Waterbox Frag 165.6 not level, gap on 2 corner, customer support tell me it's "normal"?!?

[IceRain29]

Are you able to talk to the dealer that sold it to you ? Otherwise I would suggest doing a chargeback with your credit card.. thank god I went with innovative marine for my 170G- it’s perfect and their customer service is top notch.

My dealer is talking with them right now. They don't even reply my email anymore. I saw all the youtuber posting awesome videos about their beautiful waterbox tank, but when I pull the trigger it's another story. I didn't pay it with my credit card... I know my dealer for a long time, he's trying his best to help me.
I was looking at Innovative Marine Lagoon EXT 150, a bit cheaper, if you factor in the sump and plumbing cost is almost the same. Glad you are happy with your tank, I'm not sure if I can just return the thing and order an Innovative Marine Lagoon EXT 150 from the same dealer.

 

[IceRain29]

Send it back and get a Cade.

I'll be glad to return it, I can even deliver the tank back to their Toronto warehouse. I don't think return is an option though... Best result is a replacement, we'll see, my dealer is trying hard right now with them.
If I'll ever looking for a mass produced tank, it will be an ELOS to be honest, it's just impossible to order an ELOS in Canada since no one carry them. CADE is an interesting option but my wife absolutely wants white cabinet and it's not an option with CADE.

 

[blaxsun]

I think CADE may be hard to get in Canada as well. They’ve never responded to any of my inquiries.

 

[IceRain29]

I think CADE may be hard to get in Canada as well. They’ve never responded to any of my inquiries.

Yep, we don’t have too many options in Canada.

 

[blaxsun]

Yep, we don’t have too many options in Canada.

Semi off-topic, while I've run some of the smaller IM tanks I'm not a big fan of most of their product line. I think Red Sea offers more in terms of the stand/cabinet and sump once you start going above 75 gallons. My LFS is supposedly starting to carry Waterbox tanks at some point so I was cautiously optimistic going forward, but based on a lot of stuff I've read over the past few days I think I'd get another Red Sea tank if I need another smaller setup.

 

[Forty-Two]

I ordered a Reef LX 270 - but I cancelled it due to the space in the cabinet below. If the stand requires a divider to have structural integrity - imo that's a warning sign. Waterbox makes lots of noise on their site about having 'Aluminum Frame Stands' - which is one of the reasons I initially chose them.
When I pointedly asked them whether the divider can be removed they replied with 'We dont recommend it'.

That was all I needed to hear, and I cancelled the order. Wow am I glad now reading this. (Im currently in discussions with Miracles even though the international shipping will be horrendous).

Without knowing the ins and outs of these companies (RedSea and Waterbox) - Ive often suspected they make their profit mostly on the stands and the sump. They over charge for these components. You'll also notice you cannot order the tank separate from the stand or sump - which leads me to believe this is where they cut their corners and make the profit.

Sorry to hear of the issues you've had OP. Canada actually has more options than I do here (In Israel) - because of your proximity to the US. Its quite a challenge getting a decent sized tank here.

 

[John734]

The worst part about @Waterbox Aquariums is they literally don’t even make the cabinet or tank, they are just sales people, that’s it.
So they should be able to excel in Customer service. But they don’t. Now they’re more worried about making their stupid YouTube videos that nobody watches.
And yes they will block you from emails, Instagram, YouTube and Facebook for asking too many questions.

 

[Panama Brown]

When I set up my Waterbox 180 a few months back I had a similar situation with what seemed to be a leveling issue. I went to home depot and picked up a 1/2" x 8'x8' sheet of insulation foam and put it beneath the glass. Cut it to size. Filled the tank with water and everything evened out exactly the way it should. It's an extra step they don't mention in the directions however it fixed the issue of leveling. Everything is seated just right with no issues. If youd like I can send pictures later this afternoon.

 

[IceRain29]

The worst part about @Waterbox Aquariums is they literally don’t even make the cabinet or tank, they are just sales people, that’s it.
So they should be able to excel in Customer service. But they don’t. Now they’re more worried about making their stupid YouTube videos that nobody watches.
And yes they will block you from emails, Instagram, YouTube and Facebook for asking too many questions.

I'll start a social media campaign soon if they keep ignoring me and my dealer, I'll let everyone know how they treat their customer. Red sea and other brand would taking care of the problem long by now. This is getting ridiculous.

 

[IceRain29]

Just want to let everyone check how bad the gap is without the water, 3 corner are floating, I can slide paper 1 foot under the tank all across both side. Multiple bubbles has developed in the bottom seam due to stress without support. That's 7 days with water running inside the tank, no rock, no sand, just water. The large amount of time that I wasted on this aquarium is crazy. I'm looking into the Consumer Protection Act of Ontario and will give them a call. I'm demanding a refund, @Waterbox Aquariums

 

[IceRain29]

Pictures, I slide the paper in front of the camera

 

[Panama Brown]

Just want to let everyone check how bad the gap is without the water, 3 corner are floating, I can slide paper 1 foot under the tank all across both side. Multiple bubbles has developed in the bottom seam due to stress without support. That's 7 days with water running inside the tank, no rock, no sand, just water. The large amount of time that I wasted on this aquarium is crazy. I'm looking into the Consumer Protection Act of Ontario and will give them a call. I'm demanding a refund, @Waterbox Aquariums

When you say water running in the tank do you mean you filled it with water? When you say multiple bubbles in the bottom seam are you talking between the glass and the leveling mat or somewhere else? I hate to say it, but mine did the same things. I was feeling very disheartened myself. The insulation foam fixed the situation completely. In fact my corners were raised much more than yours. You could get away with a thinner sheet of insulating foam..... I agree the customer aspect, from what youre saying, sucks and customers should never be ignored.... however, from personal experience I believe what youre experiencing is something you can safely and easily over come. Doesn't take away from your crappy experience with the company or fix the rest of the issues with your stand, but don't give up just yet. You got this!

 

[mjh712]

I agree with @blaxsun. The only thing I can think of is the stand isn't level. Based on the videos, it's slightly bowed in both directions more than the pad can accomodate for. This is most likely a result of a uneven/domed floor or, like blaxsun said, the feet in the middle of the stand being out too much. This also could expain the stress cracks by the feet. The uneven weight distribution is overloading that leg.

Adjusting the tiny feet is a pain in the butt, and I'm sure it's even more of a pain for the bigger tanks. I used a 4' level and a 12" level on the top of the stand to adjust all the feet a little at a time until the top piece of the stand was laser level.

Start on the corners/edges & work your way inward. (It may be best to turn all the interior feet all the way in at first) It's a pain, but once you get the edges figured out, you can just turn the ones in the middle until you get enough of a resistance against the floor. You'll probably have to move the stand, possibly lay in on it's front/back, adjust & readjust until it's roughly level in both directions all along the long plane.

If the top of stand is perfectly level, then it may be the glass pane at the bottom, but I highly doubt that. IMO, as someone who just put together a waterbox, the stand is not level as the feet do not contour to the floor.

As for the issue with the scratches & silicone/seems, that sucks. I'd be ticked.

 

[IceRain29]

When you say water running in the tank do you mean you filled it with water? When you say multiple bubbles in the bottom seam are you talking between the glass and the leveling mat or somewhere else? I hate to say it, but mine did the same things. I was feeling very disheartened myself. The insulation foam fixed the situation completely. I agree the customer aspect, from what youre saying, sucks and customers should never be ignored.... however, from personal experience I believe what youre experiencing is something you can safely and easily over come. Doesn't take away from your crappy experience with the company or fix the rest of the issues with your stand, but don't give up just yet. You got this!

Yes I mean filled it with water. My wife forced me to drain the water 2 days ago, she doesn't have confident with the tank floating like that. I think she made the correct decision. What if, I'm just saying, the tank explode, how much $$ is it going to cost me to repair my house? Everything in my house is custom made. I'm pretty sure waterbox is not going to pay me $100k to repair the damage.
I'm pretty sure you paid a beautiful bill for your tank, we as customer bought it as plug and play system, we are not suppose to "fix" the problem yourself. This is my point.

Also if you see bubble in the bottom seam, CONTACT WATERBOX! They should replace your tank seriously.
This is what happened to my 8 month old red sea reefer 750xxl back in 2018 when they have sagging issue with the V1 stand. The bubble is due to the stress of the tank not getting supported, it will fail, just a matter of time. Do a research on reef2reef about failing red sea 750xxl and you'll know what i'm talking about. Most owner do not notice it until it's too late, and after 1 year warranty, you are on your own. It took my red sea 750xxl 8 month to develop the bubble at the seam, it only takes 7 days for my waterbox to develop the bubble.

 

[IceRain29]

I agree with @blaxsun. The only thing I can think of is the stand isn't level. Based on the videos, it's slightly bowed in both directions more than the pad can accomodate for. This is most likely a result of a uneven/domed floor or, like blaxsun said, the feet in the middle of the stand being out too much. This also could expain the stress cracks by the feet. The uneven weight distribution is overloading that leg.

Adjusting the tiny feet is a pain in the butt, and I'm sure it's even more of a pain for the bigger tanks. I used a 4' level and a 12" level on the top of the stand to adjust all the feet a little at a time until the top piece of the stand was laser level.

Start on the corners/edges & work your way inward. (It may be best to turn all the interior feet all the way in at first) It's a pain, but once you get the edges figured out, you can just turn the ones in the middle until you get enough of a resistance against the floor. You'll probably have to move the stand, possibly lay in on it's front/back, adjust & readjust until it's roughly level in both directions all along the long plane.

If the top of stand is perfectly level, then it may be the glass pane at the bottom, but I highly doubt that. IMO, as someone who just put together a waterbox, the stand is not level as the feet do not contour to the floor.

As for the issue with the scratches & silicone/seems, that sucks. I'd be ticked.

The Stand and the tank is perfectly leveled, I spent 3 hrs leveling it.
I talk with Derek, the owner of Miracle Aquarium, his point is the stand itself is cheaply made, it's probably have some sagging or it shift a little bit when you put a heavy aquarium on it. Combined with some small imperfection of the tank itself, the gap exceed the 5mm foam pad. To solve this problem, I have to reinforce the stand with more plywood or 2x4 with screw to improve the integrity. But if I need to do all that why don't I just order a custom aquarium? I paid $4000+hst CAD to have a plug to play system.
And he also stated, no matter who make the aquarium, it needs to be supported at all 4 corner, otherwise IT WILL FAIL, it's just a matter of time.
I was doing some research for the waterbox problem, in on thread, waterbox admitted to the owner that they had a bad batch of aquarium stand, the plywood on mine is very very soft, they are starting to fall apart......

 

[mjh712]

T

The Stand and the tank is perfectly leveled, I spent 3 hrs leveling it.
I talk with Derek, the owner of Miracle Aquarium, his point is the stand itself is cheaply made, it's probably have some sagging or it shift a little bit when you put a heavy aquarium on it. Combined with some small imperfection of the tank itself, the gap exceed the 5mm foam pad. To solve this problem, I have to reinforce the stand with more plywood or 2x4 with screw to improve the integrity. But if I need to do all that why don't I just order a custom aquarium? I paid $4000+hst CAD to have a plug to play system.
And he also stated, no matter who make the aquarium, it needs to be supported at all 4 corner, otherwise IT WILL FAIL, it's just a matter of time.
I was doing some research for the waterbox problem, in on thread, waterbox admitted to the owner that they had a bad batch of aquarium stand, the plywood on mine is very very soft, they are starting to fall apart......

The Tank being level is one thing, the glass is probably perfectly level. Though if you put that level on the stand (you'll have to move the tank off of it) you may find out if there's any high spots. The corners of the tank are probably lower than the middle, especially since the stand is made from a more pliable material; and even more so if it's a softer wood than normal.

 

[IceRain29]

T

The Tank being level is one thing, the glass is probably perfectly level. Though if you put that level on the stand (you'll have to move the tank off of it) you may find out if there's any high spots. The corners of the tank are probably lower than the middle, especially since the stand is made from a more pliable material; and even more so if it's a softer wood than normal.

I leveled the stand then put the aquarium on. that's the only way to level a waterbox, you have to flip the stand, leveling everything, then put the stand back up, then keep doing it until it's leveled. Red sea has the removable bottom piece so you can level the tank with the bottom piece removed not the case with waterbox.
The problem is when there's nothing on the stand, it's perfectly leveled. But if you put the tank on the stand it will somehow sag/deform somewhere.

 

[IceRain29]

When you say water running in the tank do you mean you filled it with water? When you say multiple bubbles in the bottom seam are you talking between the glass and the leveling mat or somewhere else? I hate to say it, but mine did the same things. I was feeling very disheartened myself. The insulation foam fixed the situation completely. In fact my corners were raised much more than yours. You could get away with a thinner sheet of insulating foam..... I agree the customer aspect, from what youre saying, sucks and customers should never be ignored.... however, from personal experience I believe what youre experiencing is something you can safely and easily over come. Doesn't take away from your crappy experience with the company or fix the rest of the issues with your stand, but don't give up just yet. You got this!

You should really contacting waterbox. It seems like red sea 750xxl all over again
check this post:

Should I be concerned about these gaps in the silicone?

220g waterbox. The gaps are on the bottom pane.

www.reef2reef.com

 

[HeyJay]

Levelling wouldn't be the issue with the stands, it would be a problem with the top not being completely straight or flat and no amount of levelling could correct that.

But either way, you have Miracles right in your area. They built an aquarium for me years ago and it was top notch.

 

[IceRain29]

They finally response to my dealer after a full day:

I received this from Waterbox.


I checked with one of our engineers and was told the aquarium looks structurally sound. I see where is placed paper in the corners, but the leveling mat will compress over time.


Bull ***, Miracle stays in business for more than 30 years, what about waterbox? 3 years? and they don't even make tank themselves.

I will post my experience on social media on 2pm.