Unsure if aggression or Fin Rot

[Retalia2]

My wife and I are pretty new to the saltwater tank hobby. We have had our tank for about 8 months now, it is a Waterbox 20. The current inhabitants are 2 helfrichi firefish. 2 Clownfish, a Bengai Cardinal, and a yellow watchman. Our water perameters are 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites, about 40 nitrates (we have a nitrate pad in the aquarium now). Our original clownfish passed away because he had a birth defect that caused part of his mouth to be fused shut. Yesterday we bought a new clownfish and were told it would be ok to include in our main tank when we took it home (along with a new goby). The fish was treated with copper before being put in a tank about 2 days before we got it. Our surviving clown was already a female, she is slightly larger than the new clown in the tank and can be a bit chasey, but she does let him have his space as well. We are very concerned, all of our other fish are in pristine condition and nothing has ever been wrong with them so for this to happen to one of our fish is a big shock.

 

[Retalia2]

Also if it is finrot, how do we treat against it properly. We are still very new and this is the first time we have ever dealt with anything like this

 

[vetteguy53081]

My wife and I are pretty new to the saltwater tank hobby. We have had our tank for about 8 months now, it is a Waterbox 20. The current inhabitants are 2 helfrichi firefish. 2 Clownfish, a Bengai Cardinal, and a yellow watchman. Our water perameters are 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites, about 40 nitrates (we have a nitrate pad in the aquarium now). Our original clownfish passed away because he had a birth defect that caused part of his mouth to be fused shut. Yesterday we bought a new clownfish and were told it would be ok to include in our main tank when we took it home (along with a new goby). The fish was treated with copper before being put in a tank about 2 days before we got it. Our surviving clown was already a female, she is slightly larger than the new clown in the tank and can be a bit chasey, but she does let him have his space as well. We are very concerned, all of our other fish are in pristine condition and nothing has ever been wrong with them so for this to happen to one of our fish is a big shock.

Clear aggression and what other fish do you have in the tank? Im assuming there's another clown doing this. If so, you will need to isolate either the aggressor or this clown. I would place this clown in an acclimation box allowing the tail to regrow.
Fin and tail rot will be raggedy and a bacterial issue in which this is not the case

 

[Retalia2]

Clear aggression and what other fish do you have in the tank? Im assuming there's another clown doing this. If so, you will need to isolate either the aggressor or this clown. I would place this clown in an acclimation box allowing the tail to regrow.
Fin and tail rot will be raggedy and a bacterial issue in which this is not the case

thank you so much for the input, my wife and I were freaking out at the thought of tail rot. There is another clown in the tank. There are now 2 clowns (including this new one). A Bengai Cardinal, 2 Helfrichi Firefish, 1 Yellow Watchman Goby, A Pincushion urchin and about 7 snails of assorted varities. With it being easter weekend we cannot go out and get one tomorrow, it would have to wait until atleast Monday. Do you have any suggestions on what we could do in the meantime to help isolate them? We do not have our own quarentine tank setup currently but we could set one up with a bit of instruction, we have all the materials to make one but havent sent one up due to a move in about 40 days.

 

[vetteguy53081]

thank you so much for the input, my wife and I were freaking out at the thought of tail rot. There is another clown in the tank. There are now 2 clowns (including this new one). A Bengai Cardinal, 2 Helfrichi Firefish, 1 Yellow Watchman Goby, A Pincushion urchin and about 7 snails of assorted varities. With it being easter weekend we cannot go out and get one tomorrow, it would have to wait until atleast Monday. Do you have any suggestions on what we could do in the meantime to help isolate them? We do not have our own quarentine tank setup currently but we could set one up with a bit of instruction, we have all the materials to make one but havent sent one up due to a move in about 40 days.

Suspect = other clown and assuming the other clown is larger- that would be the female which is often the aggressor and will play hierarchy taking over a part of the tank, stealing all the food and chasing the male away why the male is often smaller in size
Separation is important for healing of the fish

 

[Retalia2]

Suspect = other clown and assuming the other clown is larger- that would be the female which is often the aggressor and will play hierarchy taking over a part of the tank, stealing all the food and chasing the male away why the male is often smaller in size
Separation is important for healing of the fish

Will he be ok in the tank until monday when we can get an isolation box shipped to us? Or should we try to make a makeshift contraption to help him, if it would be beneficial to make something homemade do you recommend any guides etc to help us? Thank you for all of your time!

 

[vetteguy53081]

Will he be ok in the tank until monday when we can get an isolation box shipped to us? Or should we try to make a makeshift contraption to help him, if it would be beneficial to make something homemade do you recommend any guides etc to help us? Thank you for all of your time!

make shift, or egg crate or even the sump. If sump- I would place the aggressor in the sump that the one with tail issue

 

[Retalia2]

make shift, or egg crate or even the sump. If sump- I would place the aggressor in the sump that the one with tail issue

we have a waterbox so the sump option isnt really gonna work, we will go get some egg crate tomorrow and make something to hold her off for a bit, thank you for all the help

 

[Retalia2]

Update, we had to leave him in no isolation last night but are making something for him now. This is what he currently looks like, any tips or advice from anyone? Could this still possibly be fun rot or is this 100% aggression from the other clown?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Update, we had to leave him in no isolation last night but are making something for him now. This is what he currently looks like, any tips or advice from anyone? Could this still possibly be fun rot or is this 100% aggression from the other clown?

Welcome to Reef2Reef!

That has become very serious. Either the aggression continued, or a secondary bacterial infection started, or a bit of both. Once the tail bone becomes affected (the hypural plate) the fin won't be able to regrow. At this point, just isolating it may not be enough. The best course of action would be to move it to a treatment tank and dose with a broad spectrum, gram negative antibiotic. Second best would be to hold it in isolation, and try to give it antibiotic baths during the day. You'll need true antibiotics, not one of those "herbal remedies". I would suggest Neoplex if you can get it, or if not, then you could try Maracyn and Maracyn 2 at the same time.

Jay

 

[Retalia2]

Welcome to Reef2Reef!

That has become very serious. Either the aggression continued, or a secondary bacterial infection started, or a bit of both. Once the tail bone becomes affected (the hypural plate) the fin won't be able to regrow. At this point, just isolating it may not be enough. The best course of action would be to move it to a treatment tank and dose with a broad spectrum, gram negative antibiotic. Second best would be to hold it in isolation, and try to give it antibiotic baths during the day. You'll need true antibiotics, not one of those "herbal remedies". I would suggest Neoplex if you can get it, or if not, then you could try Maracyn and Maracyn 2 at the same time.

Jay

We do not have a quarantine tank setup, we have never really been instructed on how to make one etc since we have such a small main tank. Would treating the fish with antibiotics in our display tank cause negative effects to the other fish?

 

[Retalia2]

We do not have a quarantine tank setup, we have never really been instructed on how to make one etc since we have such a small main tank. Would treating the fish with antibiotics in our display tank cause negative effects to the other fish?

Also has his tail become effected now? Im still not 100% sure where the bone starts and what isnt just a fin.

 

[Retalia2]

We need to know if this fish is even going to be possible to save at this point, we are new to the hobby and aren’t super well equipped with everything.

 

[Retalia2]

Final update, with the tail being so beaten up, no proper antibiotics/hospital tank to hold him in, we put him down humanely. Thank you for the help, this hobby is a real heart jerker sometimes

 

[Retalia2]

We were also scared if the infection was bacterial it might infect the rest of our tank

 

[Jay Hemdal]

We were also scared if the infection was bacterial it might infect the rest of our tank

Sorry to hear. Most bacteria that externally infect fish are normally found in aquariums, they only become pathogenic when there is a break in the skin and the fish’s defenses are down. I don’t see this spreading unless other fish have damage.

Jay