Why was an Alkalinity of 8 too high?
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jfoahs04
Well-Known Member
"9-11 is deal for faster growth" is a lot different than saying "you can't maintain a reef at 7 long term." FWIW, I use local sea water that I collect myself and maintain the default alk of 7dkh in my tank. The growth is just as good (if not better) thank my previous reef which was all RODI and salt mix and maintained at about 9dkh.
OP
OP
ocncheffy
Active Member
No Carbon, but I run Aquaforest GFO in a reactor to maintain a .1ppm phosphate level. Generally the fluctuation of the week goes to .15ppm, then Sunday I replenish the GFO once more.
Drummingbaker2010
Active Member
that's probably true, it all depends on what you personally are trying to achieve/maintain. That's all I'm getting at. It was just a thought from what I've been looking at.
Theorizing here... I always thought lower Alk prevented "burnt tips" by slowing the calcification process to slow skeletal growth to match the slower growth of flesh when nutrient levels were low. With the OP's elevated phosphate, the skeletal growth could already be depressed. Could the burnt tips be more related to slowed tissue growth due to low PAR or lack of organic compounds?
I don’t disagree with anything but the jest or thinking is the margin for error,,, BRS did video on their alkalinity recommendation of above 8 … I won’t blabber anymore of my ignorance here lol
I should add I guess you could drive it at 7 long term but I thought BRS outlined the risk pretty well
my fault and poor choice of words , I didn’t consider the option of using NSW only the risk of maintaining the slim margins using 2pt et …
OP
OP
ocncheffy
Active Member
I also had a theory that even though phosphates are at .1, maybe the useable phosphate is near zero which is causing the issue. PAR was around 280 on top of rocks before I started to drop the lighting thinking it may have been the problem.
This may also explain why .4ppm phosphate was growing SPS so well... I'm not that familiar with Orthophosphate vs phosphate, but this may be something to think about.
and BTW I’m not debating parameters per se, certainly not against NSW … but our samples and experience varies and the whole matter is likely unarguable like salt brands and sand or bare bottom et
The organic compounds I was thinking of are proteins and other carbon rich compounds... The corals "food" per se. I'm not a biologist, so I'm not going to claim I know how the process works... and I could easily be dead wrong... but I think these can be dissolved or particulate and corals use them and they promote tissue growth. Do you have a lot of fish that are well fed in your tank? A well fed tank supplies these compounds, as well as some ammonia, that are used by the corals.
OP
OP
ocncheffy
Active Member
In my Reefer 350 I have the following:
2x Clowns
1x Yellow Tang
1x Kole Eye Tang
1x Melanurus Wrasse
1x FlameHawk
1x Starry Blenny
1x Mandarin
They get fed 2x a day on an auto-feeder and I feed 1 frozen cube a day as well. Tank gets dosed twice a week with 15ml of Reef Energy and 1ml every second day of Fauna Marin Min S. Definitely seems like plenty of food.
Agreed. Seems like that should be adequate input unless you have a lot of corals competing for resulting organics or are removing it before they can use it. Are you skimming aggressively, using a lot of GAC, etc.?
You can run alk of 7… in fact here is a thriving SPS tank running alk of 4.8-5.4. Yup
@Doctorgori dont believe everything BRS tells ya. Always a grain of salt.
@Doctorgori dont believe everything BRS tells ya. Always a grain of salt.
you mean the BRS “infomercial” might be biased …no way
…. I’d don’t doubt that low DKH tank but have you seen anything explaining how it’s getting by…I mean heck sign me up,,!!!!!!OP …I used a poor choice of words, in fact I am on the side of the “naturalist” trying best to mimic natural conditions as best as possible…
Thing is the sun is 5000k but I’d wager none of the 7DKH proponents have “daylight” bulbs over their tanks. Physics aside, my eyes told me something else even assuming those early MH bulbs had plenty of spectral blue energy anyway
I believe high DKH probably has unknown issues, but who has actually surveyed the sample of issues across the different alkalinity ranges and where are the problems clustered and what are the risk?
I am slipping back to the ole philosophy in "Let your tank tell you what it needs" It is foolish that any advise applies to all tanks. Just read the thousands of of threads on any reef topic. Yes we all want to learn and understand what is going on in our tanks which is smart but one thing I have learned is the is absolutely no "one path One fix etc. Bacteria balances are always different which I believe causes the tank differences. So if you found something that has worked try to keep that! Pure in simple!
Very smart. Stay a path until something in your tank says it is off. Then tinker on ONE thing at a time. Nothing is more disheartening when you tinker on several things and it goes better or worse and now in a position have no idea what caused the reaction. Again, if from beginning all good “not broke don’t fix”. This hobby has too many tinkers and number chasers.
This is complicated but important. Alk of 8 is not too high unless you are driving nitrogen and phosphorous below natural levels with media or chemicals which would growth limit organic tissue... or you are fishless and have no available building blocks.
Have to understand that having nitrate and one kind of phosphate on a test kit is not an indication of if a coral is deprived of nitrogen or phosphorous. You can have corals be deficient in both nitrogen and phosphorous if you do not have them in available forms for corals to use. Nitrate test is fools gold. The one kind of phosphate that you test for with a kit can be fools gold.
Your corals need available nitrogen usually through ammonia/ammonium and nobody really knows which kind, of the many, of phosphates that all corals use, so the several different kinds from fish waste are also a good idea. Too few corals (hosts) can convert nitrate back into nitrogen and the few that can spend an enormous amount of energy to do so.
...so you can have nitrogen and phosphorous deficient corals even with nitrate and one kind of phosphate showing up on a test kit.
Have to understand that having nitrate and one kind of phosphate on a test kit is not an indication of if a coral is deprived of nitrogen or phosphorous. You can have corals be deficient in both nitrogen and phosphorous if you do not have them in available forms for corals to use. Nitrate test is fools gold. The one kind of phosphate that you test for with a kit can be fools gold.
Your corals need available nitrogen usually through ammonia/ammonium and nobody really knows which kind, of the many, of phosphates that all corals use, so the several different kinds from fish waste are also a good idea. Too few corals (hosts) can convert nitrate back into nitrogen and the few that can spend an enormous amount of energy to do so.
...so you can have nitrogen and phosphorous deficient corals even with nitrate and one kind of phosphate showing up on a test kit.
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