I really need your help with my tank water chemistry and nutrients

[dawidmns]

Hi



I really need your help, I have been fighting with it for a long time with no success. I thought things will improve since I started dosing Oceamo Regulator O and A to increase the trace elements etc. Few things improved but still a lot in red.



The issues started when I used to dose Aquaforest 1,2 and 3, something went wrong, maybe got a bad batch, and I started loosing my SPS and LPS. Finally did ICP and everything was in red.



Before I did ICP I blamed PO4 and NO3, but doesn’t matter what I tried or how much I managed to get it down, it was up to the previous level 2-3 days after.



I feed 3-4 times a day, 3x flakes small portions, in the evening Mysis RS and I try to give Nori every day.



Filtration, skimmer, nice size refugium with macro algae, filter roller - half of the water goes through filter roller. UV 24/7 on slow flow, from time to time I run Ozone. I don’t do water changes.



Tank looks clean on the photos etc, but some of the softies are struggling, they are stressed, not opening fully, keeps shedding etc.



I started dosing from Monday to reduce NO3 and PO4:

• Prodibo digest bacteria
• Tropic Marin Elimi-NP
• Tropic Marin NP Bacto-Balance

What else could I do to improve the situation? Start water changes? What else would you suggest?



I attach the photos of the tank and ICP from today. Please help.

 

[MrGisonni]

Your reef looks great and your parameters are pretty much in line. Try some small regular water changes maybe to get your tace elements where you want them. And, BTW your nitrates and phosphates are a little on the low side at 5 ppm and .04 for softies and LPS IMHO.

 

[dawidmns]

Your reef looks great and your parameters are pretty much in line. Try some small regular water changes maybe to get your tace elements where you want them. And, BTW your nitrates and phosphates are a little on the low side at 5 ppm and .04 for softies and LPS IMHO.

Hi
5ppm and 0.04 is the desired lvl on the graph, my levels are extremely high po4 is 1.15 and no3 is 535. First ICP photo shows what each column represents.

 

[MrGisonni]

Hi
5ppm and 0.04 is the desired lvl on the graph, my levels are extremely high po4 is 1.15 and no3 is 535. First ICP photo shows what each column represents.

I would get your water tested again somewhere else. 535 mg/l is insanely high. 1.15 mg/l of phosphates maybe

 

[jda]

If your no3 really is over 500, that is probably a problem. You can see some nice tanks with some tolerant corals in the 100 ppm range, but I have never even really ever heard of 500+. My guess is that it is probably not that high, but still high nonetheless.

I would get the salinity to 35 ppt. That is an easy fix. Change some water and the rest of traces will trend back towards the mean - high ones come down and low ones come up.

po4 is not going to budge with water changes - there is likely a massive amount bound to the aragonite in your tank that is just waiting to release. You will need media or chemicals.

 

[dawidmns]

If your no3 really is over 500, that is probably a problem. You can see some nice tanks with some tolerant corals in the 100 ppm range, but I have never even really ever heard of 500+. My guess is that it is probably not that high, but still high nonetheless.

I would get the salinity to 35 ppt. That is an easy fix. Change some water and the rest of traces will trend back towards the mean - high ones come down and low ones come up.

po4 is not going to budge with water changes - there is likely a massive amount bound to the aragonite in your tank that is just waiting to release. You will need media or chemicals.

Thank you, I will start with water changes then and increasing the salinity to the correct lvl. I will try to test NO3 somewhere, I only have Salifert test which shows the max lvl on the colour chart.

With PO4, do you think these two will help or should I look for something else?

• Tropic Marin Elimi-NP
• Tropic Marin NP Bacto-Balance

 

[jda]

You cannot biologically lower your po4 at this level. GFO, Lanthanum Chloride or Aluminum Oxide will work the best. You might need a 5 gallon bucket of GFO. At this level, I would use Lanthanum Chloride into a filter sock at small doses a few times a day - this stuff is VERY effective and cheap. Make your own out of dry lanthanum chloride powder and don't waste money on the stuff made for reefers. There is a thread in the chemistry forum about this. As you remove po4 from the water, some will unbind from the rock/sand - this is why you saw the levels bounce back up. You just have to keep doing it and it will lower over time.

A bit of organic carbon dosing could work for the no3. If you are all the way up on Salifert, then I guess that it only matters that it is high and the number is meaningless. Water changes can help with no3 since there is not equivalent reservoir mechanism like there is for po4. With that high of level, it still not make much of a dent at first.

The water changes are more for the traces and stuff... and a bit for the nitrate.

 

[jda]

You can carbon dose with vinegar, vodka and sugar. No need to pay more for a substance from a reefing company. Dr. RHF has a few articles on this that are good. I do not carbon dose in a reef, so I am not much help other than to say that I trust him and his approach.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Who did this testing? Seems likely error prone. I don't trust it.

0 mS/cm for conductivity, and getting a thumbs down? Come on. That's just stupid as stupid can be. It's obviously incorrect. Same with the specific gravity. Zero is not even a theoretically possible value for any material, unless it is a virtual tank and consists of only photons.

i agree the 500+ ppm nitrate is likely a big issue, if real, but it's the highest I've ever seen in a reef tank, if real.

Bear in mind that lots of those red coded elements are one persons opinion. To flak 9.3 dKH as a thumbs down problem is quite excessive, IMO.

 

[dawidmns]

You cannot biologically lower your po4 at this level. GFO, Lanthanum Chloride or Aluminum Oxide will work the best. You might need a 5 gallon bucket of GFO. At this level, I would use Lanthanum Chloride into a filter sock at small doses a few times a day - this stuff is VERY effective and cheap. Make your own out of dry lanthanum chloride powder and don't waste money on the stuff made for reefers. There is a thread in the chemistry forum about this. As you remove po4 from the water, some will unbind from the rock/sand - this is why you saw the levels bounce back up. You just have to keep doing it and it will lower over time.

A bit of organic carbon dosing could work for the no3. If you are all the way up on Salifert, then I guess that it only matters that it is high and the number is meaningless. Water changes can help with no3 since there is not equivalent reservoir mechanism like there is for po4. With that high of level, it still not make much of a dent at first.

The water changes are more for the traces and stuff... and a bit for the nitrate.

Lanthanum Chloride or Aluminum Oxide - how safe is it to be used in the tank? I used Lanthanum Chloride and it really worked, but few people said to do not use it as it is not safe. However, I didnt use it in the filter sock or roller filter, I placed it directly into high flow.

I will look into chemistry forum, thank you.

For NO3, apart of water changes, should I do anything extra, or just stick to water changes, reduce po4 and see how it goes?

 

[dawidmns]

You can carbon dose with vinegar, vodka and sugar. No need to pay more for a substance from a reefing company. Dr. RHF has a few articles on this that are good. I do not carbon dose in a reef, so I am not much help other than to say that I trust him and his approach.

I am not fan of carbon dosing as anytime I tried it, it had negative impact on my corals. Some of the corals hate it and I tried different products including vodka on its own. So if I can avoid it and reduce the parameters in other way, then I would prefer it than carbon dosing.

 

[dawidmns]

Who did this testing? Seems likely error prone. I don't trust it.

0 mS/cm for conductivity, and getting a thumbs down? Come on. That's just stupid as stupid can be. It's obviously incorrect. Same with the specific gravity. Zero is not even a theoretically possible value for any material, unless it is a virtual tank and consists of only photons.

i agree the 500+ ppm nitrate is likely a big issue, if real, but it's the highest I've ever seen in a reef tank, if real.

Bear in mind that lots of those red coded elements are one persons opinion. To flak 9.3 dKH as a thumbs down problem is quite excessive, IMO.

It is Reef Zelements, UK company, not sure if it is in the US. Quite young company, in the previous ICP it showed my PO4 is perfect, even that other tests showed it isnt. But in the UK this is so far the only company that offer such a broad test, other companies do not test so many elements etc. The other one is in Austria, Oceamo which is quite good but very expensive.