Options to raise Ph and Alkalinity in smaller tank?

[GARRIGA]

That was running Pom Pom macro algae.

 

[dangit]

I have a mangrove tree in the sump and then run a co2 scrubber to keep pH levels over 8..

Mangrove tree is in the refugium in the sump and scrubber is hooked up directly to my skimmer

 

[GARRIGA]

Can also run a screen mesh across the top and grow GHA. Which is what ended up growing on my Pom Pom. Can’t beat GHA. Might as well use it and why another option is a HOB ATS. Guy on eBay sells them. Search this forum as someone posted the one they sell for sumps. Could also just diy although to me time is money and I’m likely spending more considering the mistakes I’m expecting.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Seachem Marine Buffer. Read / follow instructions thoroughly.​

Very poor choice. It isn't even a good alk supplement for a reef tank when you don't want a pH boost, which is not going to be useful.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Checked with LFS they dont have any buffer at all but petco has the reef buffer. It seems to be the stronger compared to marine buffer. I assume this would work as well.

Forget buffers of any sort.

Hydroxide is by far the best pH boost per unit of alk added 9kalkwasser or diy two part using sodium hydroxide) , but it won't solve your low pH, if real. The effect is too small for the amount f alk you need.

id look for other methods for the pH boost, such as fresher air tot he room, recalibrating the pH probe, outside air to a skimmer, or CO2 scrubber on the skimmer inlet.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

FWIW, water changes, regardless of salt mix, are never a good way to deal with low pH.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Thinking if I fix the alkalinity the pH will fix itself (I would hope it would) everything seems fine in the tank so I also don't want to be chacing numbers either.

It won't. To give a 0.3 pH unit boost from alk raising alone (ignoring the temp boost when first added), you'd need to double the alkalinity.

 

[DDenny]

Forget buffers of any sort.

Hydroxide is by far the best pH boost per unit of alk added 9kalkwasser or diy two part using sodium hydroxide) , but it won't solve your low pH, if real. The effect is too small for the amount f alk you need.

id look for other methods for the pH boost, such as fresher air tot he room, recalibrating the pH probe, outside air to a skimmer, or CO2 scrubber on the skimmer inlet.

I don't mind adding a small protein skimmer and CO2 scrubber to try an increase pH. I will look into that and see what I can find I know I have seen the skimmer but CO2 scrubber might be a harder find for such a small tank.
Thank you for your input.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I don't mind adding a small protein skimmer and CO2 scrubber to try an increase pH. I will look into that and see what I can find I know I have seen the skimmer but CO2 scrubber might be a harder find for such a small tank.
Thank you for your input.

If you do not have a skimmer at all, try this aeration test:

pH and the Reef Aquarium - REEFEDITION

by Randy Holmes-Farley For many aquarists, pH is not something that they have much experience with aside from their aquarium. For many, pH is almost a black box measurement: something to be considered, but whose physical meaning makes little sense to them. This article will Read more here...

www.reefedition.com

The Aeration Test

Some of the possible causes of low pH listed above require an effort to diagnose. Problems 3 and 4 are quite common, and here is a way to distinguish them. Remove a cup of tank water and measure its pH. Then aerate it for an hour with an airstone using outside air. Its pH should rise if it is unusually low for the measured alkalinity (Figure 2). Then repeat the same experiment on a new cup of water using inside air. If its pH also rises, then the aquarium’s pH will rise simply with more aeration because it is only the aquarium that contains excess carbon dioxide. If the pH does not rise in the cup (or rises very little) when aerating with indoor air, then that air likely contains excess CO2, and more aeration with that same air will not solve the low pH problem (although aeration with fresher air should). Be careful implementing this test if the outside aeration test results in a large temperature change (more than 5°C or 10°F), because such changes alone impact pH measurements.

 

[GARRIGA]

If you do not have a skimmer at all, try this aeration test:

pH and the Reef Aquarium - REEFEDITION

by Randy Holmes-Farley For many aquarists, pH is not something that they have much experience with aside from their aquarium. For many, pH is almost a black box measurement: something to be considered, but whose physical meaning makes little sense to them. This article will Read more here...

www.reefedition.com

The Aeration Test

Some of the possible causes of low pH listed above require an effort to diagnose. Problems 3 and 4 are quite common, and here is a way to distinguish them. Remove a cup of tank water and measure its pH. Then aerate it for an hour with an airstone using outside air. Its pH should rise if it is unusually low for the measured alkalinity (Figure 2). Then repeat the same experiment on a new cup of water using inside air. If its pH also rises, then the aquarium’s pH will rise simply with more aeration because it is only the aquarium that contains excess carbon dioxide. If the pH does not rise in the cup (or rises very little) when aerating with indoor air, then that air likely contains excess CO2, and more aeration with that same air will not solve the low pH problem (although aeration with fresher air should). Be careful implementing this test if the outside aeration test results in a large temperature change (more than 5°C or 10°F), because such changes alone impact pH measurements.

Wouldn't a co2 meter not also help identify excess co2 in the room? 1,000 ppm being problematic yet 400 ppm likely the tank. Also, just increasing aeration and seeing no bump in pH wouldn't lead one to conclude it's likely excess room co2?

I ask because my outside air in the 90s and room in the low 70s and tank normally around 78. In my situation. The cup test would be inconclusive. Although having added a Fuge my pH finally broke 8 where it normally sat around 7.5 on a calibrated probe.

Only test I ran was increasing aeration which didn't make a dent and living in south Florida with an airtight house and many of us including pets I'm confident my co2 is closer to 1000 than 400. Although at some point I'm buying a meter. Leave little to guess.

 

[Reef.]

If I was the OP I would stop all changes and confirm that their stated ph of 7.6 is correct.

7.6 is extremely low and I doubt their ph pen is reliable.

 

[DDenny]

If I was the OP I would stop all changes and confirm that their stated ph of 7.6 is correct.

7.6 is extremely low and I doubt their ph pen is reliable.

I have not changed anything nor added anything. I am just trying to figure things out and why it so low.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Wouldn't a co2 meter not also help identify excess co2 in the room? 1,000 ppm being problematic yet 400 ppm likely the tank. Also, just increasing aeration and seeing no bump in pH wouldn't lead one to conclude it's likely excess room co2?

I ask because my outside air in the 90s and room in the low 70s and tank normally around 78. In my situation. The cup test would be inconclusive. Although having added a Fuge my pH finally broke 8 where it normally sat around 7.5 on a calibrated probe.

Only test I ran was increasing aeration which didn't make a dent and living in south Florida with an airtight house and many of us including pets I'm confident my co2 is closer to 1000 than 400. Although at some point I'm buying a meter. Leave little to guess.

Yes, but the aeration test is free and can be done now, and also shows if the calibration is inaccurate.

 

[Reef.]

I have not changed anything nor added anything. I am just trying to figure things out and why it so low.

Thats my point, it’s probably not low your pen is probably not giving a correct reading.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Thats my point, it’s probably not low your pen is probably not giving a correct reading.

If true, that will be clear from the aeration test where outside air aeration will not raise it substantially. .

 

[DDenny]

I will do the tests this afternoon when I get home as well as pick up a pH test kit to double check my pen.

 

[DDenny]

Also going to soak my pen in vinegar to clean the tip and see if there might be buildup that i cannot see. Then recalibrate and see if I get a better reading.

 

[DDenny]

Would NO3 at 40-50 and PO4 at .37 play a role in lower pH? I think my PO4 is inflated due to silicates was fighting Dino’s for a while. Working to get those down with water changes no chemical or GFO yet.

 

[DDenny]

Cleaned the sensor and recalibrated pH pen and still sitting at 7.7. Going to take a sample to the LFS tomorrow for a quick test. I also aimed the return nozzles toward the surface more and it came up to 7.8 in 2 hours. So I turned the return pump up to max to get more surface agitation maybe that will help.

 

[Formulator]

I’m kind of stunned at the lack of obvious answers to an extremely basic question… Your alk is low, hence your low pH. You just need a basic 2 part alk and calcium solution. Take your pick of the many commercially available options. The most popular are probably BRS, B-ionic, and Randy’s DIY 2 part recipe. Follow the instructions to get your Alk back up to 8-9 dKH. Your pH should come up with it. Since your tank is small you may just need to dilute the 2-part in some RODI water. Half and half should be plenty dilution to give you a manageable dose volume.