Treated fish with Coppersafe; still seeing symptoms

Discussion in 'Fish Disease Treatment and Diagnosis' started by JLynn, Oct 6, 2017.

  1. JLynn

    JLynn Well-Known Member

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    I have 4 fish in a QT tank right now: a pair of clownfish, a yellow clown goby, and a tailspot blenny.

    When I saw them all start to scratch themselves on the PVC in there, I started treatment with Coppersafe. It has now been a month, and yet I am still seeing a fair bit of scratching, and now both clownfish have a spattering of little white-ish dots on them, as well. The copper levels have remained in the theraputic range the entire time, so I don't understand what's going on here. I thought it was ich or maybe velvet, but if it were, that should be gone by now, right?
     
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  2. jsker

    jsker Reefing is all about the adventure R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Reef Squad Leader Build Thread Contributor Article Contributor Partner Member 2018

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    Are you treating with any antibiotics? I would suggest running some metroplex and Seacheme focus mixed with your frozen. I would also suggest adding a little vitamin c and b-12 to help with the stress, slim coat and immune systems
    #reefsquad any other suggestions?
     
  3. JLynn

    JLynn Well-Known Member

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    I'm only using Coppersafe; no antibiotics.

    How do you mix Metroplex and Focus with frozen food?
     
  4. jsker

    jsker Reefing is all about the adventure R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Reef Squad Leader Build Thread Contributor Article Contributor Partner Member 2018

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    Thaw out your frozen, an add a small amount of metroplex and focus. The focus binds the med to the food and the fish eat the med instead of it going into the water.
     
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  5. Maritimer

    Maritimer Well-Known Member R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Reef Squad Leader CTARS Member Build Thread Contributor

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    Roughly 1tbs of food, one "Seachem measure" of Metroplex and one "Seachem measure" of Focus.

    Mixed with food, it's a pretty good treatment for internal parasites - not sure about what's on their skin, though. Have they been through a Praziquantel treatment (or two...) or a freshwater dip for flukes?

    ~Bruce
     
  6. Humblefish

    Humblefish Dr. Fish Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Louisiana Reef Club Expert Contributor Article Contributor Partner Member 2018

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  7. 4FordFamily

    4FordFamily Tang, Angel, & Wrasse Addict R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Reef Squad Leader Build Thread Contributor Article Contributor Partner Member 2018

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  8. JLynn

    JLynn Well-Known Member

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    I was in the middle of Praziquantel treatment when, after my fish began itching and swimming a bit erratically, Humblefish said I should abort that and go for copper, just in case it was velvet. I'm giving the copper a couple extra days just to be safe, but I plan on switching back to Prazipro on Monday. And, no, I haven't done a freshwater dip.

    I'm sorry I can't get a better pic for you! I tried multiple times today, and even took one of the clownfish out into a smaller container to try and get a good photo, but all I succeeded in doing was stressing that poor fish half to death. :( They just move around too much and too fast.

    Anyways, here's my lone clear photo:
    37512259146_174d021e62_z.jpg
    You can see a couple of the white dots on the tail and dorsal fin, plus I think I see one on the edge of the stripe near her head.

    In the attempt to get a photo, I did also see a few small oval-shaped lumps under the skin of that clownfish. The dots are concentrated on and around the fins (especially the tail and dorsal fins). There aren't very many, maybe a dozen per clownfish?

    I really don't think it's brooklynella, either.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2017
  9. JLynn

    JLynn Well-Known Member

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    The dots look kind of fuzzy up close, if that helps. And scratch what I said about them being concentrated on the fins. I'm noticing quite a few more of them on the body of the clownfish.

    The clownfish are the only ones with the dots, but all of them are scratching themselves, especially the tailspot.

    There are new developments: the smaller clownfish (not the one pictured above) seems to have developed light sensitivity: it's staying in one of the PVC pipes. Neither of these clownfish have ever so much as entered the PVC pipes before today. Usually they both swim all around the aquarium. The clownfish in the photo is sticking around that PVC pipe, but not going inside it. However, it is swimming a bit oddly and doing this thing where it kind of twitches and curls inwards to the right. The tailspot blenny is breathing very quickly. The yellow clown goby, aside from some itching, is not showing any symptoms.
     
  10. Humblefish

    Humblefish Dr. Fish Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Louisiana Reef Club Expert Contributor Article Contributor Partner Member 2018

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    I'm very confused because the fuzzy dots sound like Lympho, but the sensitivity to light is a symptom of velvet. Except velvet doesn't make sense because these clownfish have been in copper for a month now. :confused:

    I will say this about brook... IME the presence of copper can cause odd symptoms to manifest with that disease. Copper will not completely eradicate brook, but it can suppress it for quite some time.
     
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  11. JLynn

    JLynn Well-Known Member

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    Okay, well it looks like Lympho wouldn't be a serious problem if that's it, and brook definitely is a serious problem, so I guess I should go ahead and switch from Coppersafe to Metroplex or something. I guess brook could make sense if copper screws with the symptoms, because only one of the clownfish is showing sensitivity to light.

    How fast can I safely make that transition? Like, would it be okay if I went to the LFS right now, got some fresh saltwater, did a 100% water change, and added the metronidazole right away?
     
  12. ngoodermuth

    ngoodermuth Well-Known Member R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Reef Squad Build Thread Contributor

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    Coppersafe and metroplex are ok together, so switching from one to the other- or even using them together (if necessary)- is fine.

    If you are ready to switch now you can do as large a water change as practical and run a poly filter for a day or so. Just make sure you remove any media before dosing the metronidazole.
     
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  13. JLynn

    JLynn Well-Known Member

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    Okay, great. I did a 100% water change, wiped the tank down with ATO water, and added MetroPlex.

    Thanks for all your help, y'all!
     
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  14. 4FordFamily

    4FordFamily Tang, Angel, & Wrasse Addict R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Reef Squad Leader Build Thread Contributor Article Contributor Partner Member 2018

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    Keep us posted!
     
  15. JLynn

    JLynn Well-Known Member

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    Alright. Well, the Metroplex seems to be helping a lot already. I guess it really is brook. Already, the clownfish and the tailspot blenny are about 10x more active than they have been for the past few days. And while the blenny's breathing is still too rapid, he was breathing very heavily as well last night, and he's not doing that anymore, which is a relief. The heavy, rapid breathing from him was the symptom I was most concerned about out of all the fish.
     
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  16. 4FordFamily

    4FordFamily Tang, Angel, & Wrasse Addict R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Reef Squad Leader Build Thread Contributor Article Contributor Partner Member 2018

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    Glad you’re already seeing improvement!
     
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  17. JLynn

    JLynn Well-Known Member

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    I looked up videos of healthy Tailspot blennies on youtube, and by comparison, I'd say mine is breathing about 3-4x fast than he should be. It looks like he's constantly hyperventilating. So I went ahead and dropped a big air stone in the tank. Hopefully increasing the oxygen levels in there will help get him breathing more normally.
     
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