Netpune DOS known problems Coral loss

BNUTTHEHUT · Jul 2, 2015

I recently discovered that my coral loss was cause by a faulty neptune DOS. After some research I discovered that the problem is a known issue and they even created a link to get a replacement roller that I found from another user on reer2reef.
https://www.neptunesystems.com/dos-roller-assembly-replacement-program/
My issue is, there is no information about this on there website, facebook or any other media outlet they use. Fusion showed the correct level was being dosed, it wasn't until I checked the levels in the container that I figured out the problem. They made no attempt to contact any customers knowing how detrimental a bad unit can be for a reef tank.
I had some substantial losses and I believe they should be accountable for it!
My question is, Do you believe your faulty Neptune DOS caused coral, fish or invertebrate death in you aquarium?
If there is enough of us I would like to take some legal action against them, if anyone else is willing.
The link above is for units with a serial number below 5000. That means that 5000 units are/were presumed bad. If every person suffered $100 in damages thats $500,000. I know I lost about $2000. These units are not cheap and should have been fully tested before they were sold. To many manufactures are selling new products with known issues( DOS, GYRE, AI, Deepwater pumps) The list goes on and on.
I think that customers deserve better products with better testing and more manufacture accountability. I hope some of you agree.

zesty · Jul 2, 2015

So, I said to myself. If I were a user that was having problems, I'm going to go to their website. Ok, I'm having problems, where do I go? Support, I'm a web forum guy so I go to the forums, but I figured I'd look around and see if I could find a link. I click on a couple support links and they were the same ones as before. Ok, to the forums on neptune aquatic's website. I check out announcements, nothing. Then, I saw that there was a sub forum for the DOS & DDR dosing, that's a good place to start. I saw this sticky that was posted about 2 months ago.

I'm thinking, they announced it, ok... 2 months ok, that's pretty decent. Then as I'm typing this up, I look again and what do I see.

They made a sticky even 2 months before that with the possibility of an issue and contact customer support if you feel you have an issue.

I stopped looking after that. IMO, you're not buying a stapler here, you're buying a specific piece of equipment (first gen -early adopter stage) that is new to the market. This piece of equipment also falls into a back n forth situation, it's going to need your interaction for it to function and at least fill it back up. If you take that fusion value and believe it without actually checking to see if your products working the way it should have been, how do you know it ever worked properly? How do you know that it didn't get damaged in shipping? These are all valid questions and I don't know, it could be exactly the problem stated above. How do you know that it's not an ancillary issue?

It sounds like you're upset because you lost a lot of corals. Anyone would be. Do I think it's 100% Neptune's fault or 100% your fault, no. Do I believe you should have been watching that new piece of equipment to make sure it was functioning as it should? Yes.
If Neptune announced it on FB, reef2reef, etc they would have to follow up and control all of those situations. I know there has been a lot of this discussion come up in the past. I could see that if Neptune put a link on their front page, you may have found the information earlier, I don't know.

Bottom line, I'm sorry you lost the corals and you got a bad unit. Sounds like they will make it right with their unit.
I personally think it's a gross overreaction to try and get a class action suit going.

BNUTTHEHUT · Jul 2, 2015

You said it yourself," if I was having problems". I wasn't having problems. The unit worked fine for 6months then the other day The unit didnt work for what looks like 3 days and my alk dropped to 4 and things died. Thats a serious issue, that people should be aware of.
Just so I understand. I should have to go to the manufactures website community forums every day to see if there is a problem with a given product that I purchased. Thats ridiculous. People dont go to there site every day only when there is a problem. If they would have put it on facebook or listed it on other websites or forums where people purchase the product or frequent, I would have gotten an alert, fixed the problem and it would have never happened.
If I buy a car should I call the dealership everyday to see if there is a recall. NO

BNUTTHEHUT · Jul 2, 2015

How is it a Gross Overreaction? Alk swings destroy tanks. I said if there is enough people. In your opinion how many people are justified in order to start a class action suit? 1 , 50 , 1000. Its possibly 5000 units. Thats 5000 reef tanks that people spent years caring for. I would think 1 would be enough but I guess I overreact.

acolotto · Jul 2, 2015

You can never blame equipment if your not checking it daily. I get you say it was working and then it stopped for 3 days, check your equipment everyday. Thats your fault for not keeping an eye on it, things go out all the time in this hobby. Thats like getting mad an ATO because you didnt realize your ATO container was empty for 3 days and had a salinty swing, pay more attention next time. Not trying to be rude, just the cold hard truth. You should have noticed that your container has been at the same level over 3 days, it sucks and im sorry it happened but in this hobby you have to observe and check on your livestock and equipment daily or you are doing a disservice to yourself

hart24601 · Jul 2, 2015

Been using mine for AWC without missing a beat. It's not under 5k serial number though. I am sorry for the losses.

BNUTTHEHUT · Jul 2, 2015

acolotto said:
You can never blame equipment if your not checking it daily. I get you say it was working and then it stopped for 3 days, check your equipment everyday. Thats your fault for not keeping an eye on it, things go out all the time in this hobby. Thats like getting mad an ATO because you didnt realize your ATO container was empty for 3 days and had a salinty swing, pay more attention next time. Not trying to be rude, just the cold hard truth. You should have noticed that your container has been at the same level over 3 days, it sucks and im sorry it happened but in this hobby you have to observe and check on your livestock and equipment daily or you are doing a disservice to yourself

I did check it every day via Apex Fusion. According to Fusion it was pumping the correct amount and DDR showed it had the correct level. Apex Fusion showed and still shows it was pumping when it was not. Someone should not have to check every single piece of equipment and test everything every single day. Thats why we buy fancy equipment.

gcarroll · Jul 2, 2015

BNUTTHEHUT said:
I recently discovered that my coral loss was cause by a faulty neptune DOS. After some research I discovered that the problem is a known issue and they even created a link to get a replacement roller that I found from another user on reer2reef.
https://www.neptunesystems.com/dos-roller-assembly-replacement-program/
My issue is, there is no information about this on there website, facebook or any other media outlet they use. Fusion showed the correct level was being dosed, it wasn't until I checked the levels in the container that I figured out the problem. They made no attempt to contact any customers knowing how detrimental a bad unit can be for a reef tank.
I had some substantial losses and I believe they should be accountable for it!
My question is, Do you believe your faulty Neptune DOS caused coral, fish or invertebrate death in you aquarium?
If there is enough of us I would like to take some legal action against them, if anyone else is willing.
The link above is for units with a serial number below 5000. That means that 5000 units are/were presumed bad. If every person suffered $100 in damages thats $500,000. I know I lost about $2000. These units are not cheap and should have been fully tested before they were sold. To many manufactures are selling new products with known issues( DOS, GYRE, AI, Deepwater pumps) The list goes on and on.
I think that customers deserve better products with better testing and more manufacture accountability. I hope some of you agree.

I have to ask....... Have you even once tried contacting Neptune regarding this issue and a possible resolution?

Keep in mind, I'm not saying that you deserve anything more than fixing the unit if it is still under warranty. Electronic measuring devices fail. That is a fact in the hobby. pH probes are not guaranteed accurate and we don't sue the companies. It's all hazards of the hobby. In this hobby we have a habit of blaming others when we lose our animals. In the end we chose to put those animals in a box, we chose the products that would support our animals, so we are to blame. We do our best but sometimes our best is not good enough. I hope you have the intestinal fortitude to rebuild!

BNUTTHEHUT · Jul 2, 2015

gcarroll said:
I have to ask....... Have you even once tried contacting Neptune regarding this issue and a possible resolution?

Keep in mind, I'm not saying that you deserve anything more than fixing the unit if it is still under warranty. Electronic measuring devices fail. That is a fact in the hobby. pH probes are not guaranteed accurate and we don't sue the companies. It's all hazards of the hobby. In this hobby we have a habit of blaming others when we lose our animals. In the end we chose to put those animals in a box, we chose the products that would support our animals, so we are to blame. We do our best but sometimes our best is not good enough. I hope you have the intestinal fortitude to rebuild!

Yes, I have called, emailed and have a support ticket. They are "working on it". First they tried to say I had the reservoir above the DOS. (I dont) Second I programed it wrong. ( Nope) Third I am not using the correct update. ( Still no Just updated it a few weeks ago 4.34_4F15) Now I just waiting. I am just curious how many others its happened to. Thats all. If it was on a more visited social media site like facebook I feel that this would have never happened.

gcarroll · Jul 2, 2015

BNUTTHEHUT said:
Yes, I have called, emailed and have a support ticket. They are "working on it". First they tried to say I had the reservoir above the DOS. (I dont) Second I programed it wrong. ( Nope) Third I am not using the correct update. ( Still no Just updated it a few weeks ago 4.34_4F15) Now I just waiting. I am just curious how many others its happened to. Thats all. If it was on a more visited social media site like facebook I feel that this would have never happened.

Maybe for you but then the person not on FaceBook (yes, like me there are people that don't get there news on facebook) would still be in the same position. Then who is to blame? Me for not being on facebook?

What is the known problem with the GYRE, AI, and Deepwater pumps. To give you an idea, although you are aware I am not. Probably because we do not roam in the same circles.

BNUTTHEHUT · Jul 2, 2015

GYRE- The first units we made with a cheap cord and it can break down in your tank and crack where it connects to the motor housing.
AI director can loose conductivity and changet your setting and fry your corals. Ie s settings get changed from 10 to 100.
Deepwater pumps have faulty impellers that will rust and blink at the fifth light stating a blockage. Then the pump stops working.
You bring up a good point about circles. I didn't personally know anyone that had a problem with DOS. But when I texted three friends and they checked there serial numbers they fell into the range and are currently filling out the form for new pump rollers for the DOS.

hart24601 · Jul 2, 2015

Just for the record I bought a 1st run gyre and it has been nothing but great. I also have a director and it has worked great since day 1 and as I also said I have a DOS and it has been working well too.

FWIW I do think neptune should have tried harder to let owners know about the early DOS roller failures since a dosing pump can wreck a tank fast.

Necro · Jul 2, 2015

I'm a long time lurker on here. I had an issue with mine but thank goodness I didn't have anyproblems. I was just using mine to dose aminos. I only found out about the rollers when I called Neptune.

hatfielj · Jul 2, 2015

This sort of thing can happen with any sort of equipment. I currently use a bubble magus and the pump that delivers my Ca solution stopped working properly awhile back and I didn't realize until my Ca levels had dropped into the low 300s! I lost some corals too. I can't blame anyone but myself for not having checked my equipment and levels more regularly. Sucks it happened to you, but I don't think you can blame Neptune too much for it.
For what its worth, I am switching to the DOS from Neptune as soon as I get a chance to install it (already have a unit sitting next to my tank waiting

)

acolotto · Jul 2, 2015

BNUTTHEHUT said:
I did check it every day via Apex Fusion. According to Fusion it was pumping the correct amount and DDR showed it had the correct level. Apex Fusion showed and still shows it was pumping when it was not. Someone should not have to check every single piece of equipment and test everything every single day. Thats why we buy fancy equipment.

Its part of the hobby to observe your tank everyday. Every book, website, major reefer will tell you to give a glance over everything everyday. Doing this doesnt fix the problem, and I AGREE that is is ridiculous we have to check and worry about these fancy "high-end" pieces of equipment but we do. And checking on them, and actually looking at them, not if the computer tell me its ok, you will save 100s of headaches. If you spend 5 mins everyday to check out our livestock and equipment. You will notice based on sound and look of things if somethings wrong. I have a tunze comline 9012 skimmer that for some reason stops working every so often. Apex doesnt know it stops cause its still plugged in and powered just the pump gets stuck. But because i check everyday, its never an issue longer then a couple hrs or a work day. I can instantly tell while im home if my skimmer stops based on noise. I can tell if my ATO isnt working based on noise. I can tell if my ato container is empty because i can tell by the noise in the sump that the water level is lower (splashing water gets louder). I can tell from looking at the water surface if my GYRE needs a cleaning or not. This hobby is 100% observation based, no product in the industry will replace this because at the end of the day they are just machines that we control.

BNUTTHEHUT · Jul 2, 2015

acolotto said:
Its part of the hobby to observe your tank everyday. Every book, website, major reefer will tell you to give a glance over everything everyday. Doing this doesnt fix the problem, and I AGREE that is is ridiculous we have to check and worry about these fancy "high-end" pieces of equipment but we do. And checking on them, and actually looking at them, not if the computer tell me its ok, you will save 100s of headaches. If you spend 5 mins everyday to check out our livestock and equipment. You will notice based on sound and look of things if somethings wrong. I have a tunze comline 9012 skimmer that for some reason stops working every so often. Apex doesnt know it stops cause its still plugged in and powered just the pump gets stuck. But because i check everyday, its never an issue longer then a couple hrs or a work day. I can instantly tell while im home if my skimmer stops based on noise. I can tell if my ATO isnt working based on noise. I can tell if my ato container is empty because i can tell by the noise in the sump that the water level is lower (splashing water gets louder). I can tell from looking at the water surface if my GYRE needs a cleaning or not. This hobby is 100% observation based, no product in the industry will replace this because at the end of the day they are just machines that we control.

Im not going to argue with you. You comment is just silly. You cant compare a doser to an ATO the will pump 5 gallons a day, or a dirty pump that you see. Its a doser that doses ml. Do you measure yours with a ruler every day to make sure its going down?

BNUTTHEHUT · Jul 2, 2015

hatfielj said:
This sort of thing can happen with any sort of equipment. I currently use a bubble magus and the pump that delivers my Ca solution stopped working properly awhile back and I didn't realize until my Ca levels had dropped into the low 300s! I lost some corals too. I can't blame anyone but myself for not having checked my equipment and levels more regularly. Sucks it happened to you, but I don't think you can blame Neptune too much for it.
For what its worth, I am switching to the DOS from Neptune as soon as I get a chance to install it (already have a unit sitting next to my tank waiting)

Did bubble magnus have a known issue with a bad pump head that you weren't unaware of? If you found out that yours and 4999 other peoples bubble magnus had similar problems and the company didn't let people know do you think you would feel differently? After Neptune knew about the problem how many units under serial number 5000 were still sold to people without them knowing? Most companies even have a product registration card for this exact reason.

acolotto · Jul 2, 2015

well im not the one with dead corals and in my 6 yrs never had a piece of equiment cause any problems. Stop blaming products for your short comings. Also ALK going down to 4 how do you not notice your coral looking like crap? Seriously man this was all avoidable, but instead you go into forum and blame the company because you are not competent enough to understand things break and need to be watched. Tunze knowing sells all there skimmers with bad propeller, they dont send it out with another one, they will if you call and ask why isn't working and its not posted anywhere that you have to call and ask for another propeller. IT YOUR FAULT no one elses. Every company in the world sells stuff with defects especially when its the 1st yr to hit retail, its your job as a consumer to observe your products. They are there to sell product and nothing else, they dont care about your tank, they dont care about you its that simple. They want to make money and that's it.

BNUTTHEHUT · Jul 2, 2015

acolotto said:
well im not the one with dead corals and in my 6 yrs never had a piece of equiment cause any problems. Stop blaming products for your short comings. Also ALK going down to 4 how do you not notice your coral looking like crap? Seriously man this was all avoidable, but instead you go into forum and blame the company because you are not competent enough to understand things break and need to be watched. Tunze knowing sells all there skimmers with bad propeller, they dont send it out with another one, they will if you call and ask why isn't working and its not posted anywhere that you have to call and ask for another propeller. IT YOUR FAULT no one elses. Every company in the world sells stuff with defects especially when its the 1st yr to hit retail, its your job as a consumer to observe your products. They are there to sell product and nothing else, they dont care about your tank, they dont care about you its that simple. They want to make money and that's it.

I noticed it on the third day when entire colonies were white. They didnt start to look bad. They just died. The unit back siphoned soda ash for 2 days im guessing by the excess in the container. Please cast you vote and move on.

acolotto · Jul 2, 2015

also to answer your question about how many units did Neptune sell that were in the defective serial # range, answer is 100% beacause if they didnt the lose would be too large for them to take on. Its easier for them to sell a defective item, and just replace the broken part when they get support ticket. This way they don't have to replace casings, packaging, and man hrs replacing broken parts. Plus more then likely all those units were sold to suppliers before they even knew it was an issue.