Sick fish

Lostreef · May 6, 2021

My scopas tang started scratching and quick dart swimming about 2 weeks ago very randomly. Was eating like crazy then suddenly stopped eating a few days ago. I noticed rapid breathing along with keeping his mouth open and swimming in a “dazed” state. No white spots or peeling. I did notice one day one of his bottom fins had a slight tear but healed by next day. I also started a terrible outbreak of dinos about the time he started not eating. My nutrients bottomed out. I started running UV to help with the dinos and ran a blackout for one day. When I noticed how quickly the tang was detiorating I stopped the UV and dosed Prazipro to the tank. He started shaking his head so I was hopeful it was flukes and he would be on the mend. Today he hasn’t made much progress and is losing color. I definitely see white coloration behind his gills which I’m assuming is mucus. He is also showing white steaks through his back fin. No grains of salt or dots anywhere on him. Any help or advice on what else I can do or any diagnosis would be greatly appreciated.

vetteguy53081 · May 6, 2021

Pic is a bit fuzzy but sounds like you’re describing velvet behavior or even crypto
I would suggest quarantine tank and quarantining using copper safe treatment and a quick freshwater dip prior to quarantining. The sooner you act, the quicker you can turn this around

Lostreef · May 6, 2021

@vetteguy53081 Can velvet ( the Dino parasite) be caused from the Dino algea? Just trying to figure out where this would have come from.

Lostreef · May 6, 2021

Can velvet ( the Dino parasite) be caused from the Dino algea? I know technically the Dino al

dblox said:
@vetteguy53081 Can velvet ( the Dino parasite) be caused from the Dino algea? Just trying to figure out where this would have come from.

I just did a FW dip. He think it might be flukes. 4 pieces of what looks like rice/small paint chips are in the bucket. I’m hoping he pulls through but might be too late. Anything I can do for my two clowns? I dosed prazipro yesterday.

Lostreef · May 6, 2021

dblox said:
@vetteguy53081 Can velvet ( the Dino parasite) be caused from the Dino algea? Just trying to figure out where this would have come from.

Never mind...just looked closer at the bucket and I think they are sand pebbles. Rookie mistake. I’m at a loss for how this happened. So sad right now.

vetteguy53081 · May 6, 2021

dblox said:
@vetteguy53081 Can velvet ( the Dino parasite) be caused from the Dino algea? Just trying to figure out where this would have come from.

Dino algae won’t cause that

vetteguy53081 · May 6, 2021

dblox said:
Can velvet ( the Dino parasite) be caused from the Dino algea? I know technically the Dino al

I just did a FW dip. He think it might be flukes. 4 pieces of what looks like rice/small paint chips are in the bucket. I’m hoping he pulls through but might be too late. Anything I can do for my two clowns? I dosed prazipro yesterday.

You got it, why I suggested dip

Jay Hemdal · May 6, 2021

This does sound like velvet, or another gill disease. One other question - are there any other fish in the tank that are NOT showing symptoms?

Jay

Lostreef · May 6, 2021

Jay Hemdal said:
This does sound like velvet, or another gill disease. One other question - are there any other fish in the tank that are NOT showing symptoms?

Jay

Two clowns. Both ate yesterday but today just a nibble. I know pazipro suppress appetite. Both swimming fine and no heavy breathing. Bought them all from the same LFS at approximately same time. LFS does 28 day quarantine and copper. Had tang (died today) for 5 weeks. Clown fish for 6 weeks. I have bought coral recently but dip all coral in CoralRx. I just don’t understand how this happened so quickly. All was going fine until my nutrients bottomed out and got a large outbreak of dino. I put the UV back on. Don’t think the prazipro is going to make a difference if it is velvet.

Jay Hemdal · May 6, 2021

dblox said:
Two clowns. Both ate yesterday but today just a nibble. I know pazipro suppress appetite. Both swimming fine and no heavy breathing. Bought them all from the same LFS at approximately same time. LFS does 28 day quarantine and copper. Had tang (died today) for 5 weeks. Clown fish for 6 weeks. I have bought coral recently but dip all coral in CoralRx. I just don’t understand how this happened so quickly. All was going fine until my nutrients bottomed out and got a large outbreak of dino. I put the UV back on. Don’t think the prazipro is going to make a difference if it is velvet.

Prazi won't help with velvet. I do have to concede that I do not have experience with toxins given off by dinoflagellates, as we have never had that issue with our systems here (our nutrients are never that low!).

Jay

Sam816 · May 6, 2021

dblox said:
Two clowns. Both ate yesterday but today just a nibble. I know pazipro suppress appetite. Both swimming fine and no heavy breathing. Bought them all from the same LFS at approximately same time. LFS does 28 day quarantine and copper. Had tang (died today) for 5 weeks. Clown fish for 6 weeks. I have bought coral recently but dip all coral in CoralRx. I just don’t understand how this happened so quickly. All was going fine until my nutrients bottomed out and got a large outbreak of dino. I put the UV back on. Don’t think the prazipro is going to make a difference if it is velvet.

sorry for your loss. coral dips wont kill ich/velvet. If you are going for quarantine for fish it's a good idea you quarantine corals n CuC as well. I know its very difficult to resist the temptation but it saves a lot of heart break in the long run.
After having 2 ich outbreaks in my tank now I have 2 full time QTs running. one for fish n one for corals + CuC. Nothing is going in my Display before staying in the QT for at least 6 weeks.

Lostreef · May 6, 2021

Wow. I thought coral quarantine was just for pests (ie flatworms). Never knew they could carry ick and velvet. That’s gotta be where it came from. Thanks for your response.

Sam816 · May 6, 2021

Reefers who follow strict QT regimens don't let anything wet enter their Display tank unless it has gone though some sort of QT process. even equipment like refractometer, syringes & buckets are not shared.
welcome to the hobby lol

Lostreef · May 6, 2021

So....both clowns are now showing signs. Is there any guidance to life after velvet if they don’t make it? This is a pretty big blow for my first try. What to I need to do with my rock and corals if I want to continue. How long to wait for any future plans?

Sam816 · May 6, 2021

catch them and put them in a bucket/spare tank . add some bio media from your main tank and start adding copper if u want to treat them. velvet kills quickly so u need to up the concentration of copper quickly. fish wont like it. I've used copper power. it is more gentle on the fish.

after that you will need to go fallow(without fish) for 76 days. If u have resources as in spare tank/heater wave pump etc then do what i did. set up a QT for corals + CuC and empty your main tank. leave it to dry for 48 hrs then fill it up with fresh water for 14days(minimum). this will kill everything in your display including good bacteria.
parallel to that get some fresh ceramic bio media, put it in a saltwater bucket with a heater & pump to start a cycle. ghost feed the bucket to initiate and populate good bacteria.
I had multiple freshwater aquariums before I started my 1st marine tank so i had spare equipment at hand.
I lost 5/7 fish during my 1st ich outbreak but 2nd time I managed to save all of them because I had a QT ready and I imported copper power(it comes under banned products in Australila;Facepalm).

make sure you don't put bio media from QT back into your DT.

Lostreef · May 7, 2021

Able to move the two clown fish to hospital tank and in Cupramine. They are very active and no heavy breathing. Tried to give them a little flake and pellet food but didn’t eat. Can Cupramine suppress appetite? Do I need to do a water change or anything before next dose? Bottle says to dose again in 48 hours.

Sam816 · May 7, 2021

Check the copper concentration using a reliable copper checker. If the concentration falls below therapeutic level then add as required. If you do a water change make sure you top up cupramine and check copper concentration again. U go below therapeutic level then it might not be effective. If you go higher then it's bad for the fish. It's not that complex in practice. There are many 'calculators' online you can follow . Stay calm and keep testing regularly.
Here is an example. This is a calculator for copper power.

Copper Power Calculator | CALCONIC_ Calculator

Custom Copper Power Calculator calculator, built using CALCONIC_

www.calconic.com

Lostreef · May 8, 2021

Sam816 said:
Check the copper concentration using a reliable copper checker. If the concentration falls below therapeutic level then add as required. If you do a water change make sure you top up cupramine and check copper concentration again. U go below therapeutic level then it might not be effective. If you go higher then it's bad for the fish. It's not that complex in practice. There are many 'calculators' online you can follow . Stay calm and keep testing regularly.
Here is an example. This is a calculator for copper power.

Copper Power Calculator | CALCONIC_ Calculator

Custom Copper Power Calculator calculator, built using CALCONIC_

www.calconic.com

So....both clowns are very active and swimming around the QT. Not reclusive at all and no heavy breathing. No scratching at all. But I can’t get them to eat. They go up to the food smell it or just spit it out. They act interested and swim to the food but won’t eat it. Noticed this morning one of them had a tiny slight string of poop. They haven’t eaten for a couple of days so not sure if it’s just stress response or not. Every now and then one of them does a “yawn” but not constant. They are still doing their “dance” with each other. I just can’t figure out why they won’t eat. Any ideas/guidance?

Sam816 · May 8, 2021

White n Stringy poop can be an indication of internal parasite. I won't suggest adding more medications before getting their appetite up. Try entice or garlic guard by seachem to make food more appetizing.
Or get live brine shrimp/worms.

Lostreef · May 8, 2021

Sam816 said:
White n Stringy poop can be an indication of internal parasite. I won't suggest adding more medications before getting their appetite up. Try entice or garlic guard by seachem to make food more appetizing.
Or get live brine shrimp/worms.

Thank you!!!