Merry Christmas - Your SPS is dead

[bneufelder]

I've had a rough last few months and am finally at the point where I feel that I can share my story. I was really embarrassed for a long time and finally am at the point that I feel comfortable asking for help.

I have a 150g mixed reef that has been up since Dec 14. I added my first SPS 4 months later. Right around that time I got hit with Red Turf Algae. It was awful and nearly wiped my tank out during the next 8 months. I tried everything in the book to get rid of algae and everything seemed to make it worse. I never had measurable Nitrates or Phosphates. I started to read a lot about people with algae problems but not having any measurable nutrients in the water column because the algae was consuming it too quickly. I had a giant red blob in my tank so could definitely see this. This led me to peroxide. Within a couple of weeks I was able to dip enough of my rock in peroxide that my herbivores were able to keep it clean.

Enter two months of bliss. My tank was looking good, my SPS all survived this and started to have vastly improved growth and color. I broke down my QT tank and moved my light to my main tank to increase the PAR on the ends. Unexpectedly, my wife bought my a clam for Christmas. Probably the first thing she ever got me that I REALLY wanted, but I wasn't prepared at all. I couldn't QT it as I didn't have a skimmer or the setup ready to go since I didn't know it was coming. Looking back at it, I make a major mistake and acclimate it the best I can and add it to my DT.

I had been wanting to expand my SPS for months... hell, years! I was looking at different sticks and deciding what I wanted. I spoke to a couple of different people and decided to buy some Battle Corals. The winter was horrible so Adam decided to hold them a bit longer until we got a better shipping window, which I was ok with. During this time I made my 2nd big mistake and went in with a friend to buy some DFS DD SPS. Again, not able to QT anything.. I figured DD and BC was 100% safe. (and for the record, i still believe that) I put my lights (AI Hydra 52 LEDs) in acclimation mode by 50% and my downward spiral begins a week later. Almost exactly a week after I dim the lights the BC order comes in. Now I have 22 brand new sticks. The DD SPS starts to fade, I talk to some people and get advised never to dim lights as you can shock your system.

Mass RTN/STN ensues for the next 3 months. I try to be calm and make slow adjustments. Params look great. Alk is stable, Ca is stable, no nitrates/phosphates. I start to panic. I ramp lights back up over the next 2 weeks, I read non-stop about RTN/STN and go through everything I can think of that may start this. My original SPS that have been in the tank for nearly a year RTN/STN. I dose interceptor spektrum. More RTN/STN. I look for pests but can't see very well. Dip a few frags and don't see any issues.

Depression ensues. I start to blame my lights. Everything seems to of happened immediately after I dimmed them. I switch to MH. I'm now down to 7 SPS so lost about 23 or so and over $1000. My zoanthids colorup immediately under MH and coraline algae starts growing like mad. I have hope... then I lose 2 more STN over this weekend...

I remove all of my dead SPS frags, I had a hard time throwing them away hoping they would recover and I dip everything left in my tank. Red Bugs! I've never been so happy to see them. I also see a crab I didn't know about the size of silver dollar near my SPS. Read about crabs eating SPS while picking red bugs off of them. I interceptor spektrum again.

Could it of been the Clam that introduced a pest? The SPS not being QT'd for reputable sources? Maybe the mass algae problems was keeping the red bugs in check? I did have a lot of copepods living in it.

So that is where I'm at. I'm going to interceptor spektrum again at 7 days and 14 days from the first dose. I'm at the point I can pretty much fallow my tank from SPS as I don't think i'm going to have anything left (down to 5 but they all have some tissue missing) and may start over in a couple of months.

It's amazing how one bad decision can lead to another to another... and I'm not even sure if I'm out of this downward spiral yet.... but I have hope.

Any advice appreciated.

 

[deerhunter06]

sounds like you know your mistakes just learn from them and keep your head up. If this was easy and cheap everyone would do it.

 

[Triggreef]

Read up on Bayer advance for dipping corals. I dip all corals in this and never had any issues with coral pests. They say it won't kill eggs, but it's worked great for me.

 

[143MPCo]

Read up on Bayer advance for dipping corals. I dip all corals in this and never had any issues with coral pests. They say it won't kill eggs, but it's worked great for me.

+1, Bayer dipping works! rinse it off VERY well before returning to coral QT or DT!

 

[bneufelder]

I am currently Bayer dipping. That is what I used when I finally saw pests on my frags.

BTW, my Clam is doing great.

 

[sawdonkey]

You keep stating that you had sps, but could you specify? Acros (I assume since you order from BC), montis, birdsnest, stylos, etc? One pest typically doesn't attack all types of sps. If we knew what was dying maybe we could help more.

Since your problems seem so widespread, have you checked your salinity with more than one refractometer? You say your alk was stable, what was it stable at? Did you od the peroxide? Were you doing water changes all along? RODI water? You said you had a major algae problem? How did you get it in check. What were your phosphates at, how did you get them under control, and what are they at now?

Sorry, but the more specific you get, the more people can help.

 

[bneufelder]

Acros - 32 of 37 have died. I'll list them not to sensationalize my loss, but so you can see what types have died. (BC Acros - spanish rainbow, crimson, hyperberry, sunne, pc rainbow, thermans rainbow, bennet yellow, red planet, shades of fall, sunnyx (only skinny love and efflo are still alive), ORA Acros - Borealis, Hawkins, tricolor, verde, mind trick, joe the coral, ice tort, green planet (only green velvet is still alive), DFS DD Acros (green acro horrida, strawberry mint, northwoods tricolor, rasberry lemonade, rasberry fusion, blue blizzard, (only purple rose is still alive) Also had a half dozen from Premium Aquatics when they moved from Indy and 6-7 originals
Montis - I've had 2 die and have 5 that look unaffected. The 2 that died were my original ones that grew for ~10 months before the mass death.
Birdsnest - I had 2 of 2 die (they were both growing for ~10 months before the mass death)
Stylos - 1 of 1 die (was fairly new and never looked good)

Salinity - 24-25 with refractometer and Milwaukee refractometer
Alk - was stable at 9.8 before the crisis began. It has swung since. With all of the die off my demand dropped and it took me 2-3 weeks to get it stabilized at 8.4. When I added halides last week my Alk went from 8.4 to 7 in one week. I guess this is mainly from coraline growth? This was the biggest drop i've seen through all of this mess and I tested with two different kits (Red Sea/Salifert) 2x each to confirm these results. Alk has been my main concern all along and now pests since I did see red bugs.
Peroxide - I never dosed peroxide. I would dip a live rock in it for a couple of minutes then rinse and add to tank. My live rock that had acros I would baste peroxide directly onto the affected areas to avoid getting any on the SPS. I had 2 months of growth after using peroxide so don't think it had anything to do with it.
Water changes - I have a Spectrapure LM3 doing a 2 gallon water change daily. I've always done a 15% siphon once a month. Since having problems I've done it twice a month. (maybe 15% each time)
RODI water - TDS is always 0
Major algae problem - killed algae with peroxide, it did not come back. Red turf algae is known to grown/thrive in low nutrient systems.
Phosphates - I measured phosphates at .02 15 months ago and i've never measured this since until this weekend which came in at .03. I have to clean my glass about once a week and have 0 algae growing on my live rock. It's been 4 months since I used peroxide to get it under control.
Nitrates - My nitrates were 0 until I killed off the Red Turf algae. They are at 4 at the moment. I had to re-establish a refugium since the red turf outcompeted my cheato. My cheato is now thriving again to the point I'm ready to prune for the first time.

 

[Chameleon]

I'm a little confused about the timeline, but I'll assume you meant December 2013*. Your troubles do not sound pest related. It sounds like a water issue. The tank was young when you added the SPS. This can be done, but often leads to hard to explain issues. Triple check you salinity. Keep it simple: clac, alk, water changes, light, skimmer. Maybe try a polyfilter in case of contaminants. Do several large water changes to combat the die off. Things will turn around in time. Remember to always go slow. Another thing, there is no such thing as a safe vendor. They do the best they can but pests can slip by. We have seen this a couple times with DD/DFS. Its just a side affect of high coral turnover. That being said I really dont think its pest related.

 

[-Logzor]

The red bugs definitely didn't help, but I agree that it was a combination of lighting and water quality issues that caused the RTN/STN. The downward spiral began right after the issues with the LEDs according to your description. Once the RTN/STN ensues it can continue for months regardless of the corrections you make, I've been through similar frustrations before!! I had STN issues for around a year, no clue what caused it. Somehow the systems needs to reboot, it seems that once the bacteria that causes STN takes hold it's hard to shake. My system had a turnaround once I boosted the pH artificially with soda lime.

 

[bneufelder]

Yes, it should of said Dec 2013. It's been up for 16 months. Why don't you think it's pest related? I do have red bugs. Would bugs not work so quickly? This is all new to me so I really don't know.

My corals seemed to die in waves. 2-3 weeks after adding the DFS DD I lost 20-30% of what I had. It seemed to slow down a bit then I had another big wave of 20-30% and then what is left has died one by one in the last 6 weeks. I lost 2 this weekend which gets me down to 4 or so and everyone of them has signs of damage. White tips, white base, most of the flesh is gone.

I'll get my refractometer recalibrated to double check that. Thanks for the advice.

 

[-Logzor]

Yes, it should of said Dec 2013. It's been up for 16 months. Why don't you think it's pest related? I do have red bugs. Would bugs not work so quickly? This is all new to me so I really don't know.

My corals seemed to die in waves. 2-3 weeks after adding the DFS DD I lost 20-30% of what I had. It seemed to slow down a bit then I had another big wave of 20-30% and then what is left has died one by one in the last 6 weeks. I lost 2 this weekend which gets me down to 4 or so and everyone of them has signs of damage. White tips, white base, most of the flesh is gone.

I'll get my refractometer recalibrated to double check that. Thanks for the advice.

The missing flesh is a sign of the RTN not necessarily what the red bugs could be doing. If it were acropora eating flatworms then it's a different story, they literally eat the flesh. Red bugs inhabit the coral and don't seem to cause damage aside from reduced polyp extension. Long-term it can lead to the collapse of the colony though, if it gets bad enough.

 

[bneufelder]

Gotcha. When I dipped my frags to find red bugs, i didn't see any AEFW.

 

[-Logzor]

Gotcha. When I dipped my frags to find red bugs, i didn't see any AEFW.

If I had to guess, the issues with the lighting, when the issues first started, caused a nasty chain reaction. Like I mentioned before, once that STN/RTN sticks it can be really hard to shake even if you fix the problem! I wonder if the peroxide dosing killed the good bacteria and allowed the bad to thrive? Looking back upon my STN issues, I think it happened after H2O2 dosing. To say the least, it's hard to track down the causes of problems like this!

 

[bneufelder]

Someone suggested I add photos of the SPS I have left so people could see what exactly is happening to them.

This is an efflo and has been in my tank for 10 months. Tips are gone, base showing recession.

This has been in my tank for 10 months. Tips are gone, base showing recession.

Just tips gone on this one. Mainly just tips are gone. It's been in for 3 months.

This one has one side completely gone the other side looks halfway decent. It's been in for 3 months.

Here is a shot of an ORA greentip birdsnest. It looked great until a week ago and it has gone from the bottom up. Had a lot of red bugs on it when I dipped it. You can also see the BC Efflo. It's receding from the base up. The front looks really good and has actually improved in the color. Sadly, I give it a week. You can see some of my other frags that have died.

 

[NanaReefer]

May I ask what fish foods your feeding?

 

[bneufelder]

Omega flakes, new life spectrum and every third day frozen mysis or LRS herb/reef frenzy.

 

[duke62]

I had the same issue last year. Tips were dying then lose of all my acros. Mine was accidental poisoning due to socks. My new front load washing machine was trapping HE detergent in the rubber ring. I always rinsed the machine first before washing socks and did 2 rinses but the trapped soap for into tehe socks killing all my coral over a period of 3 to 4 months. My corals looked exactly like yours. I am totally sick less now and my new corals are doing great

 

[maroun.c]

Sorry to hear, and its good that you finally decided to share a bad story on the forum which some never do.
Its hard to pinpoint the causes but i would focus on the basics alk swings, major PH fluctuations or temperature. In my case of similar happening it was undetected phosphates. Lighting changes in your case could have just started a chain reaction so take it sliw and change one thing at a time for the time being and watch and document your system.
Hope things

 

[Stoneyman]

My friend i had to go back and read this thread again. Its very very similiar to issue im having and the entire story down to the types of corals you had and lost, the way youve lost them ...all the same with my reef. Its getting to the point where im very close to breaking down the tank all together. Its very sad. Ive been doing this successfully for 7-8 years. This was supposed to be my dream tank i built 2 years ago. Sverything was going lerfect till about 4 months ago. Then well u know the rest lol. Your really good at documenting and painting a clear picture of the story. I wish i could do that. I guess i could lretty mich copy/paste your thread . I hope you turn it around. Someone had a suggestion of breaking things down and starting over...Thats what i may do.

 

[bneufelder]

I feel your pain Stoneyman. Have you gotten to the point of 0 across? That's where I'm stuck at, do I remove what is left and hope for a reboot after a month or two or let it run it's course praying for something good to happen? I've lost 90% already, but it's difficult to destroy something that is alive no matter how bad it looks.