How to best emulate this beautiful tidepool lighting in an aquarium? Can it be done?

[oreo54]

I'm going to try some 10K bulbs. Maybe the 14K have a bit too much blue?

Color temp ratings of metal halides are iffy at best.. Any past say 10000k are likely not accurate. Been known for decades.

 

[X-37B]

Try an ushio 7k highlux grow light.
I ran one for awhile, actualy a 600 watt, on a frag system. Bright white!
Im all leds now.
I got a very good white daylight look, compairable to halides with 16hds. A coupe 64's would work.
Both lights on same system at different times.

 

[twentyleagues]

At 78" x 78" x 16" that is going to be an awful lot of LED fixtures.
420-ish gallons.
What are your other needs and wants?

Some of the old mh reflectors covered 36x36 so you would only need like 4 of them if you can find them.
I still think you should look more to fw leds though.
You will probably get more power out at the "color" you like.

Kessils are a bit of an exception w/ the "logic" thingy..
Tuna suns go from 6000k-9000k but I don't even particularly like them for even fw aquariums.
more of a long personal story but always felt their "dabbling" in fw was more of an afterthought than anything.

An older response from Kessil regarding the tuna blue

Kessil Color % and temperature

I’ve had my Kessil’s for over a year and still haven’t figured out color temperature based on percentage of color. I like the bluer look and have noticed colors in my tank do not like color variable raised over 50% and intensity peaking at 50%. I have a mixed Reef, and even when I slowly...

www.reef2reef.com

Thats bassackwards. Kessil said that? must have been a customer service person. They were horticultural light makers before fish tanks youd think they understand kelvin ratings. I've got 3 a160s tuna suns on my 125 planted fahaka tank, looks and works great.

 

[A. grandis]

Thank you! I do agree that these would look great. I had 250 watt 10K and T5 actinics many years ago and remember loving that look!
I was hoping to be able to mount the lights higher than 12" though. I would like to be able to look over the entire width/length of the tank's surface, top down viewing, without any lighting fixtures being in the way.

Application needs to be accordingly. The higher the fixture will be, much further from the water, the more wattage it will need to offer to achieve optimal desired results. It wouldn't translate quite as a higher tank if you place it too high. The distance from water surface to fixture using the Spectra is about 12" for best results of distribution in the system, using those type of reflectors within that design. Remember, they are not like most larger individual reflectors we had in the 90's. That's for the optimal, but you know halides are very forgiven! You could try also 400W lamps depending on how much highr you would place the fixtures from water surface.
OR... you could just make something to raise them all when you want to enjoy that the top down view.
Grow some extra Acros for me!
Cheers!

 

[A. grandis]

Try an ushio 7k highlux grow light.
I ran one for awhile, actualy a 600 watt, on a frag system. Bright white!
Im all leds now.
I got a very good white daylight look, compairable to halides with 16hds. A coupe 64's would work.
Both lights on same system at different times.

It would be so great if we still had that reflector available!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Seancj]

Thanks everyone for the replies and great advice/suggestions! I do very much appreciate all of your input and experiences! It's late here and I'm going to bed. I look forward to reading more productive posts in the morning. Again, please keep this discussion cordial! Appreciate you all very much!

 

[oreo54]

Thats bassackwards. Kessil said that? must have been a customer service person. They were horticultural light makers before fish tanks youd think they understand kelvin ratings. I've got 3 a160s tuna suns on my 125 planted fahaka tank, looks and works great.

That the Tuna Sun was 6000-9000k and the Tuna blue was 10000-"20000"K?
20000 in the "aquarium sense" of.. its a blue bulb..
Anyways "a" tuna sun chart.
See this is the thing I "believe' somewhere along the line of the tuna sun Kessil changed their fw diodes to have more red than in the past. This was an undocumented change. I have no proof of it but the older TS's were not as colorful as the newer TS's.

 

[twentyleagues]

That the Tuna Sun was 6000-9000k and the Tuna blue was 10000-"20000"K?
20000 in the "aquarium sense" of.. its a blue bulb..
Anyways "a" tuna sun chart.
See this is the thing I "believe' somewhere along the line of the tuna sun Kessil changed their fw diodes to have more red than in the past. This was an undocumented change. I have no proof of it but the older TS's were not as colorful as the newer TS's.

oh...no I think I misinterpreted the lower color % statement. I reread it and I get what they said now.

 

[twentyleagues]

That the Tuna Sun was 6000-9000k and the Tuna blue was 10000-"20000"K?
20000 in the "aquarium sense" of.. its a blue bulb..
Anyways "a" tuna sun chart.
See this is the thing I "believe' somewhere along the line of the tuna sun Kessil changed their fw diodes to have more red than in the past. This was an undocumented change. I have no proof of it but the older TS's were not as colorful as the newer TS's.

Mine are pretty old. I got 1 replaced about 4 years ago by Kessil. Well I had to pay it was out of warranty, but they cut me a deal. Looks just like the others dont know if you could tell the difference with the naked eye anyway. I am using the spectral controller too.

 

[oreo54]

Try an ushio 7k highlux grow light.
I ran one for awhile, actualy a 600 watt, on a frag system. Bright white!
Im all leds now.
I got a very good white daylight look, compairable to halides with 16hds. A coupe 64's would work.
Both lights on same system at different times.

USHIO HILUX GRO™ SUPER METAL HALIDE SINGLE-ENDED GROW LIGHT

HiLUX GRO™ Horticulture Lamps Professional Grade Grow Lights Professional growers will not use just any lamps to get just any results. They require specialty-grade lamps to maximize their growth and profits. This is why professionals choose USHIO, a Japanese specialty lighting manufacturer. The...

www.discountedhydroponics.com

Interesting bulb. Runs on hps ballasts.

 

[oreo54]

Maybe this is a bit to " clinical" but there is the real world then there is what we think is the real world.
They are often quite different
Anyways for fun

Soo doing some " research" for a different project I found some 6500k
Cobs. I mentioned them above and there is a spectrum chart. The bridgelux.
Well Digikey had some of the smaller ones available.
BXRE-65S0801-D-7x
5.8w (.350 x 16.7v)

$175.11/80
128 l/w
59392 lumens for 80
464 watts @350mA.

 

[Reefering1]

No, they’re not. Unless you’re ok with saying T5s are basically MHs, exaggeration but comparatively speaking, they are. Then sure, I guess I can see it.

More alike than not, I can agree with that..

 

[oreo54]

More alike than not, I can agree with that..

Huh ... Point light source vs 360 diffuse light.
So shadowless vs shadows/shimmer.
Practically zero output lower than 400nm for t5
Zero >800nm " heat" for t5 on the bulb side.
Sooo in some people's terms t5's are not " full spectrum" vs mh's.
Spectrum differences due to high pressure vs low pressure plasma.
Halide Salts vs tri- phosphors plus

The only thing they really have in common is they are both mercury based.

 

[oreo54]

Had to finish this ...

Drivers:
$38 x 8 = $304 US
Hlg-60H-C350B
100-200v dc out @ 350mA
Soo 10 cobs (166 volts) x 8 strips

Dumb 10v dimming and prefer AB version but it's $42 and you can only go lower in current than 350 but sort of a cheap way of dimming it (210-350 mA)

Digikey

LED's
$175.11 /80
10 per driver.
Digikey

HEAT SINK
60" x 1" heat sinks (8)
$110
Heatsink USA

$589 total plus shipping, wire, and thermal adhesive. Other than an apex or other 10v analog controller pretty well done.Output is equivalent to 1000 watts of mh and if calculated correctly at least 200 par @ 28"

95 plus cri 6500k array emulating daylight.
Can always add to it .
A few cyan/reg blue stars maybe.
There is 34v extra per driver .
Wouldn't go to 34v ( full 200) though
unless real world tested.
Besides tedious soldering of 80 cobs and mounting 8 bars nothing too difficult

 

[oreo54]

Probably beating a dead horse here but just one last "tidepool colored" led.
Now it's only 90W (would need to measure) and breaks the "high CRI" rule in favor of the "RGB rule" (not accurate color, R(f) under 100 but punchy, R(g) over 100) at full power.
BTW the "best" non-white utilizing LED arrays are more on the line of Red,Green,Blue, Amber.
Personally Red Blue PcAmber Cyan and Lime..
But that's for daylight rendering.
The Week Aqua was picked purely for the violet (400nm) content.
One thing though, I'm personally not convinced the 400nm's will last nearly as long as the other leds.
Well at full strength or so.

Week Aqua t90
$160

Name:T90 PRO
Size: 140x140mm
Light leads:100+10
Power: 90W RGB+UV
Color temperature: 9000~12000K
Luminous flux: 4950lm

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256806208521858.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.main.53.1ee226748UBfV3&algo_pvid=8b89e059-6f56-4e7a-9985-54d61f73d942&algo_exp_id=8b89e059-6f56-4e7a-9985-54d61f73d942-26&pdp_npi=4%40dis%21USD%2133.58%2133.24%21%21%21240.00%21237.60%21%402103135817070624918882694e02af%2112000037011576938%21sea%21US%210%21AB&curPageLogUid=bTgU0tzQ0RJl&utparam-url=scene%3Asearch%7Cquery_from%3A

Unfortunately to be the real color as measured here:

Spectral Data from a Shallow Hawaiian Tidepool

Dana Riddle previously documented and discussed light intensity of a Hawaiian tidepool versus the home aquarium. Dana continues his light analysis by examining spectral data. What can nature teach us about coral care?

reefs.com

Discussion​

Under the conditions of these experiments, it is obvious that corals within an aquarium can receive more blue light than in nature while being deficient in other colors. In this case, the corals received about 65% more blue light than in the shallow tidepool (this is based on the following data from the aquarium: 12-hour photoperiod at an intensity of ~250 µmol·m²·sec.)

you really need to up the cyan game. Blue green tint.. and one most seem to shy away from
Kyocera makes an "almost perfect" LED which uses a violet pump and RGB phosphors.
Unfortunately its for sale in Japan only and really no bells and whistles for the high price.

All my generated spectrums are subject to errors and should be considered more of an estimate than absolute.

 

[Seancj]

Thank you Oreo54! You put so much work into your suggestions! You are appreciated!

 

[BeanAnimal]

If you want to defend your personal preference for LEDs... or try to justify your LED purchase... cause no one can go against the truth that metal halides IS in FACT the best representation of sunlight over ANY aquarium!

My goodness the incessant brow beating of anybody who mentions the word "LED" is obnoxious. Your presence in any cordial lighting conversation has become insufferable. This coming from a MH fan.

 

[X-37B]

USHIO HILUX GRO™ SUPER METAL HALIDE SINGLE-ENDED GROW LIGHT

HiLUX GRO™ Horticulture Lamps Professional Grade Grow Lights Professional growers will not use just any lamps to get just any results. They require specialty-grade lamps to maximize their growth and profits. This is why professionals choose USHIO, a Japanese specialty lighting manufacturer. The...

www.discountedhydroponics.com

Interesting bulb. Runs on hps ballasts.

Yes its a conversion bulb. I ran it on an electronic ballast.

 

[A. grandis]

My goodness the brow beating of anybody who mentions the word "LED" is obnoxious. Your presence in any cordial lighting conversation has become insufferable. This coming from a MH fan.

Thanks, Bean. I know it's a great complement coming from you. LOL!
I do not care what you and anyone else think anymore.
Most people careless about what others think too.
People change all the time.
Everyone has the right to express their thoughts!
Everyone has their right to agree or not to anything.
And today most things are becoming more and more relative.
Experience and results dictate what you want.
Halides are the KING of reef lights IMHO.
I'm glad you are still a fan of them. Ha!
Thanks for your kind words as always.
By the way... I was very cordial in this thread!

 

[BeanAnimal]

Thanks, Bean. I know it's a great complement coming from you. LOL!
I do not care what you and anyone else think anymore.
Most people careless about what others think too.
People change all the time.
Everyone has the right to express their thoughts!
Everyone has their right to agree or not to anything.
And today most things are becoming more and more relative.
Experience and results dictate what you want.
Halides are the KING of reef lights IMHO.
I'm glad you are still a fan of them. Ha!
Thanks for your kind words as always.
By the way... I was very cordial in this thread!

Offering an opinion is fine, but pouncing on LED users and trying to beat them and every one around them to your viewpoint is tiresome. "King" or "best" or other superlative terms are all relative. Your criteria for "best" or "king" may differ, often wildly from the criteria of others. The only option here for the OP is not "metal halide or die" so let's not make this thread into that.