Algae problem (Hairy, Cyano and another one)

SantaMonicaHelp

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That's a great idea.
Can you tell me what are the differences between UAS and a refuge?

Sorry for the late reply. Hope this helps lee:

Scrubbers compared to refugiums

If you are starting a new tank, then the obvious difference is that a scrubber gives you the option of not having a fuge at all because the scrubber can go on top of, in, or behind the display. There are other uses for a sump/fuge of course, but we'll only cover the filtration concerns.


A not-so-obvious difference is that a scrubber, if run together with a fuge with macros, will kill the macros even though the macros are much larger. This is because the scrubber thinks the macros are nuisance algae. Some people do run both together without killing the macros, but this is just because their scrubber is not strong enough, and actually the macros might even be slowing down the scrubber because the scrubber thinks it has to remove the macros, and the nutrients in the water, and the nuisance algae in the display. However, if it works for their current setup, good.


But assuming you have to decide on either a sump/fuge or a scrubber (not both)...


o Filtration with algae is proportional photosynthesis, which is proportional to Light X Flow X Attachment. Meaning, stronger light grows more algae; stronger water flow grows more algae; and stronger attachment lets more algae grow without it floating away. A scrubber is designed to maximize Light, Flow, and Attachment.


o The main problem with macros in a refugium is the self-shading that the macros do. Any part of the macro which is not directly in front of the light at any moment is not filtering. And any macro inside of a "ball" of macro (like chaeto) is self-shaded all the time. Only the surface macro that is directly in front of the light is doing any real filtering. A scrubber is designed to have all the algae in front of the light at all times. Rotating the macro does not solve the problem because the time that the macro is rotated away from the light is time that the macro is not filtering. This is why it takes a much larger size of chaeto to do the same filtering as a scrubber.


o Self-flow-blocking is another problem of macros in a refugium, for the same reason as light-blocking. And the thicker the "ball" of macro, the worse the flow-blocking.


o Particle trapping is another result of a ball of macro. These particles need to cycle back around to feed the corals, but instead they get trapped in the macro and rot, and in doing so they block even more flow and light.


o With a scrubber, there is very little water standing in the way of the light. Also, the light is (or should be) very close to the scrubber... 4 inches (10cm) or less. The power of light varies with the inverse square of the distance, so going from 8" to 4" actually gives you 4X the power, not 2X. And the nutrient removal power of algae is proportional to the power of the light, because it's the photosynthesis that is doing the filtering.


o Rapid flow across the algae in a scrubber gives more delivery of nutrients, compared to the slow moving water in a fuge. Filtering is proportion to nutrient flow.


o The turbulence of water moving over the sections of algae in a scrubber help to remove the boundary layer of water around the algae. This boundary layer slows the transfer of metabolites in and out of the algae. There is no turbulence in a fuge (if there were, you'd have waves and bubbles).


o Scrubbers do not let food particles settle like a refugium does; most particles flow right out of the scrubber.


o Scrubbers do not (if cleaned properly) release strands into display, like chaeto does.


o Scrubbers do not go sexual, like caulerpa can.


o Scrubbers do grow lots of pods; more than was previously thought.


o Scrubber don't, obviously, provide a place for snails and crabs, etc.


However, if you already have a sump with an empty compartment, and you don't mind using all of it and putting a light over it, then maybe it's easier and cheaper to try macros than even a DIY scrubber.
 
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leeransetton

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Wow thanks for the detailed answer!

Actually my sump is filled with equipment and I have no free space in it.

For aquarium volume of 240 liters (water volume of 220 liters with sump), what mesh size do I need? And how many leds?

Why only red leds when we know that plants need blue as well?

What flow rate should I use?

Thanks :)
 

fishroomlady

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I'll just chime in fwiw - I think some of the algae looks like bryopsis and then some looks like it's kind of bacterial if that makes sense. I think the lights out is a great suggestion but I'd try to remove a lot of it manually although that's a pain it should help
 
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leeransetton

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As for the sizing, it says I feed 1 cube a day, so I made it look like I'm using almost 3 cubes a day (added frozen food and coral food)
Now it says I need 226 sq. cm. (35 sq. in.) so I made it into 600 sq. cm. (20X30 cm).
I wanna use a box made of mirrors (not exactly, but almost) and place the leds only on one side. about 18-20 leds.
The box will be 4 cm wide (because I have no more room in my cabin). Is that ok?
Is using 20 leds ok? and using "too big" mesh?

and another thing.. If I use 20 3w leds (2.2v-2.6v), what driver do I need?

Thanks!
 
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leeransetton

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Nope
The system is running for a year now
I wanna make it big just because I can.
Can it cause a problem?
 
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leeransetton

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OK.. So after 3 days of total darkness (bu-ha-ha) the algae is still as it was.
I'm planning on algae scrubber, though
 

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