some more phosphate reagent.

I will keep telling myself to go slow. I use mechanical filtration, so I should be good there. I will be very cautious with the lanthanum. So given the nitrates are high as well, maybe I'll start with a water change?

Yes, a WC is fine at that nitrate level. Don't go overboard with WC until you can move PO4.

 

[Operator Wrasse]

Thanks, there's an ICP test in the mail. It's going to be at least a week before I get ICP results and with the holiday shipping possibly longer. Given that my phosphates and nitrates are definitely high, I don't think there is a huge downside to bringing them down a little bit and SLOWLY.

The nitrates and phosphates are both high, so I'm thinking maybe I'll just start with a good old fashioned water change and bring them down proportionally. The lanthanum will be here in a couple days. I can retest and reconsider this weekend the best next step depending on the levels at that time.

I misread your nitrate level. I agree with a good water change, but I would be prepared to immediately attack both nitrates and phosphates afterwards. A decently sized water change could easily be defeated by another week of feeding.

Have you considered some sort of carbon dosing like NoPox? You're definitely in that tricky spot of not having enough biomass to absorb NO3 and PO4, but your filtration is also maxed out. If you only lower PO4 or NO3, you might run into issues.

 

[sdreef]

I misread your nitrate level. I agree with a good water change, but I would be prepared to immediately attack both nitrates and phosphates afterwards. A decently sized water change could easily be defeated by another week of feeding.

Have you considered some sort of carbon dosing like NoPox? You're definitely in that tricky spot of not having enough biomass to absorb NO3 and PO4, but your filtration is also maxed out. If you only lower PO4 or NO3, you might run into issues.

Although I wasn't thinking about starting carbon dosing at this point, that certainly could reduce both nitrate and phosphate. Carbon dosing in not something I have a lot of experience with, so I'll read a little more about it as well.

I'm going to recheck my phosphate and nitrate levels tomorrow morning to get more reliable test results. I'll probably just start with a water change before I mess too much with anything. It does seem that the nitrate, although high, has stayed more steady in its level than the phosphate. So like usual, probably just make some minor changes to the regimen once I knock the levels down a little (SLOWLY).

 

[sdreef]

I decided to do a 15% water change, I was due to change the carbon, and I added a small amount of rowaphos.

The nitrate is down to 25 and the phosphate is at 0.7 down from 0.9. I gave it a day to settle and I'm doing a second 15% water change. Everything in the tank looks good, except the clams are still a little unhappy.

I went through and checked all the dosing lines as well and I realized I was triple dosing coral booster. This hobby has no shortage of self-inflicted issues. The last time I adjusted this was around the same time I started noticing more issues in the tank, so this may very well be a contributing factor.

For now, everything looks pretty good and I'll see what the ICP reveals.

 

[ScottB]

Indeed everything does look good. Love your comment about "no shortage of self-inflicted issues in this hobby". I dont have enough fingers and toes to count those injuries.

 

[sdreef]

Indeed everything does look good. Love your comment about "no shortage of self-inflicted issues in this hobby". I dont have enough fingers and toes to count those injuries.

LOL, yes, it was an avoidable mistake. I wasn't particularly happy with myself about that, but it happens.

Not sure if triple dosing the coral booster caused my RTN. I was reading in another thread @Charlie’s Frags had seen some random RTN with coral booster, but I haven't found a lot of other experience with it.

Today all the sps is looking good and one of the clams looks happier today so hopefully I'm back on track. The problem is I probably won't know for a few weeks.

 

[sdreef]

ICP Results are in

Major elements

Minor elements

Pollutants

Nutrients

Outside of the nutrients everything looks good. Alk measured 8.1 and salinity 35.7 at the time I collected the water samples, so helpful to verify the accuracy of the measurements for me. I've been manually dosing iodine once a month and that seems to be meeting the system needs. Manganese plays a role in photosynthesis and deficiency is one of the possible causes of chlorosis in plants. I have it on hand and will replete it. I'm going to ignore the zinc.

Regarding the nutrients, as expected, they were high. Nitrates 58.6 and Phosphates 1.05. I'll continue to bring these down slowly. I'm undecided on a target range to maintain, but will probably start with <0.3 for the phosphates. I ordered a hanna checker for nitrates. I historically rarely check nitrates but at the higher range, the resolution of the nyos is too far apart and I'd like more precise readings.

I performed two 15% water changes and added a small amount of rowa phos one week ago. I checked the nutrients this morning and phosphates measure 0.52 and nitrates 28.9 prior to any feeding. No further RTN, sps looks good.

Once I reach the new baseline, I'm planning for small adjustments to the maintenance regimen. I'll change the rowa phos once per month and am willing to change once every two weeks if I find its necessary. Currently the daily automatic water exchange is at 15 L / day. I'll bump that up to 20-25 L / day. I'll continue testing phosphates and nitrates with some regularity until I reach a stable baseline with the new routine.

Will be interesting to see if I observe any changes in the corals with lowering the nutrients.

 

[sdreef]

I just got the Avast porthole. These are top down shots with the phone from last night.

 

[sdreef]

Testing a new camera, some photos from today. All daylights under the halides.

 

[Billldg]

Some random photos from today.

Love the Blonde Naso tang, maybe its because I have one as well.

 

[sdreef]

Love the Blonde Naso tang, maybe its because I have one as well.

Love the blonde naso too. He grew up quickly. Here he is February 2021.

 

[Billldg]

Love the blonde naso too. He grew up quickly. Here he is February 2021.

It looks like, in the previous photo, that yours is about the same age as mine.

Mine is just SO chill, and yet, when it grows up, it will be the KING!!!

 

[sdreef]

Tank seems to be back on track. I was able to get back a nice piece of the 'acrolandia' tenuis I lost and have it in QT.

Still working on gradually reducing nutrients. Down to 0.38 phosphates and 19.7 for nitrates. I've been using the hanna nitrate high range checker for the past week, and I've been happy with the more precise nitrate readings.

 

[ScottB]

I too am a big fan of the Hanna high range nitrate kit.

Tank looks great!

 

[sdreef]

Another day, another reefing problem to solve.

The yellow tang decided the gem was no longer king.

I hoped that they would establish a new hierarchy and things would settle down. A few days later, it was clear that wasn't going to happen, and I needed to intervene.

I decided that one of the fish would need to get removed. The yellow was also harassing the purple a bit and so I determined to remove him from the tank.

The severity of the injury to the gem was increasing too rapidly to rely on a fish trap. It took me weeks to catch the yellow in the other system, and I needed a quicker solution otherwise the yellow would kill the gem.

With the help of a friend we were able to catch the yellow in under 30 minutes.

We picked a half of the tank to corral the fish. In order to corral the fish, we placed plastic grocery bags weighed down with rocks starting in the other half of the tank, and progressed toward the desired section of the tank.

As we progressed across the tank, the fish were in a much smaller, more open, contained part of the tank.

Using some egg crate, we added a more structured divider. With the fish contained in this section of the tank we were able to get the tang into the corner and capture him in short order.

The plastic bags are a free form space occupying divider that can work in a variety of situations and aquascapes. The fish are scared of the bags and they are very effective for moving the fish out of a specific area.

This may not be the right technique for every situation, and I traditionally have used fish traps, but speed was the priority here. This was ideally a two person job, and aside from knocking over a couple frags, no damage to the corals or aquascape.

The yellow is in the 60 gallon tank, and I'm undecided what to do. He's been with me a while, but the other tank is too small for a long term solution. The gem is healing up quickly.

 

[Operator Wrasse]

Another day, another reefing problem to solve.

The yellow tang decided the gem was no longer king.

I hoped that they would establish a new hierarchy and things would settle down. A few days later, it was clear that wasn't going to happen, and I needed to intervene.

I decided that one of the fish would need to get removed. The yellow was also harassing the purple a bit and so I determined to remove him from the tank.

The severity of the injury to the gem was increasing too rapidly to rely on a fish trap. It took me weeks to catch the yellow in the other system, and I needed a quicker solution otherwise the yellow would kill the gem.

With the help of a friend we were able to catch the yellow in under 30 minutes.

We picked a half of the tank to corral the fish. In order to corral the fish, we placed plastic grocery bags weighed down with rocks starting in the other half of the tank, and progressed toward the desired section of the tank.

As we progressed across the tank, the fish were in a much smaller, more open, contained part of the tank.

Using some egg crate, we added a more structured divider. With the fish contained in this section of the tank we were able to get the tang into the corner and capture him in short order.

The plastic bags are a free form space occupying divider that can work in a variety of situations and aquascapes. The fish are scared of the bags and they are very effective for moving the fish out of a specific area.

This may not be the right technique for every situation, and I traditionally have used fish traps, but speed was the priority here. This was ideally a two person job, and aside from knocking over a couple frags, no damage to the corals or aquascape.

The yellow is in the 60 gallon tank, and I'm undecided what to do. He's been with me a while, but the other tank is too small for a long term solution. The gem is healing up quickly.

What an ingenious idea. Your thread never ceases to amaze!

With Rowa Phos, is that a branded GFO? I won't use GFO unless absolutely necessary because it strips PO4 quickly and then leeches it back into the water if it's not changed out once exhausted.

 

[sdreef]

What an ingenious idea. Your thread never ceases to amaze!

With Rowa Phos, is that a branded GFO? I won't use GFO unless absolutely necessary because it strips PO4 quickly and then leeches it back into the water if it's not changed out once exhausted.

Thanks! The gem tang is healing up quickly. Here's from a couple days ago. Both sides were originally skinned up.

Here he is this evening. Fin is essentially healed, and the more injured side should be fully healed in a couple days.

Yes, Rowa Phos is a brand of gfo. I have plenty of phosphate to strip . Plus with my feeding regimen, there will always be a phosphate supply in the water, so I'm not overly concerned about bottoming it out.

Regarding the fluctuation, that's a valid concern, and I'll need to find a regimen that works for this system. I plan to change the rowa phos on a consistent schedule. Whether that's biweekly or monthly remains to be determined. Currently I'm changing biweekly, but there is a lot of phosphate to remove, and I'm trying to go slow.

I'm planning on repeating an ICP once I reach a steady state. If I find the GFO is affecting other chemistry parameters as well, I may reconsider the strategy. I considered dosing lanthanum, and learned from Rich Ross's experience dosing it in his system.