T5 question for lighting experts - coral coloration and growth; not "look"

[kyley]

Hi All,
I have LEDs as my primary lighting (3 Noopsyche K7 fixtures). I'm adding two T5 bulbs (and I already tested a few variants) to go with the LEDs primarily to provide a little better coverage / supplemental lighting for my corals (softies, LPS, and SPS). So I'm considering these options and have questions about them:
* ATI Actinic: Are these going to be the best for coral health, coloration and growth? They don't add much visible brightness to the tank, add a little bit of pop, but not much compared to the LEDs. But if they're best for coral coloration and growth, I'll go with two of them.
* ATI Blue Plus: I know these area a favorite for their look, but I prefer the look of the LEDs alone, so I'm not as concerned about the look. They add more pop than the Actinic (but not very noticeable with the LEDs on). They should be good for coral health, coloration and growth, but maybe not as good as Actinic?
* ATI Purple Plus: Not really any better than Actinic or Blue Plus for coloration and growth? At any rate, it's a purple look, a little white, and doesn't give as much pop as the other two. I don't like the look with the LEDs.
* ATI Coral Plus: Not as good for coloration and growth, right? At any rate, they're pretty white (less than Aquablue Special) and don't look that good with the LEDs.

So, I'm planning on one of these options:
A. 2x Actinic. Best option for coloration and growth?
B. 1x Actinic, 1x Blue Plus. I was planning on this route, but there's the windex look and (while not a big deal) a bit of color differences from front to back of tank (one in front of LEDs, one behind). And if A is better for coloration and growth, maybe just go that rotue.
C. 2x Blue Plus. I'd do this if you all think Blue Plus is actually better for coloration and growth, but my understanding is actinic bulbs are (although Blue Plus gives corals more visible pop)?

Thanks for your thoughts!
--Kyle

 

[kyley]

Bump. Anyone?

 

[madweazl]

Based on your comments, you seem to prefer heavy blue. Certainly nothing wrong with actinics but I think you'd be better off overall with something a little more well rounded like the Blue+, AquaBlue Specials, or Coral+.

 

[kyley]

Based on your comments, you seem to prefer heavy blue. Certainly nothing wrong with actinics but I think you'd be better off overall with something a little more well rounded like the Blue+, AquaBlue Specials, or Coral+.

Well, it's more that I want to (and can) control the amount of white with the LEDs alone. If I turn them up, I have way more white than I would need. I just want to provide the best lighting for coral growth / coloration / health with these bulbs since it's for supplementation. Make sense?

So AB Special and Coral Plus provide too much always on (when the T5s are on) white. And, I don't think white is the best for the coral coloration / growth, right? So I could do actinic, blue plus, or maybe even purple plus / a combo of them. The LEDs already provide the look that I want. This is more about upping the PAR a bit and providing better coverage for coloration/growth. Thanks,
--Kyle

 

[dwest]

I have kessil LED’s. I added blue plus and coral plus bulbs to mine in a 1:1 ratio. I think you can go many directions here honestly. I asked a few experienced t5 folks to come up with my selection. I’m happy with them.

 

[kyley]

I have kessil LED’s. I added blue plus and coral plus bulbs to mine in a 1:1 ratio. I think you can go many directions here honestly. I asked a few experienced t5 folks to come up with my selection. I’m happy with them.

Right, but I think most are concerned equally with the look and the coral health/coloration/growth. I'm primarily concerned about the latter 3 in this case. Although in my case, I also thought the Coral Plus added too much white (the LEDs can add plenty of white on their own) which doesn't do as much for the benefit of the corals.

If I were only running T5s, it would be very different (actually, my other tank with 6 T5s has 3 Blue Plus, 1 Coral Plus, 1 Purple Plus, and 1 Actinic). Thanks,
--Kyle

 

[X-37B]

I run 3c+ 3b+ good color and growth as its a full spectrum combo.

 

[dimo]

From all the readings I've ever done the Blue Plus is the gold standard in terms of coral health due to the spectrum it provides. Most people who use T5 as a supplement to LED use these bulbs. The actinic bulbs are geared more for color than for growth from what I understand. The wavelength in that bulb is very narrow.

 

[NanoDJS]

if your running only 2 bulbs as supplemental, than the only bulb worth running is the ATI aquablue special , its full spectrum, if your trying to hit the shaded areas so they grow/color thats what you need . your veiwing is going to be under led anyhow, the other bulbs are merely coloring agents for our pleasure so it looks pleasing (t5 is very white ) , but they dont grow ish . There are vast amounts of charts and information on this. if you put only fiji purple / actinic /blue plus /purple plus in a hood you wouldnt have very good growth , crazy color but slow growth compared to 15k/20k spectrum.

 

[kyley]

From all the readings I've ever done the Blue Plus is the gold standard in terms of coral health due to the spectrum it provides. Most people who use T5 as a supplement to LED use these bulbs. The actinic bulbs are geared more for color than for growth from what I understand. The wavelength in that bulb is very narrow.

Thanks! Yeah, it's definitely very narrow in the actinics. I heard in a video that the narrow spectrum of them is highly usable by coral though. Maybe that was incorrect, but that's why I'm asking here. Here's that video (Actinic at 3:00):
ATI Bulb Comparison
Thoughts on that? The actinic certainly does cover a spectrum that the other bulbs don't touch.

That said, I tested the Actinic and Blue Plus myself, and to my eyes, the Blue Plus add a lot more pop than the Actinic. But if the Actinic would cause my corals to color up better than the Blue Plus, I'd use the Actinics.

Most likely I'm going with one of these options:
2 Actinics
1 Actinic, 1 Blue Plus
2 Blue Plus
Thanks,
--Kyle

 

[kyley]

if your running only 2 bulbs as supplemental, than the only bulb worth running is the ATI aquablue special , its full spectrum, if your trying to hit the shaded areas so they grow/color thats what you need . your veiwing is going to be under led anyhow, the other bulbs are merely coloring agents for our pleasure so it looks pleasing (t5 is very white ) , but they dont grow ish . There are vast amounts of charts and information on this. if you put only fiji purple / actinic /blue plus /purple plus in a hood you wouldnt have very good growth , crazy color but slow growth compared to 15k/20k spectrum.

Really? That's the opposite of what I understood. I thought the blue ranges are the best for growth and coloration (while white contributes to algae, but not a lot to coral growth)?

 

[Mortie31]

Is the heavy blue look really good for coral growth?? This seems to be brought around by a very sketchy article by Ecotech and wwc... do you have any other articles that your basing your stance of heavy blue being good for health and growth, a lot of corals originate in shallow waters where the spectrum isn’t filtered out..

 

[The Aquatic Arsenal]

I would go with all ATI Blue Plus for coral growth. A lot of corals grow in only blue light naturally. I guess it would depend on what coral you are keeping.

 

[NanoDJS]

Really? That's the opposite of what I understood. I thought the blue ranges are the best for growth and coloration (while white contributes to algae, but not a lot to coral growth)?

15k-17.5k will give the fastest growth, 20k-23k and up gives better color , again there is mountains of research and data on this also , those would be best for growth / health . If you want color than use KZ Fiji Purples if you can get em . Also imho 2 t5s are not going to make a differance , which is why all the supplemental hoods use at least 4 , they dont throw alot of light , just alot of coverage. The t5 rule of thumb was 3-4 watts per gallon and it should be bright enough (which wasn't ) so alot of people ran 6 bulb units to keep SPS on most standard size tanks . What size tank (dimensions ) do you have , I think you would be alot better off with 2 orphek bars from the sounds of it . This whole t5 resurgence thing blows my mind , especially since the people doing it have "such great lights" they should have skipped the LED and got a real ATI/ giessman 8 bulb pro hood for a ton less dough .

 

[Mortie31]

I would go with all ATI Blue Plus for coral growth. A lot of corals grow in only blue light naturally. I guess it would depend on what coral you are keeping.

Is that really true? How many corals do actually grow at depths deep enough for all light except blue to be filtered out? If you take the Great Barrier Reef for instance, most corals are not deep enough for this, same goes for the Caribbean.. which regions and corals do you mean?

 

[NanoDJS]

I have never dove in " blue light " looked like daylight every time , saw plenty o coral though , just like Mortie said almost all the stuff we get in the hobby comes from 30ft range and rarely some stuff as low as 60ft its a ghost town down therefor pickins anyhow . Also a tidbit to think about, every coral I ever saw ITW was next to or on a ridge /ledge mountain if you will . so how much direct 100 % overhead light you think it gets in a day ???? What most people blast at their reef <? JF has pointed that out before on also , look at his corals ....... Why are keloids are becoming so prevalent on soft tissue animals , and people gleefully cheer are now worth more $$$ realy , no it has cancer ...... This hobby is my passion and I will always love it and the people who want to keep these animals alive to thrive and flourish. Just do your due diligence like you are , walk a mile in the corals shoes , think like a coral , and dont overdo it . I could get into massive oratory of the reason why that is , but others have done it . I suggest you Ask Sanjay about white light vs blue light .......... lol I am only trying to keep your corals happy and at the end of the day you happy . Hope I didnt get misunderstood here , I own all these relics of reefing and have an intimate knowledge of the fine details associated with em .

 

[madweazl]

15k-17.5k will give the fastest growth, 20k-23k and up gives better color , again there is mountains of research and data on this also , those would be best for growth / health . If you want color than use KZ Fiji Purples if you can get em . Also imho 2 t5s are not going to make a differance , which is why all the supplemental hoods use at least 4 , they dont throw alot of light , just alot of coverage. The t5 rule of thumb was 3-4 watts per gallon and it should be bright enough (which wasn't ) so alot of people ran 6 bulb units to keep SPS on most standard size tanks . What size tank (dimensions ) do you have , I think you would be alot better off with 2 orphek bars from the sounds of it . This whole t5 resurgence thing blows my mind , especially since the people doing it have "such great lights" they should have skipped the LED and got a real ATI/ giessman 8 bulb pro hood for a ton less dough .

Actually, there are many sources that state 6500k provides unrivaled growth rates (though with a yellow cast). Most T5s cover a varied spectrum because the manufacturers realize the sun does the same. Despite what we see occasionally, even the red spectrum penetrate to a pretty good depth and there is no denying the corals are doing something with everything it's providing. I already provided my recommendation, do with it what you will.

 

[kyley]

15k-17.5k will give the fastest growth, 20k-23k and up gives better color , again there is mountains of research and data on this also , those would be best for growth / health . ...

I have never dove in " blue light " looked like daylight every time , saw plenty o coral though , just like Mortie said almost all the stuff we get in the hobby comes from 30ft range and rarely some stuff as low as 60ft its a ghost town down therefor pickins anyhow . Also a tidbit to think about, every coral I ever saw ITW was next to or on a ridge /ledge mountain if you will . so how much direct 100 % overhead light you think it gets in a day ???? What most people blast at their reef <? JF has pointed that out before on also , look at his corals ....... Why are keloids are becoming so prevalent on soft tissue animals , and people gleefully cheer are now worth more $$$ realy , no it has cancer ...... This hobby is my passion and I will always love it and the people who want to keep these animals alive to thrive and flourish. Just do your due diligence like you are , walk a mile in the corals shoes , think like a coral , and dont overdo it . I could get into massive oratory of the reason why that is , but others have done it . I suggest you Ask Sanjay about white light vs blue light .......... lol I am only trying to keep your corals happy and at the end of the day you happy . Hope I didnt get misunderstood here , I own all these relics of reefing and have an intimate knowledge of the fine details associated with em .

So based on your posts, some combination of Coral Plus (15k) and Blue Plus (20k) would be best for growth? And some combination of Blue Plus (20k) and Actinic (??k, but guessing 23k+?) would be best for color?

But when you say "gives better color" are you talking about the look, or are you talking about the coral coloring up best from that light spectrum?

Side note - in looking at your statements, just to play devil's advocate... I would say that daylight doesn't mean much for corals. When I dive, it only takes a few feet before reds start filtering out. Most coral is deeper than a few feet below the surface. And if daylight was best for our corals, we'd be using 6k daylight bulbs, right?

BTW, my tank is 120g 4x2x2. I have 3 Noopsyche K7 Pro II LEDs. I'm adding two 48" T5 bulbs. Of course it's not a ton of additional light, but a little is better than nothing, right?! And it's not really to add a ton more PAR, but to get better coverages. It will reach some areas that are entirely shadowed by the rocks with the LEDs. Which should at least be good for my softies. Cheers,
--Kyle

Actually, there are many sources that state 6500k provides unrivaled growth rates (though with a yellow cast). Most T5s cover a varied spectrum because the manufacturers realize the sun does the same. Despite what we see occasionally, even the red spectrum penetrate to a pretty good depth and there is no denying the corals are doing something with everything it's providing. I already provided my recommendation, do with it what you will.

Interesting. FYI, the post you were replying to was not me (the OP). And I'm taking everyone's feedback into consideration. I'm starting to consider a Coral Plus and Blue Plus now, even though I don't love the look. I can change it throughout the day though. Have the Coral Plus on more when I'm not around and the Blue Plus on more when I am. If that's what's best anyway! Thanks!
--Kyle

 

[The Aquatic Arsenal]

Is that really true? How many corals do actually grow at depths deep enough for all light except blue to be filtered out? If you take the Great Barrier Reef for instance, most corals are not deep enough for this, same goes for the Caribbean.. which regions and corals do you mean?

What I was actually thinking was what wavelength corals use for photosynthesis.

 

[Mortie31]

What I was actually thinking was what wavelength corals use for photosynthesis.

The wavelengths that corals in nature receive is entirely dependent on the depth of water