Unhappy coral after salt brand change.

[Downfall]

I have an aqua forest test kit

What alkalinity does your thoroughly mixed saltwater measure at? Do this as a sanity check

 

[Justdrew]

Whatever the salt mixes to fresh, I dose the DT to equal that at all times. Changing salts can be a pain.

No need to boost anything, keep them stable, with as little flux as possible.

That can be tough if you are using a 12dKh salt mix.

 

[BeanAnimal]

Regardless of the original salt mix or its alk, if the tank is 7.8 dKH and you do a 25% change with a salt mix that has around 12 dKH, alk jumps from 7.8 to 8.85 dKH, which may upset some organisms.

Aren't the bolus folks taking daily jumps that large or larger though. I am not doubting your logic or diagnosis, but rather looking for your thoughts.

 

[ReeferDan22]

It depends on where you want to run alkalinity.

My advice is to run it around 8-9dkh. That’s a safe spot away from any possible danger. You can dose alkalinity with many products. One of the cheapest and easiest is good old food grade baking soda. Randy has all the articles and recipes here on R2R for easy dosing.

With that said, on a newer system with low stock, water changes may be sufficient enough with a higher alkalinity salt. Just don’t do large changes. 10% per week is plenty.

Ok sounds good, from what I’ve gathered, it sounds like I went too big on the WT with the new salt and shocked the corals. I’ll also consider other methods for cyano next time, it’s a young tank so I should have maybe just let it settle itself out. I appreciate all the help!

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Aren't the bolus folks taking daily jumps that large or larger though. I am not doubting your logic or diagnosis, but rather looking for your thoughts.

It may be the case the the cyano treatment was primary or solely the cause, but I think there may be a difference between corals that see such a swing every day, and can adjust their uptake mechanisms to account for that, as opposed to a stable tank that suddenly jumps and stays up.

This jump may not be the cause, and was bigger (1-2 dKH), but a_blind_reefer reported issues that may be jump related, and I've certainly seen others report issues (doesn't make them real, however).

Is it possible for Alkalinity to rise in a stable system by adding Aquaforest man made rock to sump?

Ok, I know this sounds crazy. I can hear it already, believe me. Almost didn’t even want to post this. I have a fairly mature mixed reef tank that has been stable for a long time. Nothing more than minor swings over years. The refugium section of my sump has been unused and empty for years. On...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[nckn8tr]

I have been using instant ocean reef crystals and I can tell you it sucks. I’m about to change. Alkalinity is about 6.5 when mixed and I have to dose to keep it at 10. Very annoying. That’s probably what’s going on. I think it’s just inferior salt. I premix the salt test the new batch and dose alk and calcium in tote so I don’t shock anything. Reef crystals also has a big phosphate issiue, I had .09 phosphate on mixed salt right out of bucket and rodi. I’m switching after this bucket is gone.

 

[BeanAnimal]

I have been using instant ocean reef crystals and I can tell you it sucks. I’m about to change. Alkalinity is about 6.5 when mixed and I have to dose to keep it at 10. Very annoying. That’s probably what’s going on. I think it’s just inferior salt.

It is a widely used salt. You may not have liked it, but I would suggest that it doesn’t “suck”.

I have used a dozen salts over the last 30 years… but Instant Ocean for the last 15. I don’t have a reason to change or spend a penny more.

 

[nckn8tr]

It is a widely used salt. You may not have liked it, but I would suggest that it doesn’t “suck”.

I have used a dozen salts over the last 30 years… but Instant Ocean for the last 15. I don’t have a reason to change or spend a penny more.

That’s fine it’s my opinion. Number do not lie. It is inferior to other salts. I guess it depends on use case.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I have been using instant ocean reef crystals and I can tell you it sucks. I’m about to change. Alkalinity is about 6.5 when mixed and I have to dose to keep it at 10. Very annoying. That’s probably what’s going on. I think it’s just inferior salt. I premix the salt test the new batch and dose alk and calcium in tote so I don’t shock anything. Reef crystals also has a big phosphate issiue, I had .09 phosphate on mixed salt right out of bucket and rodi. I’m switching after this bucket is gone.

I think there is some sort of problem if Reef crystals mixes to 6.5 dKH. It also is not the source of 0.09 ppm phosphate, although even it that's a correct value from, say, your RO/DI, its not a big deal. It's a far smaller amount added to the tank than daily feeding.

That said, I prefer normal IO to Reef Crystals because I do not want metal chelators and vitamins in my salt mix.

 

[nckn8tr]

I think there is some sort of problem if Reef crystals mixes to 6.5 dKH. It also is not the source of 0.09 ppm phosphate, although even it that's a correct value from, say, your RO/DI, its not a big deal. It's a far smaller amount added to the tank than daily feeding.

That said, I prefer normal IO to Reef Crystals because I do not want metal chelators and vitamins in my salt mix.

I have gone through about 16 buckets in the last 12 months it is never over 6.5. I don’t know what else to say

 

[BeanAnimal]

It is inferior to other salts

You mean it is your opinion that it is inferior to other salts

I think there is some sort of problem if Reef crystals mixes to 6.5 dKH. It also is not the source of 0.09 ppm phosphate, although even it that's a correct value from, say, your RO/DI, its not a big deal. It's a far smaller amount added to the tank than daily feeding.

That said, I prefer normal IO to Reef Crystals because I do not want metal chelators and vitamins in my salt mix.

Agreed on all counts…

Though my reasons for regular IO vs RC are primarily cost and consistency based on batch size and what I have been told about the difference in manufacturing process for IO based on the volume they make and sell globally.

Well that and I have no issues indicating a reason to switch.

My understanding could be very outdated, and not even based on fact to begin with. Sounds like your reasons make much more sense, and I will adopt them.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I have gone through about 16 buckets in the last 12 months it is never over 6.5. I don’t know what else to say

Maybe time to check out a new alk kit?

Is the bottom of your mixing barrel layered in piles of calcium carbonate?

 

[nckn8tr]

Maybe time to check out a new alk kit?

Is the bottom of your mixing barrel layered in piles of calcium carbonate?

Well my lFS uses reef crystals and they told me it’s around 5-7 for them and they constantly have to add alk in the coral tanks. I have Hannah checkers. I also have brought the water in for verification to try and make sure Hannah’s are not off, on another note, no I do not have a layer of carbonate in my mixing barrel.

 

[nckn8tr]

There are multiple other threads on here complaining about low alk with reef crystals. I am not the first.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Well my lFS uses reef crystals and they told me it’s around 5-7 for them and they constantly have to add alk in the coral tanks. I have Hannah checkers. I also have brought the water in for verification to try and make sure Hannah’s are not off, on another note, no I do not have a layer of carbonate in my mixing barrel.

Well, in all of the numbers I've seen folks post, I've never seen anyone post an alk for Reef Crystals below 7 dKH. More often it is substantially higher. This salt study was on the low side for RC, IMO, at 9.4 dKH.

The Ultimate Salt Test

I wanted to get this thread up and going before the holidays soak up all my time. I did a live YouTube with Deven from ReefDudes going over things but it is about 1.5 hours long. I will write up a more detailed explanation here in this first post soon. I am a hobbyist first and foremost. I have...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

There are multiple other threads on here complaining about low alk with reef crystals. I am not the first.

Can you show me one below 7 dKH? 8 dKH is low when you expect 12 dKH.

Could be some.

16 buckets in a row below 7 dKH seems highly unusual.

 

[BeanAnimal]

them and they constantly have to add alk in the coral tanks.

Anybody that has stony coral growing must constantly add alk.

Example — If your tank uses .5 dKH per day and your target is 9, then you are down to 6.5 dKH in a little over 6 days anyway.

If the aquarium is not growing stony coral or coralline then alk would not have to be added, nor would the alk level really matter. Sure it may drop due to abiotic precipitation, but who cares, there is no stony coral depending on it.

So I am not sure that I understand the point that you are trying to make.

 

[nckn8tr]

Anybody that has stony coral growing must constantly add alk.

Example — If your tank uses .5 dKH per day and your target is 9, then you are down to 6.5 dKH in a little over 6 days anyway.

If the aquarium is not growing stony coral or coralline then alk would not have to be added, nor would the alk level really matter. Sure it may drop due to abiotic precipitation, but who cares, there is no stony coral depending on it.

So I am not sure that I understand the point that you are trying to make.

Local fish store example: When you make water in a tote to be used in a system and the water that was made has a 6dkh. They have to dose to bring it to 10 before introducing to the system. As they have the system at 10 normally.

 

[nckn8tr]

I’m here to share my experiences. Not argue with everyone.

 

[rtparty]

I’m here to share my experiences. Not argue with everyone.

Your experience is so far out there and there are many ways to explain it.

I’ve followed salt very closely for years. I don’t like IO or IORC salt for many reasons but you and your LFS getting that low of alkalinity shows something else is going on. Bad test kit(s) and/or poor salinity checkers. 6.5dkh is simply incorrect with RC