No love for MH?

[garbled]

Love my Mh+t5, live in Scandinavia so the heat is a win win here!

I can't stress enough how true this is. When I converted from MH to LED, suddenly my heaters actually *ran*. When I converted from VHO to LED, again, heaters actually ran.

Prior to that, my heaters were merely decorative units I placed in the tank in case something weird happened. My power usage on the lights went way down, but my heat power usage went from zero to alot, so, be aware of that in a colder area. You might actually use more power with LEDs.

 

[vlangel]

I love the shimmer of halide lighting, however the price, energy usage and heat not so much. Now with LED/T5 hybrids, that is probably as good all round lighting available and a little less expensive to operate (especially when you factor in the heat issue and perhaps needing a chiller).

 

[Jay Norris]

I love the shimmer of halide lighting, however the price, energy usage and heat not so much. Now with LED/T5 hybrids, that is probably as good all round lighting available and a little less expensive to operate (especially when you factor in the heat issue and perhaps needing a chiller).

Hi, I also loved the shimmer of my M/H's, but the Mitra LX 7206 units I bought to replace my M/H's also have great shimmer, just as good as my M/H's.

 

[Sleepydoc]

I can't stress enough how true this is. When I converted from MH to LED, suddenly my heaters actually *ran*. When I converted from VHO to LED, again, heaters actually ran.

Prior to that, my heaters were merely decorative units I placed in the tank in case something weird happened. My power usage on the lights went way down, but my heat power usage went from zero to alot, so, be aware of that in a colder area. You might actually use more power with LEDs.

You should never use more power with LEDs, but your power usage may shift. If you need to heat the water, heaters are the most efficient means of heating the water, more efficient than lights.

Regarding the cost of bulb replacements, many people have commented on the cost of replacing LED fixtures every 4-6 years. Theoretically, there is no reason you should need to do this unless you have a driver burn out or some similar event, but what has been the case for a while is that there has been improvement in LEDs and fixtures, meaning there was at least a possible benefit to getting new lights. Of course if you're making a financial decision to switch and count on a 6 year return on investment but replace the lights at 4 years, you've increased your costs.

Similarly, as I mentioned before, not all fixtures are the same - the quality of the electronics and heat sink are important and a poorly designed fixture may die prematurely.

One of the attractions of LEDs for me is the fact that the light output is consistent and doesn't degrade over time like T5 & MH lights do, meaning I don't need to keep track of when I need to change my lights. Correction: Meaning I don't realize 6 months after the fact that I was due to replace them!

 

[fredk]

I think that everybody needs to come to grips with the possibility that LEDs are not changing anymore, or at least have not for a while. There has not been a significant change since going from blue-white to multi-colored diodes on more channels. I am not counting the human comforts like apps and wifi that are just window dressing. The only recent changes are just more and different multicolored diodes. Seriously, how are LED evolving and going to get better? There are still panels and pucks, both with gripes and irritations. There are no reflectors for better spread or color blending.
...

You are right that there are not the dramatic changes that have occurred in the past, but that is just a sign of a maturing market. Efficiency is still being pushed upwards. Again, not dramatically, but over time it makes a difference.

In the larger market, MH is dying out. 10 years ago that was the only lighting in our plant. It got replaced, first by T5 and now by LEDs. The cost savings for us were huge. In high bay applications, where a lot of the HID lighting is used, an LED that directs 100% of its output down has a huge advantage quite aside from the greater electrical efficiency.

We are a fairly progressive plant, so probably on the leading edge of a change over. As HID sales volumes in the larger market go down, the impact on specialty lighting will be felt more and more.

Most of the LED innovation is going on in phosphor converting white LEDs, so we don't necessarily see the full benefits in reef lighting where we rely mostly on low volume, specialty colour LEDs.

It may take a long time, but I expect HID lighting to eventually dissapear.

 

[Minireef30]

Just set up my new tank with 250w radiums and t5. Had led on my smaller 30g cube.Switched it back to 250w Phoenix before shutting it down during the move. My clam just didn't do well under LEDs.

 

[Humblefish]

Ain't no better light than a 20k Radium.

 

[Minireef30]

Also like others say, you are not saving money using LEDs if you are upgrading every few years. LED fixtures are really pricey for the small area they cover. In a few years I may try them again once the price starts to get reasonable.

 

[Reefinny]

Ain't no better light than a 20k Radium.

I agree. I am using the reefbrite twin arc on my display in the livingroom, Which dont get me wrong I like having the 10k in the day and the 20k afternoon and early evening on the DT but the 2 tanks in the basement I run 250w radium and a 400w radium on my 93 cube. The color is definitely more intense.

 

[DSC reef]

Ain't no better light than a 20k Radium.

Excited to see the 250watt on the M80 ballast

 

[jda]

It may take a long time, but I expect HID lighting to eventually dissapear.

I am inclined to agree in applications where the cut-down spectrum is of no consequence - like your plant or in my kitchen. However, the reinvestment in Mercury where full-spectrum is needed is also widespread. Just in Colorado where I appraise, there is not a single grow facility that is using LED anymore and all are back to HPS/MH - one of the facilities had stacks and stacks of grow LEDs in the corner and the guy said that I could have as many as I wanted. Around here, commercial growing is mostly Hippie Lettuce, but there is also basil, thyme, oregano, tomatoes, etc.

 

[surgeon1]

been running a reef for some sort since '89. had halides over a reef since somewhere in the early 90s. current tank is running 5 400 watt radiums but is slightly underlit. I will be adding diy leds to boost par and make the color more customizable and have an hour of "actinic" lighting at the beginning and end of the day like I had when I ran vhos with the halides. my complaint about most of the current led units is too much blue in the lights. I know that is the current fad on lighting but I cant stand looking at blue tanks. I know you can turn down the blue and up the whites but I find it irritating to have to not use a third or half of a lights capability just to get the look you like. also I do think that there is definitely room and the possibility of improvement in leds in the future. someone posted that there are either clusters or arrays and lenses but no reflectors on all the leds on the the market. I always wondered why no one has put out clusters with reflectors as a solution to the disco problems inherent to most led designs. I am considering building a very large planted tank or reef upgrade and as it stands today I would probably use 400 watt mhs over the center of the tank with supplemental leds to tweak the color. like many mh fans I live in the north, Wisconsin, so waste heat is not really waste here for about 9 months of the year. I too have bought a couple years of radium bulbs in case something were to happen to the supply chain. If they were to go on sale at the price I bought them for I would probably buy another 5 years worth of replacements. if anyone wants to complain about my electricity usage I would point out that I have a 40kw solar array on my barn so that will run all my lighting on my tanks.

 

[Humblefish]

Excited to see the 250watt on the M80 ballast

It's a little too blue, so you may need some white supplemental lighting.

 

[Sarah24!]

Hello,

I always find this topic as a endless debate lol. Personally I have not owned a t5 or mh on my own tank. The main reason is that the three lfs don’t carry anything but leds. Even if one was to ask, to special order etc they won’t. Getting advice on what to get on these is even more rare. When I first started I honestly didn’t have a clue that there were online forums. It also doesn’t help the fact that Idaho is 100 years behind most states in about everything.

When I was working with aquariums their huge 500 gallon tanks and larger they always used mh. The smaller ones I have seen mostly leds. But in all honesty, trying to figure out which light is better for a reef tank is trying to argue what’s better ford or Lincoln. (Yes I know they are both made by ford ). Yes there are some amazing aspects for each light, and kind of light. But true hobbyists, usually end up doing what they like the most.

If people want to tell me that my tanks looks horrible so what it looks horrible. But as long as I like it then who cares I don’t have to justify why I’m doing something. I don’t need to because I’m already doing it lol. If there comes a time that I want to change things then I can always do so.

I have seen some amazing tanks with every type of light out there and it’s neat to see how creative people can get. But again (and I’m only speaking idaho), your lucky to find a salt water store other than in Boise, not alone that they carry any supplies for t5 or mh. There is only one store that has an mh setup and they are (poseibly) switching over. So it does depend on where one lives, when I was in Seattle, yes there were options for the others. The only problem was they were not allowed in dorm rooms .

As a point of fact about the only thing really in common about these lights is the fact people enjoy saltwater reefs for what ever reason they have, (and they are all valid, from power growers to those who love the old school systems that work, to new techy things).

 

[fredk]

I am inclined to agree in applications where the cut-down spectrum is of no consequence - like your plant or in my kitchen. However, the reinvestment in Mercury where full-spectrum is needed is also widespread. Just in Colorado where I appraise, there is not a single grow facility that is using LED anymore and all are back to HPS/MH - one of the facilities had stacks and stacks of grow LEDs in the corner and the guy said that I could have as many as I wanted. Around here, commercial growing is mostly Hippie Lettuce, but there is also basil, thyme, oregano, tomatoes, etc.

Interesting. I was wondering about what direction MJ grow facilities were going. We're just ramping up here in Canada. That will help sustain the HID market, but I still think the vast majority of HID lighting is in warehousing/manufacturing and street lights.

 

[DSC reef]

It's a little too blue, so you may need some white supplemental lighting.

Thanks, I'll have to play with some T5 combos when we get the light.

 

[120reefkeeper]

I still use halides/T5. I don’t broadcast the fact I use them. I find it unnecessary to debate my light choices over others. I understand the pluses and minuses of using this selected path.

Over many many years I have found ways around the issues without using chillers etc. Don’t get me wrong , I love tech. I’ve implemented Apex systems and the like because I see the benefits of doing so. I have yet to see any added benefits of LED that I cannot compensate for using MH/T5.

It’s not about being old school or resistant to change. It’s about what works, what are your expectations, what challenges does it have, how does this make my life simpler.

 

[siggy]

Im happy with watt I currently have. If I'm lucky enough to retire who knows .

 

[EricTheRed]

I am in the "using it now" category. Running a Spectra with Radium's supplemented by Blue+ and Actinic T5s.

Same here. I've had everything lighting my tanks over the years and my Spectra combo is the best. I'm also running a Reefbrite XHO for some extra zing.

 

[reacclimating 2 the hobby]

I love my halides and have no problems with heat. The Cebu Sun fixture from Hamilton is a great light. Also running Radiums and four Hamilton sunpower t5s that came with it. I was going to go blue plus, but I like the look when the MH's aren't on just as much as when they are. So do my frags.