What ever happened to the Vertex Cerebra?

Tobe71

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Fake reviews on anything online both good and bad are epidemic anymore. Just look at Amazon and all the little Chinese products that have 5 Star reviews and there will be 50 or 60 five star broken English reviews that obviously don't even know what they were reviewing and then one actual English review that wasn't made with Google Translate giving it a one-star and a bunch of complaints. On the flip side of that people are much more likely to complain about something then they are to praise it that's just the way humans work and oftentimes someone is mad enough that they'll go out and make multiple accounts so they can give something multiple bad reviews to bring the star rating down cuz they want to see that their complaints had an impact. It's dishonest and I've never done it personally but there's been times when I've been mad enough it has crossed my mind lol. As many people as vertex as ****** off with this whole ordeal I think it's much more likely that the multiple bad reviews from the same IP address was probably from someone they screwed over with their version one controller. that is just way more believable to me. I wouldn't see any reason in the world why Neptune would think they need to do anything like that when the community's going to do it for them.



I firmly believe that I am the best at what I do in my area you'd have to drive 300 miles in any direction to find anyone as good as me. over the years there has been multiple times when someone told me about somebody else trying to start a business doing what I do and most the time it's someone that I had a little bit of knowledge of and I knew that they were neither qualified nor experienced enough to be successful and a couple years later proved me right as they went out of business. there's a very good chance I came off as a little bit arrogant and dismissive about the other person's capabilities, but ultimately I knew what they were getting into way better than they did and I was proved right over time. I would say that Terrance and the other Neptune reps that you talked to Knew very well that a skimmer company had no business trying to make controllers in the time frame that they were saying they were going to do it in. they knew the development process vertex had ahead of them and that it was doomed to failure in that short of a time frame. Look at all the development and iterations of the different Apex controllers through the years and even then when they rolled out the 2016 Apex it had a lot of bugs. so for some company who specializes in making things out of acrylic to just suddenly pull out of their hat the idea that they're going to make controllers and do it in a shorter timeframe than Neptune has ever spent developing one is pretty arrogant and dismissive of Apex own experience and capabilities. It would be like someone walking up to me and saying hey I know what you've been doing what you do for 20 years but I know this guy who has absolutely no experience in your field but he's going to learn how to do what you do in a year or two and he's going to be just as good as you or better when he's done. I would straight up laugh in your face and I would be right to do so. So for those reps to be a little arrogant and eye rolly is quite a bit more congenial than I would have been lol

Good points. Thanks Cy
 
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Cyricdark

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So @Tobe71 we talked a lot about when or if the cerebra is going to come out but we never really talked about what kind of capabilities it's going to have when or if it does ( sorry for the if's I know you're positive it will come out but I'm from Missouri so they have got to show me lol) things that would Peak my interest would be a whole lot of 0 to 10 volt outputs like 10 or more and even better would be some pwm outputs like 6 or more at least. What kind of things is it going to do that Apex or ghl can't out of the box?
 
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Cyricdark

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From the Harvard Business Review. My emphasis added in bold. The original article was published after United Airlines dragged a doctor out of his seat, so admittedly massive differences between Vertex (Tiny aquarium company catering to hobbyists, which can't seem to deliver on promises) vs United (One of four multibillion-dollar airline companies in the US responsible for moving actual human beings from place to place). I post because I think it takes an expert's opinion to explain why this is such an emotional topic for the reef community, and why some of us who feel burned by the company are experiencing some schadenfreude with their current struggles.


Original
https://hbr.org/2017/04/how-service-companies-can-earn-customer-trust-and-keep-it

"Three conditions under which any service company can cause customers to lose confidence in it..."

"Condition 1: The failure is egregious. Most service failures are not as shocking as dragging a 69-year-old doctor down the aisle of an airplane. But with smartphone video just a couple of clicks away for a witness, any service failure that looks bad on camera may be transmitted worldwide in a matter of minutes. As Northwestern University’s Philip Kotler reminds us, “If companies behave badly, the internet will call them out. Loss of trust in these circumstances is swift and unforgiving."

"Condition 2: The incident fits a pattern of failure. If a company has failed its customers once, doing it twice effectively creates a narrative of poor service. And once there’s a narrative, customer confidence in the firm is probably in free fall, and motivation to criticize it online is greater."

"Condition 3: The attempted recovery is weak, yielding a double failure. When a service company fails to deliver the promised service, it must get the apology right — and certainly should not blame the customer for its failings (as when United initially called its wronged customer “belligerent”). When customers see that a company won’t own up to its mistakes, they are likely to assume that the firm cares little about serving them well and does not deserve their loyalty."

"Here are some lessons that any service company should heed if it wants customers to see it as reliable and fair."

"Honor customers’ “perceived contract,” not the company’s legal contract. To the customer, a purchased service is a promise of performance. For example, airline passengers should not be expected to read an entire “contract of carriage” (United’s is 46 pages long) to understand precisely under what conditions the company can take away their ticketed seat. Similarly, any company that makes customers sign legally binding “terms and conditions” should hesitate before enforcing provisions that belie common sense, even though they may meet the letter of the minutiae of the signed agreement. Contracts designed to protect a company when it delivers bad service destroy the trust on which customer relationships are built."
<As an aside, I've signed NDAs for large corporations (two pharmaceuticals, two genetics, one bioengineering, one major university) that are shorter and less restrictive than the NDAs from aquarium company Beta tests. It's truly laughable when you compare the two.>


"Generosity is a trust builder; stinginess is a trust breaker. As restaurateur Danny Meyer wrote in his book Setting the Table, “Generosity of spirit and a gracious approach to problem solving are, with few exceptions, the most effective way I know to earn lasting goodwill for your business.” <As another aside, this is where my disappointment in Vertex's product transformed me from an unsatisfied customer to someone who writes longwinded forum posts begging people not to use this company. My motivation is because they stiffed me $50 on a replacement pump for the $500 reactor I purchased. Aka, stingy.>

"Use realistic slogans. Good marketing is not just about making promises; it’s also about keeping them. Slogans that raise customers’ expectations too high set up the company for failure. For example, the complexity of today’s airline operations, the emotional stressors in airline service for passengers and employees, and limited competition (four airlines control about 70% of the U.S. market), which discourages investments in improving service, make a slogan like “Fly the Friendly Skies” feel disingenuous. That’s why, after its recent failure, United was ridiculed with so many insulting mock slogans."
<I'll close with this screenshot of Vertex's masthead. The juxtaposition of "Realizing" the modern aquarium vs their multiyear inability to produce a reliable aquarium controller is something I find ironic.>
Screen Shot 2019-06-07 at 10.07.23 AM.png
I just really like this post it's probably one of the more well-thought-out posts I've ever read.
 

rushbattle

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I just really like this post it's probably one of the more well-thought-out posts I've ever read.
There are likes, and then there are likes. I feel like there should be a “super insightful” tag in addition to likes. Of which the above post would be, in addition to only a handful of others.
 

Tobe71

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So @Tobe71 we talked a lot about when or if the cerebra is going to come out but we never really talked about what kind of capabilities it's going to have when or if it does ( sorry for the if's I know you're positive it will come out but I'm from Missouri so they have got to show me lol) things that would Peak my interest would be a whole lot of 0 to 10 volt outputs like 10 or more and even better would be some pwm outputs like 6 or more at least. What kind of things is it going to do that Apex or ghl can't out of the box?
I’m driving all day today. I’ll try to get some specs for you ASAP.
 

Braves Fan

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I haven't really read this post ,, just from time to time I check it out ,,, my question is ,, at 31 pages that's a lot lol whats up with this piece of equipment ,, I think its a skimmer ,, is this something that people need to cut their losses and get something else,, or is it finally in reefers hands & working good ,,, whats up :)
 
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Cyricdark

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I haven't really read this post ,, just from time to time I check it out ,,, my question is ,, at 31 pages that's a lot lol whats up with this piece of equipment ,, I think its a skimmer ,, is this something that people need to cut their losses and get something else,, or is it finally in reefers hands & working good ,,, whats up :)
It's aquarium controller that came out about 4 years ago was supposed to have been a working unit turned out have so many bugs that it was not a working unit they told everybody within a year that they would have a new aquarium controller that they were going to rebuild it from the ground up then there's been multiple delays and missed release dates and nobody yet has a working unit still.
 

Smarkow

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I just really like this post it's probably one of the more well-thought-out posts I've ever read.

There are likes, and then there are likes. I feel like there should be a “super insightful” tag in addition to likes. Of which the above post would be, in addition to only a handful of others.

Thanks :)
Glad I don’t just sound like a crazy person ranting, haha.
This hobby..........
 

Tobe71

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I haven't really read this post ,, just from time to time I check it out ,,, my question is ,, at 31 pages that's a lot lol whats up with this piece of equipment ,, I think its a skimmer ,, is this something that people need to cut their losses and get something else,, or is it finally in reefers hands & working good ,,, whats up :)

They grossly underestimated the time it would take to create a brand new controller from the ground up when they decided the first one that was being built by a third party was a failure.
They had a ton of PR blunders along the way...
The good news is they have finally completed it and are in the final stages of QC before starting to replace all the beta testers units. They’ve also addressed the shortcomings in the customer relations/PR end with a fantastic marketing team.
Hopefully I and the other 500 or so beta users will be seeing our units starting in the next few weeks.
As for units for retail I’m guessing later this Summer.
Long road but finally nearing the light at the end of a LONG tunnel...
 

TheHarold

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Got a speedy reply on the forum. Just messaged him and he said more specifics soon...

1837952F-2276-4D7A-AB9A-C1757F6950C7.jpeg

Hopefully the specifics include supporting Ecotech products, details about a dosing solution, and a *cough* FOURTH *cough* tentative release date.
 

Tobe71

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Hopefully the specifics include supporting Ecotech products, details about a dosing solution, and a *cough* FOURTH *cough* tentative release date.
Ha!
No doubt. I’m often referred to as an eternal optimist, but even my sunny disposition is about maxed...
I’d love for some Kessil support as well. The Xepta Abex and Alkatronic have been hinted at as integrating with Cerebra.. THAT would be AWESOME and eliminate my mild attraction to the Trident.
 
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Cyricdark

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Ha!
No doubt. I’m often referred to as an eternal optimist, but even my sunny disposition is about maxed...
I’d love for some Kessil support as well. The Xepta Abex and Alkatronic have been hinted at as integrating with Cerebra.. THAT would be AWESOME and eliminate my mild attraction to the Trident.
I would think it would have to integrate with alkatronic it integrates with anything that has a BNC pH probe port
 

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