Major problems with overflow

[gtbarsi]

A couple of thoughts:
1. Spaflex or other Flexible PVC may be the way to go instead of using hard line given the length of your runs. It lets you do gentle bends w/o having to use PVC fittings, it has the same dimensions ID and OD, and you glue it just like regular PVC. It may let you get around drilling through large load bearing beams.
2. After re-running your drain line if you have a lot of bubbles / splashing in the sump consider adding a reverse durso to your drain, it will provide a place for the Air to escape w/o having to drive it below the water line. Basically you add T to the bottom of your return line. The T is rotated so that the water can flow straight down, and you have one outlet to the side (90 degrees from the return). You attach a 90 degree fitting to the the T so that it now is pointing back up. Add a length of pipe to that (so that it is well above the water level in the sump) with a cap and a small hole and most of the air will escape through. You will have to play with the length of the pipe and the size of the hole.

Hopefully this will help your tame your drain!

 

[ryleary]

A couple of thoughts:
1. Spaflex or other Flexible PVC may be the way to go instead of using hard line given the length of your runs. It lets you do gentle bends w/o having to use PVC fittings, it has the same dimensions ID and OD, and you glue it just like regular PVC. It may let you get around drilling through large load bearing beams.
2. After re-running your drain line if you have a lot of bubbles / splashing in the sump consider adding a reverse durso to your drain, it will provide a place for the Air to escape w/o having to drive it below the water line. Basically you add T to the bottom of your return line. The T is rotated so that the water can flow straight down, and you have one outlet to the side (90 degrees from the return). You attach a 90 degree fitting to the the T so that it now is pointing back up. Add a length of pipe to that (so that it is well above the water level in the sump) with a cap and a small hole and most of the air will escape through. You will have to play with the length of the pipe and the size of the hole.

Hopefully this will help your tame your drain!

Thank you for the advice, I will be upset if I go through all this plumbing again and I still have splashing and bubbling issues. At least I know know something can be done after the fact.

 

[redfishbluefish]

After looking at your pictures, you'll need to redo your drain pipe. Right from Glass-Holes.....do not reduce pipe size or include any valves. That should be 1 1/2 inch pipe all the way down to the sump.

 

[ryleary]

After looking at your pictures, you'll need to redo your drain pipe. Right from Glass-Holes.....do not reduce pipe size or include any valves. That should be 1 1/2 inch pipe all the way down to the sump.

What about unions?

 

[redfishbluefish]

What about unions?

Unions are fine as long as they are the same size as the pipe.


HERE are the instructions and below is the part about plumbing stuff....which is in large bolded font in the insturctions:

"This plumbing should consist of the minimum of fittings needed, and no valves, or fittings smaller than the pipe size of the kit you purchased. If you have a nano series kit, this would be 1” PVC plumbing all the way to the sump, for 700 and 1500, this is 1 1/2”, and for the 3000 kits, this is 2” plumbing. Do not combine dual drains. Avoid long horizontal pipe runs. Do not use insert (barb) adaptors in the elbows. Do not use anything other than PVC pipe or UltraFlex PVC pipe. The kits will not work properly with smaller or restricted plumbing!!!!"

 

[ryleary]

Unions are fine as long as they are the same size as the pipe.


HERE are the instructions and below is the part about plumbing stuff....which is in large bolded font in the insturctions:

"This plumbing should consist of the minimum of fittings needed, and no valves, or fittings smaller than the pipe size of the kit you purchased. If you have a nano series kit, this would be 1†PVC plumbing all the way to the sump, for 700 and 1500, this is 1 1/2â€, and for the 3000 kits, this is 2†plumbing. Do not combine dual drains. Avoid long horizontal pipe runs. Do not use insert (barb) adaptors in the elbows. Do not use anything other than PVC pipe or UltraFlex PVC pipe. The kits will not work properly with smaller or restricted plumbing!!!!"

I grabbed 1.5" unions but they do come in a little bit. It's not exactly 1.5, should I skip em?

 

[gtbarsi]

I grabbed 1.5" unions but they do come in a little bit. It's not exactly 1.5, should I skip em?

Personally I would put a ball valve and then a union. That way you can shut off the return and disconnect it for servicing the sump, or tank, or just so you can clean the drain line.

 

[ryleary]

Personally I would put a ball valve and then a union. That way you can shut off the return and disconnect it for servicing the sump, or tank, or just so you can clean the drain line.

That's what I would prefer to do, but I was told that that's a big no no on the drain.

 

[redfishbluefish]

I grabbed 1.5" unions but they do come in a little bit. It's not exactly 1.5, should I skip em?

If you look in a union, it would appear as if it narrows down. That narrowed portion is simply the "stop" for the pipe. The hole in the middle should be 1 1/2 inches, or darn near that. I've got unions on my Glass-Holes and don't have any issues. Been running since 2008.

 

[ryleary]

If you look in a union, it would appear as if it narrows down. That narrowed portion is simply the "stop" for the pipe. The hole in the middle should be 1 1/2 inches, or darn near that. I've got unions on my Glass-Holes and don't have any issues. Been running since 2008.

Yeah that's what I was talking about, its just a stop for the pipe. I just got an email from glass holes saying that there should be absolutely nothing on the drain line, it was just making me nervous. I have all sorts of bubbling and gurgling now if I open up the drain all the way, but I believe that's because of the reduction to 1 inch. So I'm going to replumb it to 1 and a half inches.

 

[gtbarsi]

That's what I would prefer to do, but I was told that that's a big no no on the drain.

Unions as well as full port ball valves allow 100% flow and are OK on drain lines. You do not want to use the valve to throttle the flow unless you have a setup with multiple drains and one is intended to be running at full siphon. The shutoff valve should only be used once the return pump has been turned off and the water has been allowed to stabilize between the tank and the sump. At that point you can close the valve. Additionally you have to insure that it open before starting your return pump. Failing to do this can result in flooding your tank.

In theory you could just have the union, once the tank and sump were stabilized there will not be any water running down the drain line. However if you had to put something in to the DT while the line was disconnected it would cause more water to go down the drain, so I like to have the option to shut off the drain.

 

[ryleary]

Unions as well as full port ball valves allow 100% flow and are OK on drain lines. You do not want to use the valve to throttle the flow unless you have a setup with multiple drains and one is intended to be running at full siphon. The shutoff valve should only be used once the return pump has been turned off and the water has been allowed to stabilize between the tank and the sump. At that point you can close the valve. Additionally you have to insure that it open before starting your return pump. Failing to do this can result in flooding your tank.

In theory you could just have the union, once the tank and sump were stabilized there will not be any water running down the drain line. However if you had to put something in to the DT while the line was disconnected it would cause more water to go down the drain, so I like to have the option to shut off the drain.

Yeah, I would rather use the ball valve and have a means of shutoff. It looks like when its fully open, there is no restriction, even less than the union. So I will add it after the union, but I will never use it to throttle down the drain.


So another question, I added a shrimp to my tank 2 days ago, and in order to replumb the drain, I need to drain most of the water to move the tank. Should I wait until the tank cycles, or drain most of the water and replumb now?

 

[gtbarsi]

Might as well, by the time your tank cycles you are going to have high nitrates, that you will need to do a large water change to address.

 

[ryleary]

Might as well, by the time your tank cycles you are going to have high nitrates, that you will need to do a large water change to address.

Allright, so I'll let the cycle happen and when I do the big water change I'll replumb. Thanks for all your help, this forum is saving my life.

 

[ryleary]

Might as well, by the time your tank cycles you are going to have high nitrates, that you will need to do a large water change to address.

So I believe my tank has cycled, had an ammonia spike and now my nitrates and ammonia are at 0. Nitrites are around 5 ppm.

When waiting I tried installing a reverse durso for my sump to quiet down the drain and reduce the bubbles. I just have a feeling it's not the 1" reducer causing the problem.

It definitely worked, where I can now have the drain ball valve full open and the pump all the way open. I do have a trickling sound that I can live with but I think the problem is actually my return pump. It's a mag 12 and at the 10' head and few 45s I think it's doing around 500gph. My overflow is 700gph so I believe the noise is because of the box not filling up fast enough. Should I try swapping my mag 12 for an 18? Are they that much bigger than the 12s? The 12 barley fits in my sump.

Anywho here's a pic of the reverse durso. I also had to add some filter sponges to the box to slow down the flow through it to reduce noise. Is that bad? Could those clog it up?

 

[ryleary]

Anyone?

 

[AZDesertRat]

I have never seen a standpipe on the sump end of an overflow before. I have always dumped straight into my sump under the surface so there is no restrictions or fittings to contend with. The Durso is causing a big restriction as evidenced by the water pouring out of the clear tube stuck in the cap, if it were not restricting that tube would be sucking in air to mix with the water.

 

[ryleary]

I have never seen a standpipe on the sump end of an overflow before. I have always dumped straight into my sump under the surface so there is no restrictions or fittings to contend with. The Durso is causing a big restriction as evidenced by the water pouring out of the clear tube stuck in the cap, if it were not restricting that tube would be sucking in air to mix with the water.

I googled noisy sump bubbles and many people have used the reverse durso and it definitely helped.

I just think my pump is underpowered, I have it full open and the drain gurgles. If I close up the drain line a little bit (I know that's bad) I can get it dead silent.
I think I'll be fiddling with this for a long time to come.

 

[Fin]

If those are filter sponges you have wrapped around the end of your drain line, that probably won't end well. Once those stop up, the pump will continue to supply water to the tank, but once your drain stops up, it will be water over the side of the aquarium. I would remove that pretty quickly. That's what it looks like in the pic anyway. I might be wrong.

 

[ryleary]

If those are filter sponges you have wrapped around the end of your drain line, that probably won't end well. Once those stop up, the pump will continue to supply water to the tank, but once your drain stops up, it will be water over the side of the aquarium. I would remove that pretty quickly. That's what it looks like in the pic anyway. I might be wrong.

The filter sponges are in the overflow box, not at the end of the drain. The glass holes overflow kit came with some type of filter medium that goes in the box so I figured it wouldn't be that bad to add a little more . I plan on cleaning them from time to time.