Algae Scrubber Basics

SantaMonica · Sep 30, 2016

The bottom there would spill water out all over the place

No the water does not spill out; it goes out the drain. And it fits any sump, either a shelf, or on the pole mount on the floor.

jason2459 · Oct 1, 2016

SantaMonica said:
No the water does not spill out; it goes out the drain. And it fits any sump, either a shelf, or on the pole mount on the floor.

There's a single drain there right?

What if you want a larger screen but limited in space in the sump? Even a moderate sized screen setup like that wouldn't fit my current sump.

SantaMonica · Oct 7, 2016

Yes a single drain. As for size, it's the smallest available for a 4 x 6" enclosed screen.

jason2459 · Oct 8, 2016

SantaMonica said:
Yes a single drain. As for size, it's the smallest available for a 4 x 6" enclosed screen.

How does it not spill out the sides when that single drain starts backing up? How will that fit in a sump with limited space especially as the screen size gets bigger? Does one have to scrap their current setup and build specifically around the scrubber? Even that 4x6 screen would not fit in my current sump.

Turbo's Aquatics · Oct 9, 2016

Whenever you have a drain, it has a certain maximum flow based on the pipe diameter and the vertical drop (from the top of the open drain (or the water level above the open drain) to the water level it is draining into). A drain that is open (no valve) will allow air to occlude and this will reduce max flow, and you'll get gurgling and/or flushing depending on the flow rate. Low flow rates will generally allow the water to cling to the pipe walls and it will be pretty silent. If you valve the drain so that there is no air occlusion, you can generally get a much higher maximum flow rate. This is the basis of the tuned siphon drain (herbie, bean, etc). But those are usually accompanied by a secondary drain which allows you to over-tune the siphon and allow the excess to flow out the 2nd pipe. Without that, you either will have water rising to force a larger drop, or overspill (in this case, over the edge of the tray)

Also the water level generally needs to be above the open drain a certain distance in order to prevent the tornado effect, which sucks in air bubbles (which get chewed up in a siphon line into sometimes difficult to control microbubbles)

jason2459 · Oct 9, 2016

Or just get a really big drain

Think I'm ready for the RAIN

Turbo's Aquatics · Oct 10, 2016

Today is my 6 year anniversary of my first algae scrubber installation on 10/10/10

SantaMonica · Oct 14, 2016

How does it not spill out the sides when that single drain starts backing up? How will that fit in a sump with limited space especially as the screen size gets bigger? Does one have to scrap their current setup and build specifically around the scrubber? Even that 4x6 screen would not fit in my current sump.

It's a sump-only design, so the idea is to only put it where it can overflow if needed. Of course with the pole mount, this is done automatically.

The pole mount option takes less space than any other waterfall. The only smaller version is an upflow which basically takes up no space.

Yes to make of of these, you'd have to do it from the start.

Zoacoral · Oct 17, 2016

hi, I am wondering if this light would work for a 6x5 screen? Or do you have any other recommendation?

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01CH75SG...olid=ULYZW2B202ZV&coliid=I1ZWWZUBQ4FP7C&psc=1

Turbo's Aquatics · Oct 18, 2016

I would say that is OK, but probably underpowered. It'll get you going and might take care of you but you might hit a point where the growth isn't enough to do what you need. But then again, it might - depends on what other filtration you have in play.

http://algaescrubber.zohosites.com/lighting-led.html

^ the paragraph on non-DIY LEDs is applicable here, the red flag is that the fixture you linked to says it's 12W but that's probably referring to 12x 1W LED and probably not at full rated current, so at the wall, that fixture likely pulls 6W or less. You want about 10W minimum, preferably 20W.

So I guess it comes down to what you want the scrubber to do, if you have good filtration and want to take the edge off of maintenance/media usage and try out a scrubber, that's not a bad choice. They aren't really specific about the spectrum, so it looks like it has a broad range, not sure if that's good or bad. But if you wanted to have the scrubber be the workhorse and become the primary filtration method, I might look for a different fixture.

kalare · Oct 18, 2016

Sorry if this is off topic, but regarding an upflow ATS, for what reason are they all designed using an air pump? Could you not tee off your return and use water flow instead of an airstone? Saving you another plug and some noise and salt creep?

Zoacoral · Oct 18, 2016

Alright, How about this one?

https://www.amazon.com/Levin-85~265...qid=1476811924&sr=8-5&keywords=grow+led+bulbs

SantaMonica · Oct 18, 2016

Coming shortly... a short video of the first look at the RAIN2. You can decide what parts of it are easy for your DIY skills, and build it that way.

Alright, How about this one

That amazon bulb will be pretty focused, so it will need to be 8" away or so.

upflow ATS, for what reason are they all designed using an air pump? Could you not tee off your return and use water flow instead of an airstone? Saving you another plug and some noise and salt creep?

This picture might help:

kalare · Oct 18, 2016

Ah, great explanation. Makes sense...and since I run planted CO2 freshwater tanks as well, I should have thought of this! Thanks

October Sky · Feb 16, 2017

Zoacoral said:
Alright, How about this one?

https://www.amazon.com/Levin-85~265V-Greenhouse-Hydroponic-Spectrum/dp/B01FWZVBIC/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1476811924&sr=8-5&keywords=grow+led+bulbs

I got a similar light for my biocube refugium (the 7w with stand), I'll just say this, it's pretty warm. It's not hot, but it's certainly warm. Of course we're always battling heat, but I'm just noting it because I thought it would be cooler. It's also ridiculously bright in terms of blinding effect. Don't look directly at it or you will only see purple for about 10 seconds.

Justin....#JAMAS · Jul 4, 2018

Just a quick question, I have a sump with an overflow and was going to build a DIY waterfall algae scrubber that would be hooked up as the first thing the water hits as it comes down, than to my filter sock than to my chaeto.... Can I have chaeto in my sump and still have an algae scrubber up top?

Turbo's Aquatics · Jul 7, 2018

Justin..GO DAWGS!! said:
Can I have chaeto in my sump and still have an algae scrubber up top?

Yes, but the chaeto may be out-competed by the algae scrubber, depending on your tank and scrubber

Scrubber_steve · Aug 3, 2018

Floyd R Turbo said:
You need to run your lighting for 18 hours on, 6 hours off. All life needs downtime. Plants are no exception. They have adapted to the environment over millions of years, and as the saying goes, you can't fool Mother Nature. So don't go thinking that you can run lights 24/7 and get 25% more algae growth, it doesn't work that way.

Hi Bud; This is somewhat a debatable issue (I have discovered). I agree with your perspective. I believe running 24/7 light indefinately is a waste of electricity at the least & possibly stressful to most algae that have evolved in 12/12 to 16/8 light/dark cycles.
But some argue that its ok to do & the algae just keeps growing. Clear Water scrubbers recommend 24/7 illumination if nutrients are high. Others run their fuges 24/7 & suggest improved growth. Its all anecdotal of course.
I've read data that shows some macroalgae are light saturated after 16 hours, so illuminating them for a further 8 hours is a waste of electricity.
The data was over a 24 hour test only, so the effect of 24/7 illumination >>indefinately<< is not known.
Can you comment further, & have you read any useful data that supports either position?

cheers
steve

Justin....#JAMAS · Aug 3, 2018

Like i said, i turn my fuge light on when i get up in the morning and turn it off right before the lunar lights come on, on my kessil ap700, at 11pm....so the fuge 65w big plant light i use from wally world is on for a total of about 16 hours a day..... Off at night while the reef rests all night until 7am when the sunrise begins.... Ive always had wonderful results with clean healthy chaeto plus my parameters always are in check bc of it! Not to mention how many pods are in that chaeto! This is just what works for me.... When i started my mixed reef in june 2017, i was always told, for some reason, to do it this way and is def just something that works for me, but hey every tank is different right? Lol... I honestly dont see any debate here, if anyone has a schedule for their fuge where their fuge is doing its job and keeping chaeto healthy, dont change anything! I believe its thinvs like this that get people in their own heads to end up going to tinker with their tank and throw things out of whack and slow coral growth or cause stress to inhabitants..... But thats just my two cents lol. On another note id like to see some peoples tank shots and their chaeto, post em up peeps!! Cheers everyone and have a awesome weekens! happy reefing!!

Josh@ClearWaterScrubbers · Aug 5, 2018

Scrubber_steve said:
Hi Bud; This is somewhat a debatable issue (I have discovered). I agree with your perspective. I believe running 24/7 light indefinately is a waste of electricity at the least & possibly stressful to most algae that have evolved in 12/12 to 16/8 light/dark cycles.
But some argue that its ok to do & the algae just keeps growing. Clear Water scrubbers recommend 24/7 illumination if nutrients are high. Others run their fuges 24/7 & suggest improved growth. Its all anecdotal of course.
I've read data that shows some macroalgae are light saturated after 16 hours, so illuminating them for a further 8 hours is a waste of electricity.
The data was over a 24 hour test only, so the effect of 24/7 illumination >>indefinately<< is not known.
Can you comment further, & have you read any useful data that supports either position?

cheers
steve

I have ran my personal scrubber 24/7 for over two years with zero issues. The algae is always full and thick. Any pictures I have posted about harvesting will back that up.

From what studies I have read, it’s the blue spectrum that actually provides the “dark period” of light for the algae while growing. How that works, I don’t know as I’m not a biologist. But from what I have read is by using the two different spectrums, it allows the algae to grow thru chlorophyll A and chlorophyll B. We are going to send one of our units down to Charlie Gregory to test and research for us on his systems.

We only recommend the 24/7 light cycle to get the growth just started on the screen. If someone is running a FOWLR tank, we recommend keeping that schedule as it doesn’t matter, maybe even beneficial, to fish if the water is completely stripped of nutrients. With mixed reef tanks however, the corals do need some levels of nitrate and phosphate in the water. That is where we recommend cutting the light cycle back, only if it’s overstripping the water, to allow for some levels of nutrients in the water. Finding that exact time tho is up to the individual, as no two tanks are the same.