Defective (confused?) Tile Sea Star... Or is it me!?

[Jesse Sunday]

Hi Invert Experts!

So I've had a red starfish in my 90g for a while, and he's beautiful! He goes all around and does all his starfish things.

Well, I wanted another pop of color, so I got a Tile (or Marble) Starfish... He's pretty, not as vibrant as the Red, but ever since I've added him, he rarely is anywhere but at the top of the tank. Most of the time, flashing his underbelly at the world like a Central Park flasher!

Is that normal for the Tiled Stars? Is he trying to tell me something?

Thanks for any help/input you might have!

 

[shakacuz]

tank is very bare. are you feeding it?

 

[Jesse Sunday]

tank is very bare. are you feeding it?

Thanks for taking the time to look!

Mmmm, bare as in not full of life, or bare as in not much algae?

I just started the tank in January, but it has live rock from another system and a TON of macro in the sump. So the algae has been kept to a minimum (and I clean the glass/back often) - BUT - what/how would you recommend feeding it? (I have tried piping thawed frozen food on it when I feed the rest of the tank but he doesn't seem to be interested)

Thanks again for any input you might have!

 

[shakacuz]

Thanks for taking the time to look!

Mmmm, bare as in not full of life, or bare as in not much algae?

I just started the tank in January, but it has live rock from another system and a TON of macro in the sump. So the algae has been kept to a minimum (and I clean the glass/back often) - BUT - what/how would you recommend feeding it? (I have tried piping thawed frozen food on it when I feed the rest of the tank but he doesn't seem to be interested)

Thanks again for any input you might have!

bare as is not much algae. to my understanding, most starfish eat "film algae", so most of what accumulates on your glass or the first layer of whats on the rocks. i would search and feed specifically what is said that this starfish consumes. seems to me like its looking for food - however i could be completely wrong.

 

[Jesse Sunday]

bare as is not much algae. to my understanding, most starfish eat "film algae", so most of what accumulates on your glass or the first layer of whats on the rocks. i would search and feed specifically what is said that this starfish consumes. seems to me like its looking for food - however i could be completely wrong.

Ah! I do feed heavy but it's hard to compete with the macros in the sump. All I've found on the Tiles previously said is detritus and other stuff so I would have expected him to be roaming around the bottom and rocks like his little red cousin.

 

[ISpeakForTheSeas]

Tile/Marble Stars and the Red Starfish you have there are both Fromia species - biofilm feeders.

biofilms are typically a mix of bacteria, cyanobacteria, diatoms, microalgae, fungi, etc.

The star hanging out around the surface may be seeking higher oxygen levels - there's some evidence to support that different species need higher levels of oxygen than others (not terribly surprising), and some to suggest that certain kinds of bacteria may essentially smother starfish under the right (wrong) conditions.

The quotes below may help with care to at least some degree, but, unfortunately, I wouldn't expect either of your stars to last too long (most biofilm-feeding stars seem to last ~8-13 months):

Just keep everything stable, keep nutrients relatively low, keep the tank well oxygenated and watch for oxygen seeking behaviors such as climbing the sides of the tank and stretching one or more arms out to make contact with the air. If you see this behavior, try to increase oxygenation or kill some of the copiotrophic bacteria by adding a dose of Polyp Lab Medic. You will need to offer supplemental feedings. I'd try meaty seafoods first which can be fed in an isolation box if you have crabs or other hitchhikers that will get to the food before him. Keep a close eye on him and if he doesn't accept the first food you try, try another because the chances of him surviving past several months on only the biofilm in your tank are near 0.

Personally, I currently recommend against trying to keep a tropical, true starfish (Asteroid) species, particularly biofilm-feeding species, except for Aquilonastra stars.

That said, if you're really determined to try keeping them anyway, I'd strongly suggest setting up an Aquilonastra farm, a cryptic refugium to farm sponges, and possibly a colonial tunicate farm as well (all of these should be separate from the Linckia's tank so they can't get to the farm and ruin the "crop") - the Linckias feed on these (they presumably emulate biofilms to some degree), and the most successful Linckia keeping I've seen have always involved at least one of these aspects (typically the Aquilonastra stars).

With Aquilonastra stars alone, I've seen people keep them 2-3 years; with the cryptic refugium sponges involved too, the longest I've heard is ~4 years. Still not good by my calculations, but arguably acceptable if they really only live a decade.

For those who are truly determined to keep true starfish against my recommendation, here are some signs to watch for to help track starfish health:

One important thing to keep in mind with foods for these guys - just because they eat it, doesn't mean it's meeting their nutritional needs; it might be, but it might not be. With how long it seems to take these guys to starve, unless you're monitoring their health closely, you might not notice if it's not meeting their needs until it's too late.

Some ways to potentially gauge the health of the starfish that may be useful:
1 - Visual: is anything visually wrong with the specimen? (From what I know of starfish, these cues are generally pretty obvious if they're there at all - if the starfish is disintegrating, there's something wrong).
2 - Weight: is the specimen putting on or maintaining weight (generally healthy), or is it losing weight (under most circumstances, this would be unhealthy)?
3 - Size/Length: if it's not already full size, is the specimen growing? Is it shrinking (either from weight loss, disease, limb loss, etc.)?
4 - Reproduction: is the specimen engaging in reproductive behaviors/activities (i.e. courting, nesting, spawning, etc.)? (I recognize this one is not as common of an indicator in captive starfish at this point, but there are a few instances of starfish attempting to spawn in captivity).
5 - Longevity: is the specimen relatively close to meeting, actually meeting, or exceeding their expected wild lifespan (or at least surviving for a few years - healthy), or is the specimen dead/dying prior to doing so (unhealthy)?
6 - Speed: how quickly can the specimen right itself when it's flipped over?
7 - Level of activity: how much is the specimen moving around? (Generally speaking, low activity indicates poor health; moderate activity indicates good health; and high activity indicates good health but probable stress - it could be searching for food, oxygen, etc., but it's probably not in terrible health when moving a lot).
8 - Grip strength: does the specimen have a strong hold/grip with its tube feet? (A strong grip indicates good health, a weak grip indicates poor health).
9 - Willingness to eat: is the specimen eating? (Seems obvious, but can be really hard to tell with some stars - some stars leave little trails called feeding scars through the things they're eating; sometimes you can see their everted stomachs; other times, like if they're feeding on biofilm, you may not be able to tell at all - them crawling onto visible food is a good sign they're willing to eat, but - as mentioned above - the food may or may not meet their nutritional needs).

 

[Jesse Sunday]

Tile/Marble Stars and the Red Starfish you have there are both Fromia species - biofilm feeders.

The star hanging out around the surface may be seeking higher oxygen levels - there's some evidence to support that different species need higher levels of oxygen than others (not terribly surprising), and some to suggest that certain kinds of bacteria may essentially smother starfish under the right (wrong) conditions.

The quotes below may help with care to at least some degree, but, unfortunately, I wouldn't expect either of your stars to last too long (most biofilm-feeding stars seem to last ~8-13 months):

@ISpeakForTheSeas , I think I speak for everyone here when I say you are an amazing wealth of knowledge. I truly appreciate your time reading and responding.

I feel like you should have a "tip jar" link on your account.

Thank you. I'll do what I can to remedy my star's situation.

 

[ISpeakForTheSeas]

@ISpeakForTheSeas , I think I speak for everyone here when I say you are an amazing wealth of knowledge. I truly appreciate your time reading and responding.

I feel like you should have a "tip jar" link on your account.

Thank you. I'll do what I can to remedy my star's situation.

Haha, thank you - I just hope I can help.

Good luck with your stars!