How to clean sump/ best way to water change w/ sump.

[Jordan berry]

I need to do a major water change tomorrow in my 90 gallon reef tank. Been dosing Dino x to get rid of my Dino problem. Now that it seems to be gone and my corals are upset I have a few questions. How would I clean out the brown dust that is all over the floor of my sump seems to be dead Dino? Should I just blow it up and let the filter sock/skimmer pick it up? Should I buy a wet vac and try to suck it out with the water change? When doing a water change is it best to take most from the sump and leave as much in the display tank as possible? Also how do ppl vacuum a sump on the floor when you can't siphon?

 

[robert]

Heres how I do it...

I shut of the return pump and let the main tank drian into the sump until the water in the main drops below the level of the overflow.
I leave the power heads on in the main to keep the water circulating.

I then use a small pump with 1/2" tubing attached to pump to pump water from the sump to the drain in the laundry room.

I use this pump like a vaccume cleaner getting all the deutritus out of the sump. If I stir up waste it stays in the sump water and the main never sees any of it.

I then fill my sump back up with rodi water and I mix my salt in the sump and to match whats in the main. I don't adjust any other levels - I don't match alk, calcium, ph or temperature - others may suggest this, but my sump only holds maybe 80 gallons while my display is 400 so I don't bother.

I then turn the return back on untill the tank is full and the overflow just starts to run...this puts maybe 1/3 of the new sump water into the main. I then switch off and let the power heads in the main mix the new water with the old in the display for 10 minutes or so and the main water drfains back to the sump. I then repeat the process. On the third fill I leave everything running.

If I'm also going to vac the main, Then the initial process is the same, except before I add the rodi and mix salt, I use a siphon from the main into the sump to clean the bottom of the main. I then do the sump vac again to get the excess siphon water out. This means I have to mix more salt and rodi in the sump - to replace the siphoned water - and then do the fill process.

You never want to stir a cloud of deutritus in the main.

After the water has been replaced and everything is running, I use a flocculant to get any organics out of the watrer column.

For my tank I use a couple of tablespoons of bentonite clay shaken up in tank water to do this. Others will use coral snow or something like seachem clarity. I use the bentonite sold at health food stores - its made by a company called great plains and is food grade. works great = really makes the water clear.

If your tracking levels - alk, ph and so forth...this is the point where you would want to make whatever adjustments you need.
I'm an infrequent tester - I check alk more frequently and calcium less frequently - usually based on how stuff looks. But I always check TDS of the rodi on every refill.

As a final step - I add sechem prime to the tank appropriate for the amount of water I have replaced as a precaution against a potential spike after the change. It isn't required - but I do it.

I'm sure this is full of typos - sorry, I'm being too lazy to proof tonight. Let me know if this doesn't make sense in any way and I'll try to clear it up...

 

[TheEngineer]

One cool trick I've seen is to siphon through a filter sock and back into the tank. Say you want to remove some detritus from the display, you can run a siphon into a filter sock sitting in your sump. This way you pull out the big stuff and leave the water level alone. It gives you a chance to remove the junk and take your time doing it without worrying about how much water you are pulling out.

I don't dose, so I can't comment on procedures for that. @robert seems to have given you a pretty thorough explanation of that.

 

[robert]

Yes - I forgot to mention that - good catch - thanks ice -

 

[Harold Green]

Robert you've probably been using this method for years without issue but I'd be hesitant to mix fresh salt water in the sump and use it right away. Must be pretty good salt because it usually takes many hours for my salt mix to totally dissolve to the point where the salinity is finished changing. I designed my ato so I can change a couple of valves and pump straight from my salt water holding tank. That way I can siphon from my display and the ato system pumps replacement salt water in maintaining the water level with the pumps running all the while.

 

[Jordan berry]

Thanks guys. I have a 2100 gph pump I use to mix water/ pump it back. Do you mean to stir up the detritus in the sump after the return pump is off and use a pump like that to pull out the cloudy water? Should I never replace the water straight into the display tank and just make my adjustments in the sump?

 

[robert]

Robert you've probably been using this method for years without issue but I'd be hesitant to mix fresh salt water in the sump and use it right away. Must be pretty good salt because it usually takes many hours for my salt mix to totally dissolve to the point where the salinity is finished changing. I designed my ato so I can change a couple of valves and pump straight from my salt water holding tank. That way I can siphon from my display and the ato system pumps replacement salt water in maintaining the water level with the pumps running all the while.

Your right to point out the importance of ensuring that the salt mix is totally disolved...Since I use the sump and don't have premade rodi water, (I make the rodi stright into the sump) it takes a while. - a couple of hours. I have an evolution rodi system that is rated at 1000 gallons/day otherwie making and mixing in the sump would not be practical.

And I mix in the salt in small batches making sure its fairly welll disolved between additions...I prsently am using IO reef crystals - but I've used others - different salts dissolve at different rates...The only thing I do with all the mixes is to always ensure the sump water stays hypo-salinic (low salt content) until all the water is made...then I correct it up. If it gets too salty along the way you'll get components of the salt mix that don't want to dissolve as easily.

Before I got the oversized rodi unit, I had to make water well in advance - which requres more planning and holding tanks....when I was set up that way I used the simultaineous drain and fill method you describe.

 

[robert]

Thanks guys. I have a 2100 gph pump I use to mix water/ pump it back. Do you mean to stir up the detritus in the sump after the return pump is off and use a pump like that to pull out the cloudy water? Should I never replace the water straight into the display tank and just make my adjustments in the sump?

I use a smallish pump to drain the sump...just enough to drive a good flow through the 1/2" tubing to the sink.

I hold this pump (attached an running) and use its intake to directly suck up the deutritus pockets...I try not to stir things up any more than is necessary. This makes it easier to see what I'm doing and it is a good idea generally to avoid gooping up the water too much.

When the heavy pockets have been vaccumed out and most of the water is gone, I use nitril gloves and my hand to rub and dislodge anything I couldn't get with the pump directly. I let this get carried out with the remaing water. It doesn't have to be perfect.

You can pump new water back to the display directly if you want or need to. I've done it many times. Generally though I will pump new water into the sump where it gets diluted with tank water before going into the display.

You know you've done it right when your corals don't react at all to the water change. If you see a feeding response from the corals its a sign you stired up the deutritus a bit more than you want.

 

[ReefMadScientist]

Shop Vac

 

[Harold Green]

Robert thanks for clearing that up. I was afraid someone would pump undissolved salt into their display or destroy their refusium by a sudden change in salinity.

 

[Jordan berry]

Well I haven't done it right yet. I even blew my pink zipper zoas into the sand by turning on the return pump after letting the nozzles siphon when I shut down the return pump making a waterfall. This helped though and I think next time I will get it right. Assuming dino doesn't come back I will do 10-15 percent water changes weekly directly out of and into the sump with pre mixed and heated water.

 

[robert]

The first couple of times is all about learning how not to do it...it gets easier.
Congrats and good luck - I have some horror stories about my water changes...