The Dutch Synthetic Reefing method (DSR) has made its way to the USA!

Goubli

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Jan 5, 2017
Messages
110
Reaction score
67
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
I am hoping people will respond in this thread. I am 90% sure I am going to make a switch to this method.

Glenn or someone else-on the DSR EZ calculator for the EZ Carbon do you just start on the D1 setting and monitor? I assume the D1 stands for day 1? I know on the full calc you input PO3 and Nitrate values, but not in the EZ.

So do you just run the amount for D1 and then check the next day to see the effect? Is it a situation where you just eventually find the current ideal D number for equilibration for the tank and then monitor for changes from then on? The other parts of the calculator seem very straightforward.

How long does it seem to take on average to get the aquariums stable after switching to this method? Glenn, I have read the entire big thread here and on other forums. Thank you for all the work you put into tinkering and fleshing this out for the hobby. And definitely thanks for the efforts to get your products into the US market. I only just revisited this topic recently as prior to the only way was to order out of country.

Thanks,
Steve
 

90's reefer

Fight the Good Fight
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Sep 10, 2018
Messages
5,844
Reaction score
10,276
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
NorCal
I am hoping people will respond in this thread. I am 90% sure I am going to make a switch to this method.

Glenn or someone else-on the DSR EZ calculator for the EZ Carbon do you just start on the D1 setting and monitor? I assume the D1 stands for day 1? I know on the full calc you input PO3 and Nitrate values, but not in the EZ.

So do you just run the amount for D1 and then check the next day to see the effect? Is it a situation where you just eventually find the current ideal D number for equilibration for the tank and then monitor for changes from then on? The other parts of the calculator seem very straightforward.

How long does it seem to take on average to get the aquariums stable after switching to this method? Glenn, I have read the entire big thread here and on other forums. Thank you for all the work you put into tinkering and fleshing this out for the hobby. And definitely thanks for the efforts to get your products into the US market. I only just revisited this topic recently as prior to the only way was to order out of country.

Thanks,
Steve
Yes start at d1 and go slow.
I ran d1 dose for 3-4 days before scaling up and did the same for each higher dose.
I checked po4 every week.
For me when the green algae on the glass turned white, i.e., bacteria, I backed off a few ml's and checked po4.
Every system is different so its hard to say how long it takes as feeding and export on each system is different.
 

Goubli

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Jan 5, 2017
Messages
110
Reaction score
67
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
That's sort of what I figured. I checked my levels yesterday and PO4 is 0.08 down from around 0.2 as I started running GFO again. Nitrate between 3-4. I'm sort of concerned about throwing off the PO4/NO3 ratio until I get the EZ carbon so I may stop the GFO.

I'm currently running ESV 2 part but their prices have skyrocketed since COVID and I think the DSR trace replacement is more thoroughly fleshed out. I ordered the starter pack yesterday for the EZ, but I am sure down the line I may convert to full. I also need to rework/get a new sump because I will need to run the PF in the sump and my return pump compartment won't allow the PF attachment.

So, when you say run for a few days and then decrease a few mLs do you mean you decrease by changing to the next lowest preset D number setting on the calculator, or do you adjust down by less?

Also, one thing I think is difficult is to calculate the actual volume of water in the aquarium. It becomes difficult after you add rock and then a sump. Then corals grow and displace water as well.

How do you all go about calculating your volume?
 

90's reefer

Fight the Good Fight
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Sep 10, 2018
Messages
5,844
Reaction score
10,276
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
NorCal
That's sort of what I figured. I checked my levels yesterday and PO4 is 0.08 down from around 0.2 as I started running GFO again. Nitrate between 3-4. I'm sort of concerned about throwing off the PO4/NO3 ratio until I get the EZ carbon so I may stop the GFO.

I'm currently running ESV 2 part but their prices have skyrocketed since COVID and I think the DSR trace replacement is more thoroughly fleshed out. I ordered the starter pack yesterday for the EZ, but I am sure down the line I may convert to full. I also need to rework/get a new sump because I will need to run the PF in the sump and my return pump compartment won't allow the PF attachment.

So, when you say run for a few days and then decrease a few mLs do you mean you decrease by changing to the next lowest preset D number setting on the calculator, or do you adjust down by less?

Also, one thing I think is difficult is to calculate the actual volume of water in the aquarium. It becomes difficult after you add rock and then a sump. Then corals grow and displace water as well.

How do you all go about calculating your volume?
I have a 120 with 40 breeder sump.
I base all my adds on the 120 tank size. If your off a few gallons I dont think it matters much and its easier.

Example: I start at day one 1ml per 100 liters.
100 liters is 26g's. I round down to 25 for simplicity.
So thats 5ml for my 120. Thats close enough for me.
I run the 5ml a day for a week.
You can go less hence the few days, 3-4, but a week is generaly what I use.
I have learned its best to go slower when first carbon dosing.
You do not want a large and quick buildup of bacteria.
Then d2 is run at 1.2×5ml=6ml a day for a week.
This is how I slowly rampup.
The decrease is when you start to see your green algae on the front glass turning white, i.e., its bacteria.
So if after a few weeks your at say 15ml a day for reference and you see white then back down to say 10ml and test po4 and no3.
This has worked well for me no matter what carbon I am running.
I have noticed that ez carbon is strong which is good as you dont need as much as say vinegar.
 

Goubli

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Jan 5, 2017
Messages
110
Reaction score
67
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Ok, this is really good information and thanks for the response. Do you run the PF in the sump or display? If the display are you just using a powerhead? I'm considering altering the method to use the main PF in the sump and then occasionally adding tossing a powerhead into the display for a couple days to supplement the sump.

How long have you been running the method and do you like it/noticed a difference?
 

90's reefer

Fight the Good Fight
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Sep 10, 2018
Messages
5,844
Reaction score
10,276
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
NorCal
Ok, this is really good information and thanks for the response. Do you run the PF in the sump or display? If the display are you just using a powerhead? I'm considering altering the method to use the main PF in the sump and then occasionally adding tossing a powerhead into the display for a couple days to supplement the sump.

How long have you been running the method and do you like it/noticed a difference?
My 120 is BB.
My frag system has sand.
I run no power filters.
I tried them on my return but its just another thing to monitor/change, imo.
I run 4 Tunze powerheads in the tank so their is no was to adapt then.
I would not want them in my main display anyway and did not see a difference on the return.
I run a 7" filter sock in my sump and it works well for me.
I am going to go to a filter roller system soon as I have seen them in action.
Mine is going to be a DIY as It is going to be manual instead of automatic.

I have ran a modified DSR since day one or 23 months now.
 

Goubli

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Jan 5, 2017
Messages
110
Reaction score
67
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
My 120 is BB.
My frag system has sand.
I run no power filters.
I tried them on my return but its just another thing to monitor/change, imo.
I run 4 Tunze powerheads in the tank so their is no was to adapt then.
I would not want them in my main display anyway and did not see a difference on the return.
I run a 7" filter sock in my sump and it works well for me.
I am going to go to a filter roller system soon as I have seen them in action.
Mine is going to be a DIY as It is going to be manual instead of automatic.

I have ran a modified DSR since day one or 23 months now.
What is your takeaway from this method of reef keeping? How does it compare to other methods you've tried, or is this your first attempt with reefing?

Have you noticed significant increases in amount of DSR liquids you've needed to purchase? How often are you testing water?

Thanks for sharing info. I just received my shipment of starter kit but am waiting until I run through this last batch of ESV 2 part and I need to potentially reconfigure my sump. But maybe I'll just run it as it is with my filter socks.
 

90's reefer

Fight the Good Fight
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Sep 10, 2018
Messages
5,844
Reaction score
10,276
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
NorCal
What is your takeaway from this method of reef keeping? How does it compare to other methods you've tried, or is this your first attempt with reefing?

Have you noticed significant increases in amount of DSR liquids you've needed to purchase? How often are you testing water?

Thanks for sharing info. I just received my shipment of starter kit but am waiting until I run through this last batch of ESV 2 part and I need to potentially reconfigure my sump. But maybe I'll just run it as it is with my filter socks.
I have been reefing since the late 80's.
This is by far the EZ'est method yet, lol.
I run a Carx.
My ez trace has been at 6ml a day for well over a year now in my 120.
My 45 frag is 3ml a day.
I do not run EZ carbon on my 45.
I am at 10ml a day on the 120.
I control EZ trace dosing, which is done by hand, by the mag level.
I test for mag maybe every 2-3 months. It is very stable.
I test alk daily because its simple and takes very little time.
I test ca every 3 months maybe, as it does not vary, if alk is stable for me at 7 dkh.

I do not run a power filter and just plugged this in and will not go back to socks on my 120.

I will be getting another for my 45.
20210510_182840.jpg
 

Goubli

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Jan 5, 2017
Messages
110
Reaction score
67
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
I finally am at the end of my ESV and will be hooking up the alk/ca DSR supplement today. I haven't done a water change since April 28 (almost 3 months) and everything looks good. Right now I only have a DOS so I may have to look into adding some more doser pumps. I was waiting to see reviews on the new Red Sea stuff.

How do you like the roller mat so far? It always looked like a great piece of equipment, but they came out after I'd already built and configured my sump.

My magnesium seems pretty stable so should I wait on actually dosing the trace once it drops or do I need to just run it at the recommended dose on the calculator? I honestly think I will convert to the full DSR since it is easier to adjust individual parameters.

As far as the carbon goes, right now I know I have some nutrients that are in stable balance but low levels (PO4 around 0.05 running GFO, Nitrate less than 1) so I am hesitant to do the carbon dosing. Is it better to stop the GFO and start dosing the carbon until I see some of the algae stuff start dying back?

I have a small patch of hair algae that I can't starve out, so that's what has me thinking I should start the carbon.

I'm surprised there's not more people doing this method tbh.
 

timlyg

New Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Jun 22, 2021
Messages
9
Reaction score
2
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
South Amboy
I use a modified DSR method.
The only product I use is the EZ Trace.
I run a carx and dose strontium too.
Bare Bottom and p04.02, no3 2-<5.
Never needed to carbon dose.
13 months since setup and no water changes.
I run a filter sock in place of the return wrapped in floss.
I also run lower alk at 7-7.5.
Cal 450
Mag 1350
Startup pic and now.
All grown from frags.
I love the EZ trace.
20190706_135706.jpg
20200702_184556.jpg
Very curious, what do you think that actually lowers your nitrate like that? Certainly it can't be ca/mg dosing. Could it be the filter sock? I have a 50galon and a sump and tried resins and refugium which isn't growing up after 2 months and was considering Carbon dosing for my 40+ppm Nitrate level until I saw you post. Love the NO WATER CHANGE part!
 

timlyg

New Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Jun 22, 2021
Messages
9
Reaction score
2
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
South Amboy
This is now:
The usual maintenance shedule of the EZ550reef tank:
- Feeding fish, 2 times a day
- Daily autodosings EZBuffer, EZCalcium, EZTrace, EZCarbon. (When required NO3+, PO4+)
- Cleaning windows, once in 2-3 days
- Replacing powerfiĺter wool, once in 2-3 days
- Measure water parameters; Alk and Ca once in 2 weeks. PO4, NO3, Mg, K, B, I once in 4-6 weeks
- Checking dosing system, once in 2 weeks
- Pruning corals, once in 2 months
- Cleaning light fixture, once in 2 months
- Replacing T5 bulbs, once in 6 months
- Rescaping due to growth rate, once a year (6- up to 18 months)

Visual check and action when required, when ever i feel like or required

- NO skimmer since nov 2019, due to EZCarbon, powerfilter Corals growth
- NO waterchanges since 2015, due to dosings
- NO cleaning gravel since 2016, due to archaster typicus and planulata maretia
- NO algea issue, due to cleaning crew urchin and tangs

Read more about it here: https://www.aquariumstats.com/tankProfile.php?tid=81
20200723_212811.jpg
20200723_212602.jpg
20200722_144057.jpg
20200722_144321.jpg
does the ez carbon dosing really work? anything else that lowers Nitrate? I am desperate for a solution to my 40+ppm Nitrate problem!
 

90's reefer

Fight the Good Fight
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Sep 10, 2018
Messages
5,844
Reaction score
10,276
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
NorCal
Very curious, what do you think that actually lowers your nitrate like that? Certainly it can't be ca/mg dosing. Could it be the filter sock? I have a 50galon and a sump and tried resins and refugium which isn't growing up after 2 months and was considering Carbon dosing for my 40+ppm Nitrate level until I saw you post. Love the NO WATER CHANGE part!
Well I only run a filter sock and skimmer. I ran a Tunze 9410dc and no3 went slowly up to 20. I now run an over sized 9430dc on my 120 and the 9410dc is in my frag system.
After about 3-4 weeks no3 is now <5.
I also run ez carbon at 5ml a day but only use it to feed corals and not for nutrient control.
It will lower no3 and po4 at higher levels.
I run a small amount of gfo to keep po4 at <.1.
I also feed heavy at 8-10 cubes a day to feed 15 fish.
I now do 12 gallon wc every 2 months. Tank just looks better, imo with it.
Sg 1.0265-1.027
Alk 7-7.5
Ca 420-450
Mag 1350-140
No algae issues
I am running 5 powerheads on randon so alot of flow
A few current tank pics as everything is growing well at 26 months in.
20210805_115735.jpg
20210803_162618.jpg
20210803_162003.jpg
20210809_135326.jpg
 

90's reefer

Fight the Good Fight
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Sep 10, 2018
Messages
5,844
Reaction score
10,276
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
NorCal
Ok, so do you only dose the trace when mag level is low?
No I dose the trace daily 5ml in my 120 and 2ml in my 45 frag system.
The trace keeps mag levels between 1350-1400 in both systems.
It also keeps K between 400-420.
 

Goubli

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Jan 5, 2017
Messages
110
Reaction score
67
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
So you just run it regardless or what would make you change the dosing? Low or high mag? Do you test for K?

I used the EZ carbon at lowest dose level for about 6 out of 7 days (hand dosed) and it took my PO4 from 0.1 to 0.015 and nitrate from 0.25 to almost 0. I had to order the NO3 supplement to add nitrates. Added first dose of that yesterday.

I guess maybe I should start dosing the EZ trace? My mag been stable 1350-1450 for weeks. No water changes since end of April (14 weeks plus) and everything looks good and growing for the most part.
 

90's reefer

Fight the Good Fight
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Sep 10, 2018
Messages
5,844
Reaction score
10,276
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
NorCal
Ez trace is dosed to maintain mag at 1350 and K at 400-410.
I test for both.
I origanaly dosed it because I ran manmade media in my carx.
It only replenishes alk and ca.
I started at 2ml daily and peaked at 6ml.
I now dose 5ml a day as I have switched to coral bone media.
I have only been running the bones for a few months and mag has not moved. If it goes up I will lower dose.

You do not need to add nitrates just feed more, imo.

5ml a day of ez carbon does not affect no3 or po4 in my system.

I just prefer gfo for po4 control.
No3 stays at around 3 in my system.
 

Have you ever torn down a tank over an issue you couldn't seem to beat?

  • Yes! I have. (Tell us about what issue you faced in the thread.)

    Votes: 178 24.3%
  • No. Thankfully, I haven't.

    Votes: 377 51.5%
  • Nope, but it almost happened. (Share your experience in the thread.)

    Votes: 55 7.5%
  • Not yet, but I'm almost there. (Tell us what you're dealing with.)

    Votes: 61 8.3%
  • If you reef long enough, this will eventually happen to you.

    Votes: 47 6.4%
  • Other

    Votes: 14 1.9%
Biota Marine Life
Top