ZZuin 130.4 Waterbox FOWLR

Kyle Bruin

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Well, I'm back in the hobby with a top of the line Waterbox 130.4 Platinum Reef aquarium. I've only really had AIO tanks (I've also run a 125g cichlid tank with Fluval canister filters) so this is a real treat. I'm excited to have a true sump and full size skimmer and since I travel a decent amount, I'm looking forward to automating more and having a bit more forgiving of a system than a nano aquarium. That said I'm also planning to keep this tank as fish only with live rock. There's a ton of reasons for why I personally want to go with FOWLR, but mainly decreased testing (or emphasis on so many correct water parameters), time to maturity, cost, problems and loss, feeding. I'm sure there are people on both sides of all these things, but for me if I can decrease just a little of the demands having a tank while still having an engaging centerpiece to my living room that will be a major win.

So about getting a Waterbox... I almost purchased a Red Sea tank, but just kept holding off for the right time to buy. I must have looked at RS tanks a 1000 times, but man am I glad I waited and found Waterbox. They have such an amazing product. From the tank size, sump layout, features, glass clarity and shape/edges, its a winner all around. I couldn't be happier with the tank.

I'll be documenting the build here as I go. I've actually had it now for a while so I'll try and catch up from unboxing to cycling (where it's at as of this posting). I'll update the equipment and stocking below as they change.

Current Full Tank Shot:
IMG_2103.jpeg


Current Equipment List:
Tank:
Waterbox 130.4 Platinum Reef
Return Pump: Current-USA eFlux 1900 gph
Wave Pumps: 2x Current-USA eFlux 1050 gph
Lighting: 2x 48" Current-USA Orbing Marine IC LED
Skimmer: NYOS Quantum 160
Heater: 2x Cobalt Aquatics Neo-Therm 200w
ATO: Tunze Osmolator 3155
Controls: Tripp Lite Power Bar, Current-USA Loop Bundle w/ Bluetooth
Testing: Milwaukee MA887 Digital Refractometer, Milwaukee MW102 PH and Temperature Meter, API Saltwater Master Test Kit

Stocking (Planned):
2x Ocellaris Clownfish (Amphiprion ocellaris) - Transfer from current tank
1x Flame Angelfish (Centropyge loricula) or Potter's Angelfish (Centropyge potteri)
3x Bartlett's Anthias (Pseudanthias bartlettorum) or Ignitus Anthias (Pseudanthias ignitus)
1x Copperband Butterflyfish (Chelmon rostratus) or Yellow Longnose Butterflyfish (Forcipiger flavvissimus)
1x Foxface Lo (Siganus vulpinus)
1x Yellow Tang (Zebrasoma flavescens)
1x Blue Tang (Paracanthurus hepatus)
1x Spotted Puffer (Canthigaster jactator)
1x Wrasse (unknown)

Disclaimer: I know that is probably a heavy stocking list. I'll be going slow and monitoring how the tank is handling each addition. The skimmer I have is oversized (up to 250g) and there is a decent amount of rock work for any of the more timid ones. My LFS also has most of the above in relatively small sizes. I know they won't all stay that way... blah blah blah... for example a 1-2" Blue Tang may eventually get to 12"... but not for years. I can't see years into the future in most aspects of my life. Overcrowding years in the future will be an issue for another day. As long as the tank and fish are healthy and I'm not right on the line, that'll be my metric.

Unboxing:
I ended up getting the tank at my LFS. It was in-stock and they offered a pretty good fish credit along with a slight discount. It came in a crate (tank and sump) and two boxes (stand). Waterbox takes great care in their packaging. Everything was well thought out and of considerable quality. The crate went into the bed of my truck, while I fit the boxes in the back seat of the cab.

Crate with the top wood piece removed. Really solid crate construction.
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Inside Packaging
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Packaging details, corners covered, gaps filled with solid foam pieces
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Stand Assembly:
Once it was home it was time to assembly the stand. They seem to give you the same pieces regardless of stand size so I had a lot of extra feet for the stand. The stand came together pretty easily. Some of the hardware was a little cheap and soft, easy to strip or you had to be careful of over-tightening. I managed to assemble it all solo. Took a few hours to get done start to finish. I'll mention now that it might be worth planning where you are going to hang certain items in the stand. I ended up wanting to mount a control panel for all of the Current USA equipment I had and measuring and drilling the pegs was a real chore once it was all assembled.

The tank comes with push rods to pop the door out to open it. Once I installed I noticed the doors kinda bounced on them and were loud. There is another piece in that same bag, a round washer and screw. Turns out the screw was magnetically attracted to the end of the push rods. I put two and two together and tried to install them on the inside of the door. There is an included anchor, but I skipped it. I really wish Waterbox and pre-drilled this. It was hard to figure out exact placement and to counter sink it properly. It came out okay on one door, but the other was off a little. Still helps keep the doors from bouncing, but would have been nice for them to actually prep that at the factory...

That leads me to another point, directions are a little lacking. They have some pretty good youtube video walkthroughs and some online documents, but they are pretty generic and some things/pictures don't seem to 100% match up to what you have in front of you. I know this is an import product and that supply chain and working abroad can be difficult, but I hope Waterbox makes this a priority and spends some money on glossy well documented instructions. You paid a lot for the tank, they should have high quality documentation for everything. Parts list with quantity, labels, stickers, etc. This is all pretty standard stuff. Instructions for the stand, plumbing, water levels, measurements, best practices, is all sorta scattered around the internet and social media channels right now. If you wanted to know what size the plumbing is you need to go to the website and look up the unit. That should be listed somewhere on the product itself or documentation that comes with it in my opinion.

Anyways, all that is pretty minor stuff and I managed around the small short comings without too much trouble. Somehow thou, I forgot to take any pictures of the stand fully assembled, but there are plenty of those around. Once I got it in place it was time to position it and get the tank on it. I leveled the stand first by methodically unscrewing the legs until they touched the floor and then a little extra turn to ensure they were pressing onto the floor. It took some time and even had to flip the stand on its side to really get them all. Honestly this seemed like a less than ideal way to level the tank and disperse the weight. It is really hard to get to some of the feet and there are just so many of them its even more difficult to ensure they are all even. Just do your best. I do like that it is off the ground an inch or two. Really helps for when the inevitable spill happens. Good to know your stand won't be sucking it all up.

It took 3 strong guys to get the tank into place, but really it was just two with a third hand to steady, guide around doors, open doors, etc. I was able to slide it around with my hand to ensure it was flush with the stand.

Plumbing/Sump:
Next up was plumbing. It more or less came together without anything interesting happening. It did require a second set of hands to get the bulkheads tightened around the bottom of the tank. It ships with black plastic click lock hose clamps. That worked okay on the barb they provided but was too small for around my pump's barb. I'll be swapping them with stainless steel screw clamps from McMaster. My Current-USA pump fit in the space really nicely and came with a barb that fit the supplied hose. I pushed the sump all the way against the back wall. This put the two return pipes more or less centered in their respective chamber.

The area for the skimmer is really big. My oversized skimmer from NYOS fits in there just fine and there is for sure more area to add something else with it. I attached my two heaters horizontally on either side of the skimmer. These are the best heaters and really make the best use of the space. Also the NYOS skimmer is seriously beautiful. I can't wait to fire it up.

The ATO area got me kinda scratching my head. There is a small hole (just larger than my 1/4" tube) that is about .298" in diameter in the top corner between the ATO and the return pump chamber. Presumably to route your 1/4" tube from one side to the other. But I really didn't like just dangling the tube through it. First it looked really unfinished and second as I found out later a standard Tunze ATO pump is pretty powerful. In fact it actually was able to move the 1/4" back and spray the inside of my stand. Luckily I was there to witness it and got right on it. I wish the hole was bigger and that they supplied a 1/8" NPT bulkhead to 1/4" push to connect. This line should be properly secured. The hole is an interesting idea, but doesn't seem all the way thought through or finished. It would be an easy fix to elevate the sump even more. For now I'm still looking for what I'm gonna do.

I did reach out to Waterbox and to their credit they are pretty responsive both via their website and Facebook. I appreciate that they actually have someone dedicated to responding to customers. In regards to the above they confirmed its intended use, but beyond that couldn't really explain it other than you should just stick your 1/4" through... Also, they host weekly live events to talk about their product and document projects they are working on at their office. They are pretty good about curating their social media communities and seem to respond to message boards too. Overall the blitz seems to have worked as there are a ton of comments on facebook of people that were gonna buy a Red Sea (like me) and went another direction. So while I may gripe over some documentation or small design concerns, they are trying to stay pretty engaged and will at least try and give you an answer.

Sump Shot:
IMG_2106.jpeg

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Next up aquascaping, water making, and filling the tank. Thanks to those that are following along and I've still got a ton of questions rattling around in my head over what I want to do or how to make improvements. That'll probably be the subsequent post with all my projects or tuning questions I have.
 

NY_Caveman

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Welcome to the forum! Looking awesome. Thanks for sharing all of the details.

 

Fishfishfishfish

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would you mind posting details of you set up the power side of your cabinet? Mine is currently chaos with 4 power heads, skimmers, lights, etc. Thanks!
 

Janci

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Very clean tank and scape.
I hear more good things about those Waterbox systems.
Enjoy!
 
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Kyle Bruin

Kyle Bruin

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would you mind posting details of you set up the power side of your cabinet? Mine is currently chaos with 4 power heads, skimmers, lights, etc. Thanks!
I can try and get a better photo for you tomorrow. Basically everything is behind the black control center. It came with my Current-USA Loop system. Rest off the cords are zip tied and I'm using adhesive back zip tie mounts to keep the cords tidy behind the tank. The power strip helps too by being mounted. Need to add a little shelf organization for my supplies and maybe a light too.

Hope it helps.
IMG_2110.jpeg
 
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Kyle Bruin

Kyle Bruin

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Any updates on the tank?
Man have I been slacking. I'm trying to be more active on R2R now that I, like so many have some additional time on my hands. Where to begin. So this tank has been through a lot... a quick overview of the last 18 months for my tank.

Well it crashed, twice. Both times to disease outbreaks, probably why I didn't update this thread. Too sad. I really thought I was cutting myself a break by going FOWLR in that it would allow me to dose my display with medication and not really worry about the usual ill effects due to not having inverts or corals. Silly me. So the first time around I didn't QT. All was good for a bit, but of course I started to battle issues and tried things like copper and Paraguard (turned the tubing to my skimmer blue :mad: ), and in the end I struggled to manage it. I was using cupramine and just couldn't keep the levels solid. And like many of us who don't have years of experience (by which I mean having made the mistakes) I had issues like using the seachem test kit before saying screw it and getting the hanna checker, running out of Cu regents (opps), and overall just not having a good handle on all the processes, identifying diseases, etc. So I lost the lot. I then went fallow. Totally emptied and sterilized the tank, new dry sand, and same rock. After 76 days I tried again and well... I still had issues. To my credit I was starting with difficult fish like copper band and ignitus anthias, but still just couldn't get things right. I setup a proper QT and was able to save a puffer fish and took the tank down for a second time.

This brings me to its current iteration. Sterilized again and new rocks this time, caribsea liferock. Really cool stuff. Live sand, Fiji pink and really tried to ensure everyone that went into the tank was properly quarantined. It has for the most part worked. I've been successful except for I still can't keep ignitus anthias. I found a really great unicorn tang locally, blue spotted puffer fish, porcupine pufferfish, two false perc clowns, green coris wrasse, algae blenny, fox face lo, and a flame angelfish. Tank has been mostly stable, I fight nitrates (see below on how I'm working on that). I've fed medicated food once or twice when I thought their poop looked weird, but otherwise everyones been healthy. I moved from the 700sqft triplex I was renting by the beach in Encinitas and now rent a much larger spot in Del Mar (still by the beach :D ). Lost a clown (jumped post move), but otherwise everyone's still good. I am finally settled here and setup the QT system. I have a Kole tang in there now that came in with a pretty bad bacterial infection, fingers crossed.

My equipment has totally changed from the current USA to being totally apex controlled. I used the WAV pumps for a while, but have now gotten Icecap gyre 4k units. I've played around with the Klir filter a bunch. Trying it again this week. Maybe I can spend the time and get it to play nice. I made a false wall for my electronics. Converted the ATO into a refugium. I tried doing chaeto sandwich but never got it to work. I have a decent chaeto ball going now. More on my nutrient export fight later. I have a separate 10g ATO next to the tank. Added a UV sterilizer. Added AI Hydra lights. In fact I think the only equipment I haven't swapped is my skimmer.

So nutrients. I've been having to do massive 50% water changes with my nitrates hitting 80+ and the glass getting excessively dirty. I've been really trying to get my refugium to work to help out (plus I need pods for the fish I want to keep). The ball of chaeto I have stopped getting any bigger. I'm going to harvest and see if that helps. It doesn't seem like it is that big that its just at its max size and I know there are plenty of nitrates for it. That said, I am just not a fan of the side effects of the fuge. My skimmer is super gross and the sump walls are getting encrusted with really tough green algae that only comes off with a blade. Maybe I can balance things out and if I could get my nitrates down to more 10ish range I wouldn't have that much algae growth outside of the chaeto, but I'm not confident in that.

Which brings me to my latest project (in addition to playing with my Klir filter), an algae scrubber. I've done a lot of research and to jump right to the end I ordered a Rain 4 from Santa Monica Filtration. I really seriously considered changing out the sump and may still some day.

As an aside, I don't like the integrated ATO. Its just too small to be practical, I have to bring my 1/4" hose out from my RODI every 3 days with that 5 gallon. At that point why even have a Klir if I'm having to baby sit the sump that often. That plus wanting 2 filter sock spots that are "connected" vs one after the other with baffels, I just would rather have a different style sump and maximize the available space for reactors or other filtration (plus more overall system volume). Geo and CWT sumps had features that really were attractive. For now I'm keeping my sump and going to use the Rain 4. May do something fancier down the line.

Back to the scrubber. I have seen the most consistent and enthusiastic support of almost any equipment in the algae scrubbers. Time will tell, but I have my fingers crossed that it'll help make a dent in my nitrates.

I'll close up with two things. First what I'm still working on or thinking about. I'm looking for better solutions for getting pods going. I've tossed in pods from algae barn maybe 3-4 times and just have never gotten them established. Even with chaeto. Annoying. I want to have a really strong colony for anthias and a copperband. I'm also looking for a reactor potentially. I'm kinda running out of space. I have the NYOS Torq, but I wasn't a fan. It was too lose and easy to bump. And it was hard to keep the flow low enough for carbon. Plus now with the Rain it won't fit. I can plumb one off my return, but two concerns there. First just the physical plumbing. I want to keep my check valve so I can't have a manifold high and tight to the top to feed everything. Plus my UV is kinda massive and hard to get pipe to. Second, I don't think I have a strong enough return pump. Even thou my COR-15 is rated at 1500 GPH, I lose A LOT to derating. I'm lucky if I get 400-450 through the main return and 100-120 through my UV. I can get to maybe 500 if I close the UV section. Adding another branch to that would require a new pump. A quick note. When I turn my pump off for feeding, every once and a while it comes back on way stronger. Thats why I get 400 vs 450. Then the next time or sometimes two times after that, when I turn the pump off again, it'll go back down to 400. Not sure why. Maybe air is getting trapped occasionally? Hard to say. Lastly I'm trying to figure out what to use my ATO for if not a fuge. Do I keep the UV draining into it? I kind of want to remove all the interior glass on that side of the sump and just put in one long baffle. Basically combine the return and ATO sections. I can put in a reactor there (like a Geo sump) or a pod hotel or something.

This has been a ton of rambling so my final update is just that I've tried a lot of different options and equipment, methods and protocols. I think I'm starting to find what works for me and what I agree with. I've made all the mistakes I read about and even said I wasn't going to do. I made a bunch of purchases trying to save a buck only to be annoyed or worried about fish health to go and buy something better. I think I've got something "stable" now. When I was having all the trouble a year ago I was traveling a ton, often with little notice and problems and fish diseases always seemed to happen while I was away. During COVID I'm working from home and have been able to be much more diligent about watching the tank. I think my goal moving forward is to try and get my tank to where I feel comfortable going on a 1-2 week trip and know that aside from feeding (which should be very simple to do using frozen foods) that an expert isn't needed maintain the tank. That means socks gotta go and the glass/sand need to stay clean for two weeks.

Cheers to those that are following. Here are some sump photos. I'll take a few FTS photos when the lights hit their high in an hour or so.
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Letterkenny

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Thanks for the update! I’m based in Carlsbad and just ordered my 130.4 yesterday. Was curious about the pump but I think I’m going to go COR 20.
 
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Kyle Bruin

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Thanks for the update! I’m based in Carlsbad and just ordered my 130.4 yesterday. Was curious about the pump but I think I’m going to go COR 20.
Awesome! Glad to meet another north county waterbox owner. I picked mine up at Aquatic Warehouse. Came with a fish credit which was nice.

And yah if I were to go back I'd get the COR-20 or an ecotech vectra. Running it at 100% isn't what I thought I'd have to do when I made the selection. I really under appreciated the head pressure curve they show. At 6' head pressure you're at 625gph for the COR-15. When you add the linear feet of pipe, elbows, etc it's not surprising to me at all that I max out at around 500 GPH.

That being said, I don't know how much faster I'd really be able to run it through the system. Especially if trying to run a Klir. Either way, the COR-20 will give you the ability to play with that.
 
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Kyle Bruin

Kyle Bruin

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How do you like the KLIR?
So I've been using the Klir again now about 4 weeks (shelved it a few months back). This time around it has been consistent and I'd say very effective. It has not hit an error condition (long or multiple advances) even when cleaning the glass. It has had stayed consistently dark on the roll. It also handles my return pump stopping for feeding sessions. It does pressure the chamber it sits in when the return pump turns off for feedings. This will just make the water level in the chamber higher than the skimmer chamber in my sump. It does not affect performance.

All that said, it is in the second chamber and I have a 200 micron mesh sock in the first. I change it every 2-4 days. It makes a huge deal in keeping the KLIR behaving. It basically turns the KLIR into a polisher. The sock takes the brunt of it and the Klir takes out smaller stuff.

Would I keep running it long term? I don't know. I'm currently focused on getting a algae scrubber going and lowering my nitrates/phosphates. As part of this I am going to alter the glass baffle to my return section. Once I do all this, I'll probably turn back to the mechanical filtration side of my sump and try and better hone it.

This is a long and rambling way of saying yes I got it to work and it seems to be pulling some good stuff out. Is it a silver bullet or a must have? Dunno right now.
 

ohiohamfish

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Looking at a WB 130 for a FOWLR setup and it’s a bit intimidating reading about your issues ... but informative and nice to follow at the same time. So keep us updated and here’s to hoping the tank is finding it’s stride.
 
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Kyle Bruin

Kyle Bruin

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Looking at a WB 130 for a FOWLR setup and it’s a bit intimidating reading about your issues ... but informative and nice to follow at the same time. So keep us updated and here’s to hoping the tank is finding it’s stride.
I'll say and, *knock on wood* that I've started to hit my stride. I recently QTed a Kole tang and now a yellow tang, clown fish, and juv emperor angelfish. So far everything has gone well with these additions. Had to fight off some nasty bacterial infections on the Kole while he was in QT, but he did it. Some aggression when I first added, but didn't last more than a day or so. Finally starting to feel good about the quantity of fish and amount of activity in the tank. A few more small guys and I may be done for a while.

I did however break my sump lol. I took it out to remove the baffles between the skimmer, ato, and return sections. My goal was to replace them with one continuous baffle thus combining the ATO and return section. However while carrying it back inside after cleaning it slipped and touched part of the door frame and cracked. So I ran out and got a 20g long from Petco and the tank has been working off that for about 10 days. A Fiji Cube 30 sump gets in Thursday. I'll shoot some photos once its in. I've been waiting for ETM to get pumps back in so I can upgrade my COR-15 to something bigger. So still lots to be done. The hobby never really stops, just hope I can stop having my tank half put together.

Looking back I don't think I would get a Waterbox again, and that's not a knock on them. I have and do recommend their tanks. But I think at this point I would rather go custom and get a tank, drill it with an external over flow, and my own sump. Might cost a little more and its why I still think Waterbox is a great starting point. But to avoid having to replace things that work with things that just work better makes me wish I did it differently. But that's what hindsight allows and without the experience I'd never know the features I wanted in a tank or sump and what bugs me and what doesn't.

All that said, if I had one single thing I wish I could do with my 4' Waterbox is to have a 3' sump. The 36" size is kinda standard with a lot of aftermarket sumps and I like the amount of space they have and available layouts. Hope that helps and hope you go with a FOWLR. I love my puffers :)
 

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Hi @Kyle Bruin - curious how you are liking the Fiji Cube 30 in your Waterbox, and are you using your Klir roller with it? I'm contemplating how to repurpose the ATO in my Waterbox into a refugium, but may just bite the bullet and replace the sump. The Fiji Cube 30 looks like a good option.
 

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