Bio pellets

[Gwitness]

Can you run his pellets without running an ULNS?? I'm just confused how it works and kinda nervous to get into it... Can you run it with a refugium also?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Sure. Just don't use very many.

It is a bit harder to control the "dose" than with liquid additions such as vinegar or vodka, but it can be done.

I dose vinegar and am no where near ULNS and I grow macroalgae as well. The organic carbon is just a part of the nutrient export methodology I use, not the only one.

 

[Gwitness]

So I might as well just dose vinegar then like you do since I'm not really trying to keep an ULNS... And it will be easier to control. Do you dose once daily or how do you do it?

 

[Gwitness]

I'm assuming it will help with my cyano issue and extra nutrients I have in the tank

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I can't be sure it will help with cyano, but it might. Depends on whether the cyano consume the added organic or not.
That can happen both with pellets or viengar.

i dose vinegar 10 x per day during the light cycle using a BRS 1.1 mL per min doser on a timer.

 

[Gwitness]

Okay good to know... What if I don't have a doser? Can I just manually dose once a day or should I just out bio pellets in my two little fishy reactor that I don't use?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

IMO, the best way to dose once a day is to add calcium hydroxide (kalkwasser mix) to it until no more dissolves, then dose the liquid.

That mix won't drop pH. I did that for many months before I got a doser.

 

[Gwitness]

Really.!! ... Well I dose kalk to its Max capacity right now through my ato..... Not using vinegar yet.... So you are saying you would mix the vinegar in with each batch of kalk that I mix up for my ato reservoir?

 

[ingtar_shinowa]

I run ecobak pellets and do not run an ULNS.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Really.!! ... Well I dose kalk to its Max capacity right now through my ato..... Not using vinegar yet.... So you are saying you would mix the vinegar in with each batch of kalk that I mix up for my ato reservoir?

Not exactly, but you could do that.

It's the reverse. Take the gallon of vinegar, add a cup or two of calcium hydroxide, shake, and then it is good for once a day dosing. It adds some calcium and alkalinity, and does not drop the pH when added (actually boosts it a very small amount).

 

[fishroomlady]

IMO, the best way to dose once a day is to add calcium hydroxide (kalkwasser mix) to it until no more dissolves, then dose the liquid.

That mix won't drop pH. I did that for many months before I got a doser.

randy, could you please explain this statement in a little more detail....I'm not sure why but I don't quite get it. you add kalkwasser mix directly to the vinegar? if the kalk is mixed, I don't get how you tell that no more dissolves??

 

[fishroomlady]

Not exactly, but you could do that.

It's the reverse. Take the gallon of vinegar, add a cup or two of calcium hydroxide, shake, and then it is good for once a day dosing. It adds some calcium and alkalinity, and does not drop the pH when added (actually boosts it a very small amount).

do you then dose this mixture using the vinegar recommended amount?

 

[redfishbluefish]

I can't be sure it will help with cyano, but it might. Depends on whether the cyano consume the added organic or not.
That can happen both with pellets or viengar.

i dose vinegar 10 x per day during the light cycle using a BRS 1.1 mL per min doser on a timer.

Did you mean to say vodka and vinegar???


I'm curious how biopellets would "feed" cyano when the pellets are confined to a reactor. Biopellets do not provide a carbon source to your entire tank...it's confined. It's not like vodka or vinegar, where you are feeding any and all bacteria within your entire tank.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

randy, could you please explain this statement in a little more detail....I'm not sure why but I don't quite get it. you add kalkwasser mix directly to the vinegar? if the kalk is mixed, I don't get how you tell that no more dissolves??

Sure, I just keep pouring in more solids until there is a bunch sitting on the bottom even after shaking. Looks like a significant layer of white mud on the bottom. More than just the small amount of impurities that might be in the solid calcium hydroxide.

pH can also be used. If it is above 11, you are good to go. Saturation is above 12, but we just want to stop bacterial growth that might happen at more neutral pH, and to stop the pH drop that comes with all at once dosing of normal vinegar.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Did you mean to say vodka and vinegar???


I'm curious how biopellets would "feed" cyano when the pellets are confined to a reactor. Biopellets do not provide a carbon source to your entire tank...it's confined. It's not like vodka or vinegar, where you are feeding any and all bacteria within your entire tank.

Vodka applies too, but I meant vinegar or biopellets. The pellets are confined, but the monomers that are released aren't.

Cyano is not that common with pellets, and that may be an advantage of pellets that more of the organic is consumed in the reactor, but some people have gotten a burst of cyano when first starting pellets, and it is a mistake to say that organics cannot get out of it.

The bacteria hydrolyze the polymer into monomers. The enzymes that accelerate this process are extracellular. Many of the released monomers may be taken up by bacteria coating the pellets, but some will diffuse out.

perhaps the initial burst comes before there is a good overlayer of bacteria waiting to take up the monomers, and more get free in the early stages of biopellet use.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

FWIW, here's an article describing some of these processes. It discusses intracellular degradation of PHB (which is by the same bacterium that made it initially for energy storage) and extracellular by other bacteria after it died and released it. Presumably, the latter is the only one involved when bacteria consume a biopellet in a reef tank.

The ?Intracellular? Poly(3-Hydroxybutyrate) (PHB) Depolymerase of Rhodospirillum rubrum Is a Periplasm-Located Protein with Specificity for Native PHB and with Structural Similarity to Extracellular PHB Depolymerases

 

[Gwitness]

Not exactly, but you could do that.

It's the reverse. Take the gallon of vinegar, add a cup or two of calcium hydroxide, shake, and then it is good for once a day dosing. It adds some calcium and alkalinity, and does not drop the pH when added (actually boosts it a very small amount).

This makes sense..... So since it's going in with vinegar I need to do 3 teaspoons per gallon to get to max capacity for kalk?? How do I know how much to dose per day of this vinegar and kalk mix?