The trick to grow chaeto?

kilnakorr

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I don't have much luck growing chaeto.
First it went dark green and very brittle, and I thought it was either lack of trace elements or space (had grown to a 'brick' in a quite small space.
Now, after making alot of space, a bit more flow to help it tumble nicely, and dosing 'chaetogro' from Brightwell, it seems to become white and die.

I have a 40W grow light on it for 12hrs, and plenty of NO3 and PO4.

Any ideas on what to try and change before I shut down the refugium and go the chemical route instead?
 

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I don't have much luck growing chaeto.
First it went dark green and very brittle, and I thought it was either lack of trace elements or space (had grown to a 'brick' in a quite small space.
Now, after making alot of space, a bit more flow to help it tumble nicely, and dosing 'chaetogro' from Brightwell, it seems to become white and die.

I have a 40W grow light on it for 12hrs, and plenty of NO3 and PO4.

Any ideas on what to try and change before I shut down the refugium and go the chemical route instead?
If you’ve got loads of nutrients perhaps your giving it too much light. Can you reduce the intensity?
 

NowGlazeIT

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All about the sump turnover rate in my experience. I had the chaeto and algae scrubber in my 120g and I noticed the more flow I got, the quicker I needed to trim back the algae. Not just flow passing through the algae but the amount of display water going through the algae. Not easy to increase tank turnover rate for some, so another option is supplying ample amount of space for the algae to grow. If your nitrates are above 5ppm and your phosphates around .1 then I don’t think nutrients are an issue. Chaeto grow is good for replacing minor elements that most of us don’t test for. But there are test out there if your curiosity ends up there I recommend an icp test.
 
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kilnakorr

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If you’ve got loads of nutrients perhaps your giving it too much light. Can you reduce the intensity?
sounds like too much light.

I can't lower intensity on that light, but I can try running with a smaller fixture for a while to see if it makes a difference.
 

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kilnakorr

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I'm not sure, but doesn't it require that the leds are dimmable.
Similar things are available here although a bit more expensive.
I could also create some sort of diffuser to lower the intensity.

It does sound like you all agree it could be to much light, so will definitely lower the intensity somehow.
 

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I'm not sure, but doesn't it require that the leds are dimmable.
Similar things are available here although a bit more expensive.
I could also create some sort of diffuser to lower the intensity.

It does sound like you all agree it could be to much light, so will definitely lower the intensity somehow.
I used one of those on leds that did not have a dimming option, it cuts the power down preventing the lights from operating at full power. The diffuser sounds like a better option to me. These dimmers are made cheap and inconsistent
 
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kilnakorr

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I have now dimmed the light, and continued to dose the chaetegro from Brightwell. It seemed the old part of my chaeto wad still turning white, so 2 days ago I threw it out and I have a fist sized chunk left, which is still green.

Question is, IF I have fixed whatever issue I had with the chaeto, what is 'normal' growth rate? Should I expect it to double in size in a week or so?
I would like to know if the stuff is growing or simple doing nothing untill it dies again.
 

attiland

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I don't have much luck growing chaeto.
First it went dark green and very brittle, and I thought it was either lack of trace elements or space (had grown to a 'brick' in a quite small space.
Now, after making alot of space, a bit more flow to help it tumble nicely, and dosing 'chaetogro' from Brightwell, it seems to become white and die.

I have a 40W grow light on it for 12hrs, and plenty of NO3 and PO4.

Any ideas on what to try and change before I shut down the refugium and go the chemical route instead?
I use algae reactor but I can tell chaeto grow helps and it has really high flow compared to what is in a sump. ( 1,000 to 2,400 l/h)
 
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kilnakorr

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I use algae reactor but I can tell chaeto grow helps and it has really high flow compared to what is in a sump. ( 1,000 to 2,400 l/h)
This is my last try, using the sump. If I don't get some decent result, I'm ditching the fuge for a reactor. It takes up alot of space.
I do like all the pods I see crawling around the fuge though.
 

attiland

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This is my last try, using the sump. If I don't get some decent result, I'm ditching the fuge for a reactor. It takes up alot of space.
I do like all the pods I see crawling around the fuge though.
Tunze can sit in the sump too if space is the problem
 

attiland

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You can except a baseball sized chaeto to grow into a softball size between 1-2 weeks time
Mine stops spinning around the 2 weeks time due to its size.
295B8511-9389-4D39-B4E5-3335BA19A7E0.jpeg
 

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sounds like too much light.
Maybe. Too little flow is what turns it brittle. I have numerus tanks and have grown it under varying conditions. Too much light will burn it and turn it white. It takes a lot though and it will only be white on top if this is it
 

ClownWrangler

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This is my last try, using the sump. If I don't get some decent result, I'm ditching the fuge for a reactor. It takes up alot of space.
I do like all the pods I see crawling around the fuge though.

If you can figure out how to get good vertical flow up through the chaeto in the sump, it should effectively be the same thing as a "reactor". Flow is extremely important. I have done plenty of experiments with hang on refugium's to determine this. Also, if you posted some pictures it would help. This is a 6 watt light right against the chaeto. You can see only a small portion is burnt. Very high flow keeps the chaeto growing fast and clean. Its basically a home made "reactor". You could replicate this in a refugium on a bigger scale.

Also, this is for a 20 gallon tank with 4 clowns and 6 BTAs with the light running 24/7. I could use a slightly stronger light, maybe 9 watts if not on 24 hour cycle. So for a 90 gallon like you have in your build thread, your 40 watt light sounds about right if its an LED grow light

20210807_180532.jpg
20210807_180556.jpg 20210807_180604.jpg
 
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Pistondog

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Ime, you can't give too much light. Raise the chaeto to surface. Use one of these lights


I have a blanket that doubles in 3 weeks, yes there is a minimum of white on top, less than 5%, who cares.
 
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kilnakorr

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Also, if you posted some pictures it would help.
20210808_105432.jpg

The current situation. A little chaeto left.
Flow from return comes from the spraybar with red end, flowing right (and a little down).
Top right is a smaller powerhead with spraybar going left. This is making the chaeto tumble.
Looks fine at the moment.

Ime, you can't give too much light. Raise the chaeto to surface. Use one of these lights
I believe light intensity, depends on nutrients of all kinds. The light intensity drives the photosyntesis - with more light, more nutrients are required.
Just using a small nano tank light for now, and if the chaeto grows, I can try the growth light again.
 

ClownWrangler

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20210808_105432.jpg

The current situation. A little chaeto left.
Flow from return comes from the spraybar with red end, flowing right (and a little down).
Top right is a smaller powerhead with spraybar going left. This is making the chaeto tumble.
Looks fine at the moment.


I believe light intensity, depends on nutrients of all kinds. The light intensity drives the photosyntesis - with more light, more nutrients are required.
Just using a small nano tank light for now, and if the chaeto grows, I can try the growth light again.

OK. I don't think flow is your issue if that spray bar is tumbling the Chaeto well. That ball looks healthy though. The two most common mistakes people make is adding Chaeto too early, before there are nutrients, which can make it brittle and fall apart and not adding enough when the tank is ready for it. If you have measurable nitrates and good lighting, I'm baffled as to what's wrong. But even under good conditions that tiny ball will take a while to get to a respectable size. I think you may have corrected your issues, but now it just needs time to grow. I wouldn't be too concerned unless you have both rising nitrates and no growth. I had a ball that size in the setup I showed in the picture and it could not keep up with the nitrates. I had to do water changes until it got bigger. Now that its filled in, I haven't had to do a water change in over 6 months. I just remove about 1/3 every couple weeks.
 
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