What ever happened to the Vertex Cerebra?

[DarkSky]

I'm remaining optimistic as well. I'm not in a rush to use it since I bought an Apex EL, but I will be setting it up on my frag tank to give it a good test before moving it to my DT.

Having said that, I am annoyed with the communication on the forums (or lack of it). The last hardware update we got from Shelby was over three weeks ago, and that was "we're epoxying screws and finalizing some testing!"

If they were more upfront that'd alleviate so many problems.

 

[Blue Lip]

I’m not optimistic! Vertex has been saying for years that they are almost ready but they are not. They have lied and said all we need is bla bla bla . Remember when all they were waiting for was housing? It’s one thing after another. They say they have overcome a hurdle and implying they are shipping soon. Then a year goes by... and another.

 

[Blue Lip]

“So we are getting close” from m May 19, 2017 lol.

 

[DarkSky]

Getting close two years ago is cause for optimism!

 

[hart24601]

I do wonder how many people got out of the hobby in that time and/or flat out wrote them off as a loss and vertex will end up just pocketing the money.

 

[ludnix]

What is even more perplexing than all this drama is that all components are already shelf items that just need to be configured to work together.

If that is true they should just get into selling the housing and we can use it for the reef-pi project.

 

[DarkSky]

Since I see you lurking @Bulk Reef Supply, are you guys waiting on replacement hardware as well?

 

[Confuse]

Vertex: Hey guys! Your orders finally shipped....Unfortunately, the cargo plane disappeared in the Bermuda Triangle. Sorry for the delay. We'll keep you posted on developments.

 

[Ryanbrs]

Hi,

I just thought I'd chime in here and share what limited information I know and can share. First, I have been hearing about the imminent launch of an aquarium controller from a half dozen companies for the last 5-6 years. To be frank, the conversation hasn't changed with most of them and remains in a perpetual phase of "we are close." Most have wised up since and just stopped talking about it publicly. Privately I just stopped listening to all of them because it is clear that this is way harder than any of them originally anticipated. I will listen when one is in my hands

Keep in mind this isn't a phone where it is not a big deal if it crashes or otherwise fails a few times a year and needs to be restarted. This is the brain of the life support for the animals you care for. It can't fail catastrophically, not even a single time. Reefers standard for this type of equipment is approaching impossibly or at least impractically high. Almost certainly higher than any other piece of electronics we have in our lives, many of which are more expensive and the market is millions to billions sold rather than thousands. That said, I personally share the never fail standard as well and respect those that are willing to step up to the challenge others fail at or avoid. That respect extended to existing company's who have achieved a reasonable standard in 99% of cases as well as newcomers willing to take the challenge on.

As to the Cerebra itself. We know about as much as the community knows on the topic. More or less, they are getting pretty close to releasing the next version. If I had to guess, I'd say close means months rather than weeks. They may beat that expectation quietly to some of the original beta testers first. It is my understanding they have full intention of taking care of the beta testers who stuck with them and I hope they deliver on that. Not much is really known beyond that. Only thing I can say for certain is any additional time that is taken is done in the spirit of getting it right.

I understand the frustration and limited patience here but I am sure everyone would like to see them take the time to accomplish a difficult task well rather than the alternative.

 

[Ryanbrs]

Yeah and even though BRS sold it as a beta so people really shouldn't be mad at them for any reason I bet you it still will keep them from ever carrying EKoral, Fishbit, Reefangel, etc. Till they've been out a few years until they've been out a few years and have an established track record. Which is going to lessen the chances that one of them will actually make it a few years and get an established track record.

For what it is worth, when it was presented to us we were the drivers of selling it as a Beta. It probably wasn't apparent to people who were not paying close attention but almost all of our competitors marketed and sold it as a full retail product and no mention of beta.

The only way I would approve us offering it was as a heavily discounted beta product. Not because I didn't believe in what Vertex was trying to achieve but simply because I know controllers are complex, used in a million unique configurations and anything this complex was bound to have some issues. The out of the box almost "never fail" standard is difficult to meet. That said I think we would have all liked to see a more rapid evolution from beta to alpha to retail ready.

As to the suggestion above, we would never offer a "beta" product again because I don't think the expectations of what you are getting could ever be clear enough to meet our standards. It has also made us more cautious of offering newcomers to the market as well. In this case, I don't mind being last to market. The Trailblazers, who want to discover new territories and risk getting shot in the back will probably have to buy from our competitors first.

So the big question is if we will sell the Cerebra when it comes out. I am not even going to spend much mind share on that question or any of the other companies who have been telling me for years they will have a controller. When one is in my hands the team will review it to the best of our ability and decide if it is ready to be offered to customers who trust us to look out for their interests. So if we do offer it, it will be because we believe it to be of good value and ready for retail ready use. Meaning as good or better than similar products in the market.

 

[hart24601]

For what it is worth, when it was presented to us we were the drivers of selling it as a Beta. It probably wasn't apparent to people who were not paying close attention but almost all of our competitors marketed and sold it as a full retail product and no mention of beta.

The only way I would approve us offering it was as a heavily discounted beta product. Not because I didn't believe in what Vertex was trying to achieve but simply because I know controllers are complex, used in a million unique configurations and anything this complex was bound to have some issues. The out of the box almost "never fail" standard is difficult to meet. That said I think we would have all liked to see a more rapid evolution from beta to alpha to retail ready.

As to the suggestion above, we would never offer a "beta" product again because I don't think the expectations of what you are getting could ever be clear enough to meet our standards. It has also made us more cautious of offering newcomers to the market as well. In this case, I don't mind being last to market. The Trailblazers, who want to discover new territories and risk getting shot in the back will probably have to buy from our competitors first.

So the big question is if we will sell the Cerebra when it comes out. I am not even going to spend much mind share on that question or any of the other companies who have been telling me for years they will have a controller. When one is in my hands the team will review it to the best of our ability and decide if it is ready to be offered to customers who trust us to look out for their interests. So if we do offer it, it will be because we believe it to be of good value and ready for retail ready use. Meaning as good or better than similar products in the market.

It's very cool of you to chime in and this hasn't exactly put you in a great position. I do hope that if it comes out you don't sell it personally. While an objective pro/con list is great, I don't think one can just dismiss this entire fiasco. One reason why BRS is so great is the goodwill you build and the research and videos you produce which don't exactly have a monetary value when looking at buying from you or Amazon, but many look past the raw numbers and buy from you (I do!) for the service, transparency, and investment you do back into the hobby. This controller has been nearly the exact opposite from the BRS key philosophy.

 

[Cyricdark]

For what it is worth, when it was presented to us we were the drivers of selling it as a Beta. It probably wasn't apparent to people who were not paying close attention but almost all of our competitors marketed and sold it as a full retail product and no mention of beta.

The only way I would approve us offering it was as a heavily discounted beta product. Not because I didn't believe in what Vertex was trying to achieve but simply because I know controllers are complex, used in a million unique configurations and anything this complex was bound to have some issues. The out of the box almost "never fail" standard is difficult to meet. That said I think we would have all liked to see a more rapid evolution from beta to alpha to retail ready.

As to the suggestion above, we would never offer a "beta" product again because I don't think the expectations of what you are getting could ever be clear enough to meet our standards. It has also made us more cautious of offering newcomers to the market as well. In this case, I don't mind being last to market. The Trailblazers, who want to discover new territories and risk getting shot in the back will probably have to buy from our competitors first.

So the big question is if we will sell the Cerebra when it comes out. I am not even going to spend much mind share on that question or any of the other companies who have been telling me for years they will have a controller. When one is in my hands the team will review it to the best of our ability and decide if it is ready to be offered to customers who trust us to look out for their interests. So if we do offer it, it will be because we believe it to be of good value and ready for retail ready use. Meaning as good or better than similar products in the market.

Thank you for giving us your point of view I kind of doubt it if you would have any new information but I thought since they provided some of your test tanks and stuff that you might be on a good speaking terms with the people in charge and might actually know more but it sounds like they're keeping everything pretty close to the vest. I really think the biggest problem is just the amount of misinformation that they provided about release dates if they would have been like Neptune on the Trident and just told people it's ready when it's ready we're doing our best there wouldn't be nearly as much blowback but the way they've handled things has just been irresponsible and destroyed a lot of good customers trust in their company. I started this thread because I legitimately wanted to know when this controller was coming out because I was in the market for controllers at the time since then I bought two apexes and I'm quite happy and very glad that I don't have a horse in the vertex cerebra race or I'd be just as mad as everybody else maybe more so. As I've stated before though I really don't know what market share this controller hopes to get at this point years ago when it was announced and when you guys reviewed it on the 52 weeks of reefing it was supposed to be the easier controller to use with an intuitive nice Easy Touch Screen interface. Since then Apex GPL and E Coral have up the ante on that sort of thing and there's no longer a hole in the market that needs to be filled. What vertex should have done is realize that they were in over their head and simplified everything down to a very basic controller along the lines of the reef keeper that they could offer for about $300 because that is a niche that absolutely needs filled right now I feel they missed a very good opportunity there. Presumably a very simple controller like that could have came out a lot faster hopefully without all the misinformation and they could have had a viable product right now and still have a good reputation. Personally after following This Thread I would never buy a Vertex product it just seems like it would be a dice roll as to whether or not you would have customer service or support on it later and there's other brands out there that do a very good job of standing behind their products so why take the risk.

 

[shred5]

In my opinion is there is nothing wrong with the time it is taking. Take however long it takes to get a good working system out. If they bring a buggy system out people will be even more mad.

The only thing is stop promising it is close if it is not.

I just do not get why they started completely over but they did. I think a system based on Raspberry PI sounds cool. Starting over should have made anyone realise this is going to be several years at least. I would not release anything with lots of testing first also.

I agree with Cyricdark the basic controller market is wide open with DA demise and Apex lite and JR gone from the market. . Just leave it open like the RK lite was to upgrading with modules if need be. I could use a few of these for my breeder/prop systems.

Also a NDA is different from one company to another or what phase of beta testing. Some require no discussing with others at all period. I have signed several for Reef equipment and computer stuff I have tested.

 

[shred5]

Let it go! let it goooooo!



Hahhaha!

Are you still wanting a unit? If so, I get being upset and wanting to vent, but what I don’t get is people that are eager to get a unit but then their actions of constantly complaining and bashing Vertex ultimately will drive others away from purchasing one and without a large user base then this thing will die on the vine no matter how good the finished project is. How do we have ongoing support and development and integration with new equipment (like the Xepta aBex, that I heard they were working with to be able to work with the Cerebra) without lots of owners of the unit?

If it’s just sour grapes then that’s just kind of pathetic after a point don’t you think? No offense meant, but think about it. If you hate it that bad I’ve offered to buy units still for what people paid.

And then there are people like First Contact that lead the charge to undermine his own supposed goal of a successful controller. Using screen grabs of my posts and others from the private Beta Forum and then not putting it in context or including my replies that would put it in a more balanced light.

And to cap it off, when I offer to buy his unit he tells me he wants $800 for it?
I just don’t get the goal. I’ve doubled down and bought units to help support what I hope is ultimately a success and if I’m lucky get my money back out of my investment and maybe even profit a bit and usher new users into the community (for prices below retail) thereby infusing the community with more users that theoretically will increase the likelihood of a long term top notch controller company and all that entails.

My dad told me when I was very young, “you can be part of the solution or part of the problem”. What good is the complaining and bashing for you or anyone?


And believe me, I’m as frustrated as anyone (times 25, as that’s how many beta units I own) but I know it’s coming and I’d rather have it be late and right than rushed to appease all of us (me included at times) that are griping about it.

 

[shred5]

Let it go! let it goooooo!



(like the Xepta aBex, that I heard they were working with to be able to work with the Cerebra)

I find that very interesting and I am now curious and interested.

 

[ReeferBean]

I'm not trying to sell you so I guess that's good. You seem happy with them. You asked for some posts so I gave three. You can find many more on your own with that nifty search box if you're trying to sell yourself on it. I am simply saying I wouldn't use Neptunes product based on reviews I've seen. I seen lots more negatives than these and haven't seen one for GHL. That's why i read reviews, to filter out the messes.

My guess is because far less people use the GHL.

 

[chefjpaul]

My guess is because far less people use the GHL.

Or it's a very well built system.

 

[Cyricdark]

Or it's a very well built system.

You're both right DHL is a very well-built system but here in the states there are way way way more Apex users. Overseas of course it's a different story. Also most of the negative reviews that you see about the Apex are with regards to the new 2016 Apex when it very first come out nearly all those negative reviews stop after the first couple months just like any new product they had some bugs to work out. And you when you consider the human nature to post negative reviews but not positive reviews that's also indicative of things. My own example I'm intending to go post a negative review of the Seneye Reef because of a bad experience I had with them and their technical support but I've had nothing but good experiences with the Apex and it never occurred to me until just now that I should probably go give the Apex a positive review. Lol

 

[DarkSky]

Or it's a very well built system.

I'd bet Apex controllers outnumber GHL in the U.S. 100 to 1. Looking at the subforums for each and you'll see the activity which is usually a good indicator.

 

[chefjpaul]

I'd bet Apex controllers outnumber GHL in the U.S. 100 to 1. Looking at the subforums for each and you'll see the activity which is usually a good indicator.

Never doubt that at all. Never said anything negative regarding apex either, nor vertex.... yes owned all 3.

This is a vertex thread getting derailed over controller pride.