Why are all systems running out of bacteria?

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sixty_reefer

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Truly honest question, supposing that we are not adding bleach to our systems. What’s happening to the bacteria this days? Is it dying and if it’s dying how can we introduce new bacteria, if we can’t even sustain the ones we were supposed to have, it seems to be the new trend, add as many as you can. Is microbe diversity really achieved this way?
I always had in mind that diversity was achieved with a stable system and if it’s stable are we really loosing out on something?
 
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@sixty_reefer I have never checked for loss of bacterial diversity in my aquarium. I am unsure of what symptoms might show from this if it were happening.

Can you dig a little deeper on what you are trying to get at?
I’ve been away from the forum for a wile and since I come back more actively, most threads I’ve been reading It seems that someone is adding bottled bacteria to try and get some sort of outcome, that makes me wonder why all the sudden there’s a urge to add so many bacteria to already established systems.
 

Absolutely Fish

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Bacteria can be a funny thing. There are so many stains that compete for similar resources. One thought I have on this is the use of “man made live rock”. Everyone has shifted to dry rock or cultured rock. I think that has a serious effect on bacteria balance. Not saying it’s not good to be sustainable but real live rock carries a lot of micro fauna that can be very benificial.
 
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Truly honest question, supposing that we are not adding bleach to our systems. What’s happening to the bacteria this days? Is it dying and if it’s dying how can we introduce new bacteria, if we can’t even sustain the ones we were supposed to have, it seems to be the new trend, add as many as you can. Is microbe diversity really achieved this way?
I always had in mind that diversity was achieved with a stable system and if it’s stable are we really loosing out on something?
Why do we feel there are bacteria issues in our aquarium? Could it be that the bacteria-in-the-bottle vendors have scared us into thinking we need to buy their product? And why are we using the word diversity so much in this hobby to explain our issues?

I have to wonder if bacteria in a bottle (not the cycling bacteria product) is snake oil.
 

mindme

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Truly honest question, supposing that we are not adding bleach to our systems. What’s happening to the bacteria this days? Is it dying and if it’s dying how can we introduce new bacteria, if we can’t even sustain the ones we were supposed to have, it seems to be the new trend, add as many as you can. Is microbe diversity really achieved this way?
I always had in mind that diversity was achieved with a stable system and if it’s stable are we really loosing out on something?

I think of it kind of like the bacteria in your digestive system. You can have a certain type(bad) that will out compete the good kinds, and so constantly introducing the good kinds will help combat that. And the food you eat feeds the different ones, and apparently they somehow tell your brain to eat more of those foods.

Yet, I doubt anyone really knows if it's doing anything at all. Maybe they have good bacteria already, maybe the amount they take does very little. If you take antibiotics, you'll probably want to take some for sure because antibiotics can really mess up the bacteria in your digestive system.

So is it doing anything? Hell if I know. But I figure there is the possibility it can help, and I don't believe it's hurting. So why not. I use biodigest which is about $40 for 60 weeks. And it comes in little glass vials that you break the ends off to use, so you don't have to worry about them going bad, they never get exposed to anything.

But yeah, I admit I have no true idea if it does anything. I'm not sure why diversity would be more important than the ones you want, other than diversity would seem to increase your odds you do get the good ones.
 

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Because fake rock,fake bacteria in a bottle hurry up,try this ,hurry up try that, a true real tank takes its time don't add fake bacteria to tank to hurry up. They add a shrimp and that's all ,all that fake stuff dies, and they rely on poop but fake bacteria don't know poop,the fake bacteria get it off market and send everyone a shrimp and make reefing healthy again and no more hurrying up and that's the bottom line because stone cold said so..lol
 
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Bacteria can be a funny thing. There are so many stains that compete for similar resources. One thought I have on this is the use of “man made live rock”. Everyone has shifted to dry rock or cultured rock. I think that has a serious effect on bacteria balance. Not saying it’s not good to be sustainable but real live rock carries a lot of micro fauna that can be very benificial.
I agree with micro fauna and I am a big advocate that the more the better, I’m just not to sure if we really need all this different bacteria that we are supposed to already have anyway, unless if we are at the start of a system that’s the only place I would see it being a advantage.
 
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Why do we feel there are bacteria issues in our aquarium? Could it be that the bacteria-in-the-bottle vendors have scared us into thinking we need to buy their product? And why are we using the word diversity so much in this hobby to explain our issues?

I have to wonder if bacteria in a bottle (not the cycling bacteria product) is snake oil.
Diversity it’s definitely a new thing this days regarding bacteria, I would think they’re product is sound, is it really beneficial for a established system? There I wonder.
 

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Because fake rock,fake bacteria in a bottle hurry up,try this ,hurry up try that, a true real tank takes its time don't add fake bacteria to tank to hurry up. They add a shrimp and that's all ,all that fake stuff dies, and they rely on poop but fake bacteria don't know poop,the fake bacteria get it off market and send everyone a shrimp and make reefing healthy again and no more hurrying up and that's the bottom line because stone cold said so..lol

Fake bacteria?

giphy.gif
 

Absolutely Fish

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I agree with micro fauna and I am a big advocate that the more the better, I’m just not to sure if we really need all this different bacteria that we are supposed to already have anyway, unless if we are at the start of a system that’s the only place I would see it being a advantage.
Depending on the application, some may use heterotopic oxidizing bacteria to help break down organic matter which leads to high phosphates. I’ve found for most bacterias to be effective they have to be used on a regular basis.
 

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Why do we feel there are bacteria issues in our aquarium? Could it be that the bacteria-in-the-bottle vendors have scared us into thinking we need to buy their product? And why are we using the word diversity so much in this hobby to explain our issues?

I have to wonder if bacteria in a bottle (not the cycling bacteria product) is snake oil.
Exactly. It’s so silly to me how people are trying to collect bacteria like it’s Pokémon cards.

As far as I’m concerned, I believe “not enough bacteria” is just a catch all to explain why corals are dying. But logically, it doesn’t make sense to me. Corals share symbiosis with zooxanthellae. As long as the parameters are in proper range, there’s some organic matter to feed the corals, light, and flow: I fail to see how not having enough bacteria could cause an issue.

Unless your corals are starving to death so you feed bacteria.

Here’s a thought provoking question: ever seen those reef shows where they quickly set up exhibit tanks and fully stock it with corals? Do you think those people needed to worry about EDNA sequencing and collecting mud from places? Probably not. It’s bogus IMO.

I stopped worrying about bacteria. With dry rocks, they often leach nutrients and there’s a lot of competition for open territory. If algae grows and smothers corals, that’s not good.
 
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sixty_reefer

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Depending on the application, some may use heterotopic oxidizing bacteria to help break down organic matter which leads to high phosphates. I’ve found for most bacterias to be effective they have to be used on a regular basis.
I could only see that situation happening in a tank that was limited in the availability of nutrients more in particular C or N or both, as the C an N dictated the residual of P, making it more of a nutrient issue imo
 
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sixty_reefer

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Because fake rock,fake bacteria in a bottle hurry up,try this ,hurry up try that, a true real tank takes its time don't add fake bacteria to tank to hurry up. They add a shrimp and that's all ,all that fake stuff dies, and they rely on poop but fake bacteria don't know poop,the fake bacteria get it off market and send everyone a shrimp and make reefing healthy again and no more hurrying up and that's the bottom line because stone cold said so..lol
Have you hover wonder if that’s the difference, I don’t think we would of been able to find many tanks on R2R that were seeded using a shrimp like in the old days
 
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sixty_reefer

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Here’s a thought provoking question: ever seen those reef shows where they quickly set up exhibit tanks and fully stock it with corals? Do you think those people needed to worry about EDNA sequencing and collecting mud from places? Probably not. It’s bogus IMO.

I stopped worrying about bacteria. With dry rocks, they often leach nutrients and there’s a lot of competition for open territory. If algae grows and smothers corals, that’s not good.
Would you put algae problems related to bacteria den?
 

Shirak

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I’ve been away from the forum for a wile and since I come back more actively, most threads I’ve been reading It seems that someone is adding bottled bacteria to try and get some sort of outcome, that makes me wonder why all the sudden there’s a urge to add so many bacteria to already established systems.
Marketing...
 

Jedi1199

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Interesting topic. I was unaware that people are suffering from "bacterial loss".

Since I have never used any bottled bacteria at all, I really can't say if they work or not, or if they eventually die off.

I am pretty much "old school" when it comes to my tanks. Maybe I am just old lol. I start new tanks with established rocks and add fish on day 2. No bottled anything. It has worked for me in every single tank I have ever started so I figure "If it ain't broke, don't fix it."

My personal opinion is that most bottled bacteria is a waste of money. You are paying for what is essentially 98% water and some bacterial strains that will grow naturally in any tank.
 
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