butterfly fish are impossible for me i dont know why?

[ARGYGANG]

i have tried with a racoon butterfly (this guy lived for a little over three weeks in the DT) a pearl scale (dead a week after qt) a latticed butterfly (dead within a week of entering DT). i really really dont understand whats up with these fish. they go through QT the tank is 4 footx2 foot they are fed mysis clams and butterfly coral cubes i add vitamins to their food the tank has zero ammonia gets kept around 10-15 nitrates has all the bells and whistles uv refugium etc tank is over a year old and has almost 200 lbs of liverock in it.....PLENTY of caves to hide in. the other fish in the tank are peaceful fish, birdwrasse, melanarus wrasse, clownfish, bangaiis and pajamas, mollies and hawk fish and my big derpy dog face who doesnt mess with anyone and is even super polite when feeding and waits his turn. every time they die the same way they hit the sand bed for around a day and then just never get up from laying down. my racoon just started doing it and as always i was able to pick him up with my gloved hand because he just randomly got so weak for no reason and so i euthanized him, sad stuff. he was literally about to jump out the tank yesterday for some mysis and today he was like this, with absolutely no signs of disease on fins or skin and his gills also were not inflamed. im just stumped because i put so much into these fish on a daily basis and spend all this money on high end equipment and other things and all my other fish do great and at this point i hardly need new fish but ive tried quite a few times for my last fish to be a butterfly and it NEVER works. any advice for these guys? i feel like even after all the research i do on them they just nope out of life in my tank and i have no clue why. if it matters Chloroquine 40 mg/gal for the racoon and copper safe 2.0 ppm for the others and prazi at normal dose is how i QT. maybe even better yet any fish that offer the same kind of body shape as a butterfly without all the BS?

 

[ARGYGANG]

 

[Rugops]

Just to be clear, you have attempted the following:

- A raccoon butterfly
- A pearl scale butterfly
- A latticed butterfly

And based on your description, they all ate?

Where did you get them? Perhaps someone might know if cyanide was used to capture there.

There is a common theme and that's they are all corallivores. I have a guide (not online) about attempting to feed butterflies in general and some resort to applying a DIY mixture on a coral skeleton (well this as for the arabian butterfly and the melon butterfly). I need to go back and take a look as I have no prior experience.

Hopefully someone can lend a hand.

 

[ARGYGANG]

Just to be clear, you have attempted the following:

- A raccoon butterfly
- A pearl scale butterfly
- A latticed butterfly

And based on your description, they all ate?

Where did you get them? Perhaps someone might know if cyanide was used to capture there.

There is a common theme and that's they are all corallivores. I have a guide (not online) about attempting to feed butterflies in general and some resort to applying a DIY mixture on a coral skeleton (well this as for the arabian butterfly and the melon butterfly). I need to go back and take a look as I have no prior experience.

Hopefully someone can lend a hand.

firstly yes those are the three i attempted, first two from saltwater fish and my racoon was from reefbeauties. yes they ate but they didnt just eat they literally would outcompete others for food. at the most random time each and every one would go down hill and perish for no visible reason within 24 hours. i basically at this point have marked it off as stress because i cant see whatelse it could be. they were fed butterfly cubes which is essentially coral mashed up into a frozen cube with mysis and they ate it aggressively.

 

[Rugops]

Did you end up throwing away the bodies?

Open up the insides because based on what I have seen and heard, this may be a case of cyanide poisoning (collection malpractice).

Hopefully more experienced individuals can give feedback.

#fishmedics

 

[ARGYGANG]

Did you end up throwing away the bodies?

Open up the insides because based on what I have seen and heard, this may be a case of cyanide poisoning (collection malpractice).

Hopefully more experienced individuals can give feedback.

#fishmedics

yeah i did i dont really have the stomach to open up pets, the little scaled creatures get my big grown self on a emotional level

 

[nereefpat]

Butterflies really don't ship well, for one. It sounds like they were eating, though.

I don't know how they handle Chloroquine. That may be an issue?

Racoon and pearlscale are hardy, at least for butterflies.

 

[dennis romano]

Maybe I can help. I have a 125 with eight butterflies. First of all, the three species that you had are all very hardy, adapting well to tank life. Here is what concerns me. You had them in with some super fast eaters, wrasses, cardinals and clowns. When I had wrasses with mine, my butterflies were a little intimidated by the zooming wrasses. You said that they were eating. They may have been eating but not enough. It looks to me that the forehead on your raccoon is a bit thin. Keep an eye on their forehead. If it is full, that is the sign of a healthy fish. If it is pinched, it is usually on its way out. Butterflies usually don't do well on one meal a day. Mine get fed at least three times a day. The menu includes, brine shrimp, mysis, nori, angel and butterfly cubes and clams on the half shell. Don't buy small or large fish. The smalls don't have enough fat from going through the supply chain. Missing a couple of meals is usually lethal. Large fish usually don't adapt to aquarium foods. At the moment, I have a recently purchased Rafflessi that is a pain trying to get him to eat. He's thinking about it but as yet has not pulled the trigger. That is the problem with butterflies, when they go downhill, they go fast. Another issue may be cyanide. A fish may be great for about a month, then just dead the next day. This usually happens with Philippine and Indonesian collectors. Yes, I have had that happen with fish from the vendors you mentioned. i hope that I was some help. Best of luck.

 

[brwaldbaum]

You're absolutely sure there are no aggression issues?

 

[ARGYGANG]

You're absolutely sure there are no aggression issues?

yes ive even set up a webcam and recorded the tank for a full shift at work while noone is home, they kinda all just swim around not paying much attention to each other and when the auto feeder goes off they all eat them as they sink then go back to buisness as usual. the tank is setup in such a way the fish have several islands of rocks and TONS of caves to have as there own. thats what really is stumping the heck out of me when i think about this because it truly just feels random or maybe my tank just has super fast acting uronema?

 

[ARGYGANG]

Maybe I can help. I have a 125 with eight butterflies. First of all, the three species that you had are all very hardy, adapting well to tank life. Here is what concerns me. You had them in with some super fast eaters, wrasses, cardinals and clowns. When I had wrasses with mine, my butterflies were a little intimidated by the zooming wrasses. You said that they were eating. They may have been eating but not enough. It looks to me that the forehead on your raccoon is a bit thin. Keep an eye on their forehead. If it is full, that is the sign of a healthy fish. If it is pinched, it is usually on its way out. Butterflies usually don't do well on one meal a day. Mine get fed at least three times a day. The menu includes, brine shrimp, mysis, nori, angel and butterfly cubes and clams on the half shell. Don't buy small or large fish. The smalls don't have enough fat from going through the supply chain. Missing a couple of meals is usually lethal. Large fish usually don't adapt to aquarium foods. At the moment, I have a recently purchased Rafflessi that is a pain trying to get him to eat. He's thinking about it but as yet has not pulled the trigger. That is the problem with butterflies, when they go downhill, they go fast. Another issue may be cyanide. A fish may be great for about a month, then just dead the next day. This usually happens with Philippine and Indonesian collectors. Yes, I have had that happen with fish from the vendors you mentioned. i hope that I was some help. Best of luck.

i talked to reefbeauties, where i aquired the racoon and he replied with a genuine answer "I am not aware of any of our fish being collected with cyanide and put a fair amount of effort into making sure of that, but its hard because they can always lie. it seems your racoon died a odd and random death since all of your other fish are healthy and thank you for bringing this to my attention and thank you for the pics of the tank and inhabitants they look wonderful." i guess thats the tricky part about this is even the distributor no matter how good of a reputation can at the end of the day just get lied to.

 

[dennis romano]

i talked to reefbeauties, where i aquired the racoon and he replied with a genuine answer "I am not aware of any of our fish being collected with cyanide and put a fair amount of effort into making sure of that, but its hard because they can always lie. it seems your racoon died a odd and random death since all of your other fish are healthy and thank you for bringing this to my attention and thank you for the pics of the tank and inhabitants they look wonderful." i guess thats the tricky part about this is even the distributor no matter how good of a reputation can at the end of the day just get lied to.

One thing that I have noticed over the years is that the more expensive butterflies (excluding coral eaters) tend to do better than the average butterflies. For example, my Coradion and burgessi came in and ate immediately. Others such as saddled or tear drop which are more commonly imported usually have issues. IMHO it is that collectors realize that they have something rare and more expensive and care for them a bit better. I have found that the auriga is pretty bullet proof. They eat well and may compete better with more active fish. I agree with you about the distributors not really knowing how their fish were collected. I tend to stay away from fish that have been collected from the Philippines or Indonesia.

 

[Darkrooster]

i have tried with a racoon butterfly (this guy lived for a little over three weeks in the DT) a pearl scale (dead a week after qt) a latticed butterfly (dead within a week of entering DT). i really really dont understand whats up with these fish. they go through QT the tank is 4 footx2 foot they are fed mysis clams and butterfly coral cubes i add vitamins to their food the tank has zero ammonia gets kept around 10-15 nitrates has all the bells and whistles uv refugium etc tank is over a year old and has almost 200 lbs of liverock in it.....PLENTY of caves to hide in. the other fish in the tank are peaceful fish, birdwrasse, melanarus wrasse, clownfish, bangaiis and pajamas, mollies and hawk fish and my big derpy dog face who doesnt mess with anyone and is even super polite when feeding and waits his turn. every time they die the same way they hit the sand bed for around a day and then just never get up from laying down. my racoon just started doing it and as always i was able to pick him up with my gloved hand because he just randomly got so weak for no reason and so i euthanized him, sad stuff. he was literally about to jump out the tank yesterday for some mysis and today he was like this, with absolutely no signs of disease on fins or skin and his gills also were not inflamed. im just stumped because i put so much into these fish on a daily basis and spend all this money on high end equipment and other things and all my other fish do great and at this point i hardly need new fish but ive tried quite a few times for my last fish to be a butterfly and it NEVER works. any advice for these guys? i feel like even after all the research i do on them they just nope out of life in my tank and i have no clue why. if it matters Chloroquine 40 mg/gal for the racoon and copper safe 2.0 ppm for the others and prazi at normal dose is how i QT. maybe even better yet any fish that offer the same kind of body shape as a butterfly without all the BS?

I just got two rainfords a few weeks ago. They eat all frozen like a horse. I haven’t tried pellets yet. They love aptasia. So far no coral nipping. Fingers crossed!

 

[jtf74]

I have two butterflies a CBB and yellow longnose. I also rec'd another yellow longnose that had wicked lympho that improved in 3-4 weeks and I sold it since I rec'd a replacement. First, butterflies eat a lot compared to other fish. I do sometimes feed once a day but I don't have a lot of fierce competition. Butterflies naturally want to pick at stuff and don't always get enough if not eating from the water column with the other fish. I qt'd mine alone in an established tank for 90 days no meds just observation and fed them like crazy until they fattened up and ate from the water column well. I was prepared to remove them and treat if necessary. By the end of 90 days both would eat out right out of the cup. I've had the cbb for 5 years and the yellow about 2. Would recommend a yellow longnose for sure.

 

[littlefoxx]

The one that you got from reef beauties, did you have it longer than 15 days ?