Most of us believe that quarantining your fish is the best approach to avoid diseases wiping out our entire tank. I think most will agree on that. But ... does it also safe more fish lives overall?
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What do you suspect causes the high mortality rate from the 3 problem regions even after quarantine? Do you think they still use cyanide?I'm 100% pro quarantine.
What most folks don't realize is that the mortality rate for 45 days post-import wild caught marine fish runs from 6 to around 60%, even with a proactive quarantine. The low end is seen from fish from better quality regions; E. Africa, Florida, Hawaii, West Pacific (and captive raised of course!), with the highest rates seen are from the Philippines, Indonesia and Vietnam. The absolute worst fish are what are termed "grade B, SE Asian". These are small, cheap fish, shipped in a tight pack from the three problem regions. I see these in LFS all the time and it makes me cringe: tiny green chromis, skinny Centropyge angels, 1" hepatus tangs, etc. If you DON'T quarantine those fish, not only do you see the mortality in those fish themselves, but they can carry over disease to your main fish collection. Buying the wrong fish and not quarantining them is almost certain disaster. To be blunt, IMO, things now are actually worse than they were in the heyday of cyanide collection the 1970's, a time that almost drove the marine fish hobby into obscurity....I think the only thing keeping the marine hobby going right now is the improvements made in keeping corals, fish are certainly still a huge problem!
Buy the right fish, quarantine them properly, and be proactive about their health!
Jay
How did you feed the copper banded while it was in QT?Pro Quarantine here! I’ve put through 3 Blue STAR LEOPARD Wrasses, Copperband Butterfly Fish, Yellow Tang, Flame Angel & Bimaculatus Anthias. These are all considered difficult some expert only fish. I used copper & prazipro sometimes general cure and metroplex when needed.
On the more sensitive fish, the CopperBand Butterfly fish and Leopard Wrasses I used the Black Molly freshwater to saltwater approach. I’m only 2 years into the hobby but knock on wood so far NO FISH CASUALTIES!!
I started with live clams in the entire shell and live brine shrimp. He pretty much went for both of those within 2 days. I also started a white worm culture 3 months prior to getting the Copperband butterfly. He ate those like hot cakes. I still feed them to him today in main DT and swear by them being the secret to healthy CBB.How did you feed the copper banded while it was in QT?
@Jay Hemdal This is very interesting and not something I heard before. Is there are way to avoid the sources with poor records and avoid the poor distribution channels? Like, "grade B, SE Asian", is that lingo that fish shops know about and we can ask them? I haven't heard that before, but I would certainly like to read up on these things if there is a resource somewhere.I'm 100% pro quarantine.
What most folks don't realize is that the mortality rate for 45 days post-import wild caught marine fish runs from 6 to around 60%, even with a proactive quarantine. The low end is seen from fish from better quality regions; E. Africa, Florida, Hawaii, West Pacific (and captive raised of course!), with the highest rates seen are from the Philippines, Indonesia and Vietnam. The absolute worst fish are what are termed "grade B, SE Asian". These are small, cheap fish, shipped in a tight pack from the three problem regions. I see these in LFS all the time and it makes me cringe: tiny green chromis, skinny Centropyge angels, 1" hepatus tangs, etc. If you DON'T quarantine those fish, not only do you see the mortality in those fish themselves, but they can carry over disease to your main fish collection. Buying the wrong fish and not quarantining them is almost certain disaster. To be blunt, IMO, things now are actually worse than they were in the heyday of cyanide collection the 1970's, a time that almost drove the marine fish hobby into obscurity....I think the only thing keeping the marine hobby going right now is the improvements made in keeping corals, fish are certainly still a huge problem!
Buy the right fish, quarantine them properly, and be proactive about their health!
Jay
Yes, I would love to know more about this!What do you suspect causes the high mortality rate from the 3 problem regions even after quarantine? Do you think they still use cyanide?
It's tough - the fish sometimes go through multiple channels, so the end purchaser does not know the true origin. Short supply chain fish are always best - captive raised to you, collector to you, etc. Buying fish that are endemic to the better regions helps - yellow tangs (were) from Hawaii for example.@Jay Hemdal This is very interesting and not something I heard before. Is there are way to avoid the sources with poor records and avoid the poor distribution channels? Like, "grade B, SE Asian", is that lingo that fish shops know about and we can ask them? I haven't heard that before, but I would certainly like to read up on these things if there is a resource somewhere.
Yes, I strongly suspect cyanide use is still rampant. Another issue is the tight pack they use from those regions, and how long it takes the fish to get from the collecting area to the exporters - they live in plastic bags much of that time.What do you suspect causes the high mortality rate from the 3 problem regions even after quarantine? Do you think they still use cyanide?
Wow, I am shocked to hear that!Yes, I strongly suspect cyanide use is still rampant. Another issue is the tight pack they use from those regions, and how long it takes the fish to get from the collecting area to the exporters - they live in plastic bags much of that time.
Think about it - a diver might earn 10 cents for catching a green chromis. If he chases that fish for 5 minutes, it isn't worth it. They need to spread cyanide and swipe up a dozen or so at a time. Net caught black axil chromis from Fiji cost about 10x that of the same size green chromis from Indonesia.
Jay
Most of us believe that quarantining your fish is the best approach to avoid diseases wiping out our entire tank. I think most will agree on that. But ... does it also safe more fish lives overall?
QT is important. The biggest issue with it is knowing how to do it correctly. It takes a lot of knowledge to do it correctly. Other than doing it perfectly it is a waste of time and will kill more fish IMHO. I prefer to run an observation tank. Put the fish in a small tank and watch it closely for a couple of months. This gets the fish used to you and an opportunity to get it feeding on prepared foods. If the fish is sick, you would then have a chance to try to save it. I do not believe in proactively treating fish that may or may not be sick by noobs like me unless you have someone there who knows what they are doing and is willing to teach you.
I agree with QTing. Start off with observation. Once you get a sick fish and know what it causing the issue, you can try to save it. Odds are it will die. Don't just dump and pray and don't try to be proactive with meds and copper if you don't know exactly what you are doing. There are few people that know what they are doing. I am not even able to tell if a fish is sick or acting strange. When I upgrade this summer I will be able to get some new fish. They will go into an observation tank. I will be posting pics and asking questions to make sure the fish is healthy before I put them in the DT. I will try to medicate a fish if needed. My plan is to learn how to spot issues early and learn how to fix them if possible. Learning to QT is long and complicated. If you don't o it right, you are killing the fish, and you aren't doing anything other than spending money on nothing. If I lived somewhere with other reefers who knew how to QT, I would have them help me and I would have started QTing from the start. I would love to be able to facetime someone who knew what they were doing and were willing to teach me. Alas, that is not the case, and if you don't do it correctly, you aren't doing anything.I agree that observation is a minimum. And avoid sensitive fish to things like ich if your new, like tangs. Problem is that if you don't learn how to properly qt, you're doomed---eventually--if want to add fish once in a while.... The vast majority of persons i've spoken too and that stay in this hobby long run all have stories (of mass death)... and now they qt...