Does this sound like flukes?

[tyler1503]

Hey guys. My toadfish has gone downhill fast. Last night I noticed a slight tear on his caudal fin and didn't put any thought into it. Today he has cloudy eyes, pale in colour, long lethargic periods where he just get carried around by the current interrupted by very short bursts of energy. He's off his food. His fins are all torn up and raggedy and he doesn't look like he'll make it till tomorrow. Is there absolutely anything I can do to try to save him? In a desperate attempt to save him I gave him a 4-5 minute freshwater dip which he did NOT like.
I remember reading that these are all symptoms of flukes. I've never faced flukes before and don't know much about it.
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

 

[P3FE]

If it's flukes do a fresh water bath for at least 15 minutes, I know is hard to see the fish struggling but he will eventually calm down and will thank you for it. It helps if you can match the PH and Temp of your water in the fresh water bath and do it every three days. If that doesn't work you can move on to do Praziquantel baths also every three days. Last resort you can do Paraguard baths. Good luck!

 

[Reef Fever]

sounds like benedenia to me (flukes). I work for a public aquarium and we've encountered it numerous times in the QT process. As stated a freshwater dip will be your best friend. if there is benedenia present you will literally see them falling off the fish, its quite amazing to see if there is an abundance. the problem you will encounter is this..while the dip will provide the fish with relief, more than likely it will be temporary as the benedenia will be present within your system. if you have the ability to do so, praziqauntel will eliminate the benedenia but not in the egg form. if you dose it in your display keep in mind it will kill most, i not all worms. Some say prazi is reef safe but i have no first hand experience with it in reef aquaria, only QT tanks

 

[Humblefish]

The 4-5 min FW dip that you already gave him was sufficient to determine flukes. You should have noticed tiny white worms fall out of him, especially out of his gills. I like to do a FW dip in a black bucket, because it's easier to see the white flukes against the darkness once they settle to the bottom.

 

[tyler1503]

Thanks everyone!
How long should I wait to freshwater dip him again? It was mentioned before to wait three days after a 15 minute dip. I assume I should still give him three days after a five minute dip too?
I'll try the black bucket idea, I have some old RSCP buckets laying around I can put to good use.
I didn't notice any parasites falling off him, but that doesn't mean it didn't happen. I think I was stressing a bit too much at the time.
At this point everything seems to suggest flukes, but I haven't added anything new to the tank in quite a while except a piece of rock from my established and stocked 24. I've never had disease in the 24 so I assume it hasn't come from there. The fish has been with me for a couple of months and seemed happy and healthy so I don't know where it could have come from.
Can flukes lay dormant for a couple of months before infecting fish?

 

[Humblefish]

A 15 min dip is not required and might even kill the fish; at around the 2-3 min mark you should see flukes falling off if he has them. You will then know you need to treat your entire tank with Prazipro. To my knowledge, flukes do not lay dormant... but I do not believe they have been studied thoroughly enough to say that definitively.

 

[tyler1503]

The fish didn't make it Poor little guy.
If dips should be done every three days or so and this otherwise healthy fish wasn't noticeably sick till last night, what's the chance it was not flukes at all? Overnight death compared to three days between treatments is a huge difference.

 

[Humblefish]

Sorry for your loss. I kinda doubt it was flukes, as the FW dip you performed should have (temporarily) cleared him of flukes and bought you more time.

 

[tyler1503]

Sorry for your loss. I kinda doubt it was flukes, as the FW dip you performed should have (temporarily) cleared him of flukes and bought you more time.

Thank you.
I'm now doubting flukes too. All the signs were there (I didn't see the parasites falling off him, but that doesn't mean they didn't) but it was so sudden. An otherwise healthy fish should have lasted longer from what I've learnt.
I also have a tiny goby in the tank and I can't easily find him on a normal day, so now that there may be disease in the tank, I doubt I'll find him at all. Which means I don't know if he's healthy, affected or already dead. And because of that, I don't know how long to leave the tank fallow for.
I wanted to move other livestock from my 24 to this tank on the weekend. That's not gona happen.
This is why I wanted a UV steriliser lol.

 

[tyler1503]

Got some pics of the affected toadfish.
Full body shot:

Close up of what almost looks like a burn mark:

Pic of his tail, it looks like something's been eating him. Possibly from some shrimp I have in between the time he died and the time I found him. Figured it might be helpful anyway:

Any other possibilities besides flukes?
The only pic I grabbed before I lost him. This is during the freshwater dip.

 

[tyler1503]

I also have a tiny goby in the tank and I can't easily find him on a normal day, so now that there may be disease in the tank, I doubt I'll find him at all. Which means I don't know if he's healthy, affected or already dead. And because of that, I don't know how long to leave the tank fallow for.

Got some pics of the affected toadfish.
Any other possibilities besides flukes?

Bump.
Any advice regarding these two issue would be much appreciated! Thanks in advance.

 

[Humblefish]

Unfortunately, I'm not familiar enough with toadfish to know my way around their anatomy. Was the brown spot and tail "chewed off" there before he died?

 

[P3FE]

It looks like you have a disease in your tank. Unfortunately most of the diseases we encounter in our hobby exhibit the same signs,for example, lack of eating, grazing rocks, breathing rapidly, ect. and sometimes they are hard to identify unless they are obvious in the fish, like ich. Even marine velvet sometimes is hard to identify until it has wipe out most of your fish. Like it was stated before flukes would had jump out of the fish as soon as you freshwater dip and you would have notice the parasite. My recommendation, which is what I would do if it happen to me, is to set up a quarantine tank, get all the remaining fish in your tank and quarantine them for at least 30 days, and leave the DT fallow for at least 60 days. It sounds like a long time, but that will be enough time for any parasite in your tank to go thru their cycle and die, no fish no host for them to thrive. Good luck! and I hope everything goes well for the rest of your fish.

 

[tyler1503]

Unfortunately, I'm not familiar enough with toadfish to know my way around their anatomy. Was the brown spot and tail "chewed off" there before he died?

Toadfish are a type of puffer if that helps. I'll try to remember a scientific name, but at the moment I can't. Neither the tail scars or the brown spot were there before he died. It's possible they did develop in between me seeing him last and him dying, but I believe they happened after he died. The brown spot is almost the same colour as his natural colour was before going pale.

It looks like you have a disease in your tank. Unfortunately most of the diseases we encounter in our hobby exhibit the same signs,for example, lack of eating, grazing rocks, breathing rapidly, ect. and sometimes they are hard to identify unless they are obvious in the fish, like ich. Even marine velvet sometimes is hard to identify until it has wipe out most of your fish. Like it was stated before flukes would had jump out of the fish as soon as you freshwater dip and you would have notice the parasite. My recommendation, which is what I would do if it happen to me, is to set up a quarantine tank, get all the remaining fish in your tank and quarantine them for at least 30 days, and leave the DT fallow for at least 60 days. It sounds like a long time, but that will be enough time for any parasite in your tank to go thru their cycle and die, no fish no host for them to thrive. Good luck! and I hope everything goes well for the rest of your fish.

That is the ideal scenario, but the problem is, the tank I was going to use as a QT/hospital tank is the established 24 gal I already have livestock in. I've had these fish for up to a couple years so I know they're healthy, so I was just going to add them to the 120 (the tank that contained the diseased toadfish) and then use the 24 as a QT. Now that the 120 has disease I can't move on the 24 gals occupants over so I have no QT.
Sucky situation.
The only other tank I have laying around is a 3 gallon and I have large predator fish that won't work in there even for the time being.
Geez I need to figure something out! Maybe 5 gallon buckets for each individual fish?
Thanks for the advice everyone. I'll be sure to keep in mind what you all have been saying.

 

[P3FE]

You can get a 20 gallon gallon or a 40 gallon from Craig list cheap, even pets mart will sell you a 40 gallon for under 100 dollars this days! That's all you need! Tank, hang on the back filter, thermometer,,and some pvc pipe. Don't risk your other fish.

 

[tyler1503]

You can get a 20 gallon gallon or a 40 gallon from Craig list cheap, even pets mart will sell you a 40 gallon for under 100 dollars this days! That's all you need! Tank, hang on the back filter, thermometer,,and some pvc pipe. Don't risk your other fish.

Living in Australia I don't really have access to second hand tanks. The hobby just isn't a big thing over here unfortunately. Pretty much every tank for sale is either a 5 gal or smaller designed for beta or goldfish or they're complete set ups that people want several thousand dollars for. It's near impossible to find a useful sized tank for a decent price. At least in my area and brand new will run me several hundred dollars. All I can think of at the moment is to use 5 gallon buckets, or use the empty turtle tank which I don't want to do.
I won't add my other fish to the infected tank. One is my prized Valentini who's become part of the family now, there's no way I'll risk him!
I've got everything I need for QT, except the tank. I've got some brainstorming to do!

 

[tyler1503]

Unfortunately, I'm not familiar enough with toadfish to know my way around their anatomy. Was the brown spot and tail "chewed off" there before he died?

Toadfish are a type of puffer if that helps. I'll try to remember a scientific name, but at the moment I can't.

Tetractenos glaber is the scientific name.
Hopefully I can narrow down what this disease is/was so I can figure out a treatment.

 

[Humblefish]

I'm gonna be honest with you... you're never gonna know exactly what killed your fish. There are the obvious diseases such as ich, velvet, flukes, bacterial infections, etc. However, there are also a plethora of saltwater fish diseases that are either unknown or haven't been documented. Not even by the marine biology community.