Thoughts on mixing in dry food to current 100% frozen to increase nutrition diversity, lessen PO4?

[Nburg's Reef]

I wanted to get other's take on fish and coral nutrition while also bringing down PO4.

I currently feed my mixed reef mostly a rotation of LRS reef frenzy, PE mysis cubes, canned cyclops frozen into cubes, oyster feast, nori and occasionally the frozen San Francisco Bay angel blend (has sponges). I figure these are much better for the fish, even if I now have a higher PO4 concentration. my PO4 got upwards of 0.1 - 0.3 ppm. Most coral were fine, some acros browned and slowed. I have gotten them down to 0.06 and still working on continually lowering with a GFO reactor. NO3 has stayed in 5-10 ppm where I want it. I don't mind actively reducing po4 for a better fish health... but I was watching an interview with @Mike Paletta who said once he started feeding pellets from frozen mysis, he had fish start spawning again... So that made me think, should I start rotating in some TDO pellets to cover any missing nutrients and potentially reduce po4 burden in the process?

Maybe Mike Paletta or @Jay Hemdal, you have an opinion on the matter?

 

[MnFish1]

I wanted to get other's take on fish and coral nutrition while also bringing down PO4.

I currently feed my mixed reef mostly a rotation of LRS reef frenzy, PE mysis cubes, canned cyclops frozen into cubes, oyster feast, nori and occasionally the frozen San Francisco Bay angel blend (has sponges). I figure these are much better for the fish, even if I now have a higher PO4 concentration. my PO4 got upwards of 0.1 - 0.3 ppm. Most coral were fine, some acros browned and slowed. I have gotten them down to 0.06 and still working on continually lowering with a GFO reactor. NO3 has stayed in 5-10 ppm where I want it. I don't mind actively reducing po4 for a better fish health... but I was watching an interview with @Mike Paletta who said once he started feeding pellets from frozen mysis, he had fish start spawning again... So that made me think, should I start rotating in some TDO pellets to cover any missing nutrients and potentially reduce po4 burden in the process?

Maybe Mike Paletta or @Jay Hemdal, you have an opinion on the matter?

I'm sure Jay will weigh in. I use Flake and LRS. Despite not being as good as live foods - there are at least a couple articles out there that suggest that many 'live food' or 'frozen' foods do not offer a balanced diet. I feed my discus a beef heart mixture - alternating with pellets.

 

[DopamineKata]

I thought that pellets were more nutritionally dense and would result in higher numbers not lower.

 

[MnFish1]

I thought that pellets were more nutritionally dense and would result in higher numbers not lower.

But you dont feed as much dry. Part of the issue with frozen food is the 'water' that is frozen with them which is why some people say to thaw and dry your frozen food before feeding (I do not do that)

 

[Nburg's Reef]

I think there is a lot more waste with frozen as all the little parts and small tissue go uneaten by fish, but i think that will feed the coral and RFAs and other critters, so I don't mind them. Maybe that and the 'dirty water' can contribute to PO4.

I've never had to worry about PO4 and nitrate in the past as it was always too low. maybe the large corals kept things in check. Since restarting after a move, I have a larger fish load, but smaller coral mass, so now I am starting to see a rise in po4 and nitrates where I want them (i used to dose both, now my sodium nitrate and sodium triphosphate are in long term storage). Maybe that will go down once my leathers and acropora grow out. I think those two types of coral are amazing at cleaning water.

 

[Jubei2006]

I try to feed a little of everything (different types of frozen, different types of flake (algae vs. carnivore), different types of pellets, and nori (green and red)) just to increase nutritional diversity and try to prevent nutritional deficits in my fish. Fish seem fat and happy being fed 2 to 3 times daily. Don't worry to much about nitrates and phosphates as I have a relatively large refugium area (with GHA and Ulva) of about 20 to 25 gallons. Nitrates and phosphates seem to be in check monthly when I look at them. Guess my skimmer is okay reef octopus SRO 5000 for about 625 gallons total water volume.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I wanted to get other's take on fish and coral nutrition while also bringing down PO4.

I currently feed my mixed reef mostly a rotation of LRS reef frenzy, PE mysis cubes, canned cyclops frozen into cubes, oyster feast, nori and occasionally the frozen San Francisco Bay angel blend (has sponges). I figure these are much better for the fish, even if I now have a higher PO4 concentration. my PO4 got upwards of 0.1 - 0.3 ppm. Most coral were fine, some acros browned and slowed. I have gotten them down to 0.06 and still working on continually lowering with a GFO reactor. NO3 has stayed in 5-10 ppm where I want it. I don't mind actively reducing po4 for a better fish health... but I was watching an interview with @Mike Paletta who said once he started feeding pellets from frozen mysis, he had fish start spawning again... So that made me think, should I start rotating in some TDO pellets to cover any missing nutrients and potentially reduce po4 burden in the process?

Maybe Mike Paletta or @Jay Hemdal, you have an opinion on the matter?

Sorry - I don't really have a strong opinion on this. Mostly, I look at bioload and the food being fed on a dry matter basis.

One thing I do see that I always caution people about: many people want a tank full of corals and brightly colored fish, but they try to manage the No3 and/or PO4 by limiting the amount of food fed to the fish. I've seen literally starving fish kept in reef tanks and it can get ugly. You need to do what you are: feed the fish an appropriate amount of food and then manage the waster products by other means (or reduce the fish stocking density).

Jay

 

[mdb_talon]

I personally feed probably a dozen types of both dry and frozen food precisely because i dont really know the details of what each critter needs or what is always in the food i am feeding. Not sure it is the best approach but it works for me. The key when feeding so much of course is having enough export mechanisms to keep nitrates/phosphates where you want them.

 

[Nburg's Reef]

Sorry - I don't really have a strong opinion on this. Mostly, I look at bioload and the food being fed on a dry matter basis.

One thing I do see that I always caution people about: many people want a tank full of corals and brightly colored fish, but they try to manage the No3 and/or PO4 by limiting the amount of food fed to the fish. I've seen literally starving fish kept in reef tanks and it can get ugly. You need to do what you are: feed the fish an appropriate amount of food and then manage the waster products by other means (or reduce the fish stocking density).

Jay

Thanks for the response! I would never starve something just to make maintenance easier, lol. I am more concerned with fish health than the PO4 issue.

I may rotate in some high quality dry just to offer more, I figure it wont hurt the fish, but I won't be cutting back feedings.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Thanks for the response! I would never starve something just to make maintenance easier, lol. I am more concerned with fish health than the PO4 issue.

I may rotate in some high quality dry just to offer more, I figure it wont hurt the fish, but I won't be cutting back feedings.

I like to augment all my fish diets with good dry foods for the added supplements they contain.
Jay

 

[Jedi1199]

I feed all of my tanks the same mixture of frozen, dry and reef food.

I have 2 mixed reefs (55 and 32g) and a predator tank (180g)

I take a half pint mason jar, and defrost several cubes of a variety of frozen foods, then add in a couple good fat pinches of dry flake food and a teaspoon of Benepets. Each tank gets a bit of this mixture once a day. The predator tank also gets the occasional shrimp, oyster or squid chunk tossed in.

 

[Karen00]

I feed all of my tanks the same mixture of frozen, dry and reef food.

I have 2 mixed reefs (55 and 32g) and a predator tank (180g)

I take a half pint mason jar, and defrost several cubes of a variety of frozen foods, then add in a couple good fat pinches of dry flake food and a teaspoon of Benepets. Each tank gets a bit of this mixture once a day. The predator tank also gets the occasional shrimp, oyster or squid chunk tossed in.

What flake food do you use? Is it for herbivores or does it provide nutrition for carnivores as well?

 

[Jedi1199]

What flake food do you use? Is it for herbivores or does it provide nutrition for carnivores as well?

I use Ocean Nutrition Prime Reef Flakes. The canister says "For all tropical fish"

Since I use it as a supplement and not a staple, I honestly can't say if it really has any factors that are "more" beneficial for either fish. All of my fish accept pretty much whatever they see.

 

[Karen00]

I use Ocean Nutrition Prime Reef Flakes. The canister says "For all tropical fish"

Since I use it as a supplement and not a staple, I honestly can't say if it really has any factors that are "more" beneficial for either fish. All of my fish accept pretty much whatever they see.

Thanks. I would like to diversify the diet for my fish a bit more and want to make sure I buy food that is good for saltwater fish. I add Selcon to the frozen food but I'm not sure it's enough.

 

[Cina05]

I feed all of my tanks the same mixture of frozen, dry and reef food.

I have 2 mixed reefs (55 and 32g) and a predator tank (180g)

I take a half pint mason jar, and defrost several cubes of a variety of frozen foods, then add in a couple good fat pinches of dry flake food and a teaspoon of Benepets. Each tank gets a bit of this mixture once a day. The predator tank also gets the occasional shrimp, oyster or squid chunk tossed in.

That sounds like a good mix. I'm curious, are you mixing up a 1/2 pint of food to feed over multiple days? Or are you just using the jar to combine your mixture every day? I'm looking for a good way to give them a variety of foods every day without it taking too much time.