Uronema in DT

[mark66]

Does anyone have any experience with Uronema in their DT? My chromis have died from the Uronema and I have read you are supposed to break the whole system down and bleach everything and get rid of all the invertebrates. But after doing all that can’t the Uronema be introduced again by a new coral frag or invert? Can you live with the Uronema in the tank and just not have fish more susceptible to this parasite? Thank you!

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Answered via PM.

Jay

 

[scubaboy]

Answered via PM.

Jay

I may have the same issue and am curious myself. Can we live with it?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I may have the same issue and am curious myself. Can we live with it?

The OP sent a picture of some green chromis with classic Uronema symptoms. Here is what I replied with:

Yes - that is pretty classic "Uronema". Now - nobody can really say if the ciliate causing this is the same in every case, or even if it is Uronema, but it should settle out, leaving resistant fish unaffected. Then, wait 6 weeks form the date of last symptom and quarantine all new incoming fish (Uronema isn't treatable, but you want any new active infections to be isolated in a QT).

Here is a link to my article on Uronema:

Uronema / Red Band Disease - Hemdal

Red Band Syndrome in Marine Fishes: Caused by the Protozoan; Uronema sp. Jay Hemdal Introduction: This moderately common disease of certain species of marine fish is so often misdiagnosed that most aquarists apply incorrect treatment methods...

www.reef2reef.com

Jay

 

[scubaboy]

The OP sent a picture of some green chromis with classic Uronema symptoms. Here is what I replied with:

Yes - that is pretty classic "Uronema". Now - nobody can really say if the ciliate causing this is the same in every case, or even if it is Uronema, but it should settle out, leaving resistant fish unaffected. Then, wait 6 weeks form the date of last symptom and quarantine all new incoming fish (Uronema isn't treatable, but you want any new active infections to be isolated in a QT).

Here is a link to my article on Uronema:

Uronema / Red Band Disease - Hemdal

Red Band Syndrome in Marine Fishes: Caused by the Protozoan; Uronema sp. Jay Hemdal Introduction: This moderately common disease of certain species of marine fish is so often misdiagnosed that most aquarists apply incorrect treatment methods...

www.reef2reef.com

Jay

Thank you Jay for your response. I have read your article several times. I don't want to hijack @mark66's thread, so I will start a new one and explain why I am asking.

Thanks

 

[4FordFamily]

In my experience, Uronema is USUALLY only a problem for some species, and even then often only new additions or unhealthy specimens. Chromis are an exception, most succumb (until established they seem to actually fight it off decently).

Anyhow technically if you want to eradicate it, you'd remove all fish and nuke everything and treat the fish with something such as metroplex for 15-30 days. HOWEVER -- I don't do this nor do I really recommend this course of action unless you have a really virulent strain or something along those lines.

GENERALLY susceptible fish:
Chromis
SOME butterflies -pearlscale & copperband being two I've seen it run rampant several times but most others are possible
SOME angelfish (usually dwarf angels and regal angels in particular though I've seen it take nearly all angels other than "large angels" where I've rarely seen a problem
SOMETIMES wrasse - seems to impact them more internally perhaps, based on some research from @Humblefish where he noted that it was on the spine of some wrasse we'd assume had spinal injuries (fairy wrasse). I've lost other wrasse to it but it was in a QT with LOTS OF infected fish where I didn't catch it in time. Very virulent, very uncommon IME

That said, I often let things "calm down" a few months in the DT. Quarantine and observe new additions, and pretend it isn't there. That may not always work for chromis, but it seems to for most others. I've seen it work for chromis. It's true uronema may never leave, but it seems to be less of an issue over time -- though it CAN "return" at any time. I've run DT for a decade or more with a fish that died of uronema in it to never have any current or even new additions ever show symptoms or uronema to cause a problem.

LOTS of gray area with this, but PERSONALLY I'd rarely recommend nuking the entire DT to start over for uronema.

Interestingly, I've NEVER seen uronema impact a tang, even when other fish are dropping like flies around them. I always found that interesting.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

In my experience, Uronema is USUALLY only a problem for some species, and even then often only new additions or unhealthy specimens. Chromis are an exception, most succumb (until established they seem to actually fight it off decently).

Anyhow technically if you want to eradicate it, you'd remove all fish and nuke everything and treat the fish with something such as metroplex for 15-30 days. HOWEVER -- I don't do this nor do I really recommend this course of action unless you have a really virulent strain or something along those lines.

GENERALLY susceptible fish:
Chromis
SOME butterflies -pearlscale & copperband being two I've seen it run rampant several times but most others are possible
SOME angelfish (usually dwarf angels and regal angels in particular though I've seen it take nearly all angels other than "large angels" where I've rarely seen a problem
SOMETIMES wrasse - seems to impact them more internally perhaps, based on some research from @Humblefish where he noted that it was on the spine of some wrasse we'd assume had spinal injuries (fairy wrasse). I've lost other wrasse to it but it was in a QT with LOTS OF infected fish where I didn't catch it in time. Very virulent, very uncommon IME

That said, I often let things "calm down" a few months in the DT. Quarantine and observe new additions, and pretend it isn't there. That may not always work for chromis, but it seems to for most others. I've seen it work for chromis. It's true uronema may never leave, but it seems to be less of an issue over time -- though it CAN "return" at any time. I've run DT for a decade or more with a fish that died of uronema in it to never have any current or even new additions ever show symptoms or uronema to cause a problem.

LOTS of gray area with this, but PERSONALLY I'd rarely recommend nuking the entire DT to start over for uronema.

Interestingly, I've NEVER seen uronema impact a tang, even when other fish are dropping like flies around them. I always found that interesting.

I would add various Anthias to your list, as well as parrotfish (wrasse-like, I know).

Here is the list I've compiled for my upcoming fish disease book:

Uronema infections have been seen in six families of fishes (in roughly descending order of frequency): Pomacentridae (damselfishes, specifically of the genus Chromis); Serranidae (subfamily Anthiinae the Anthias); Syngnathidae (seahorses and seadragons); Labridae (the wrasses); Chaetodontidae (the butterflyfishes); and, occasionally, Pomacanthidae (the angelfishes). There are, no doubt, other species of fish that can be infected.


Jay

 

[4FordFamily]

I would add various Anthias to your list, as well as parrotfish (wrasse-like, I know).

Here is the list I've compiled for my fish disease book:

Uronema infections have been seen in six families of fishes (in roughly descending order of frequency): Pomacentridae (damselfishes, specifically of the genus Chromis); Serranidae (subfamily Anthiinae the Anthias); Syngnathidae (seahorses and seadragons); Labridae (the wrasses); Chaetodontidae (the butterflyfishes); and, occasionally, Pomacanthidae (the angelfishes). There are, no doubt, other species of fish that can be infected.


Jay

Yes, good call!